tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by DWags on Mon 9 Jan 2017 - 13:17

LooseGoose wrote:
The_Dude wrote:Its crazy how Dantonio cant recruit high level RBs when all he does is feed them the ball and hes had success putting them in the league.

Yeah this Scott kid sucks.

So does Langford.  Don't for get him, he was a waste, and before him that Bell kid blew. Three kids, in a row going to the league. He sucks at finding running backs.

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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by NigelUno on Mon 9 Jan 2017 - 13:26

DWags wrote:
LooseGoose wrote:

Yeah this Scott kid sucks.

So does Langford.  Don't for get him, he was a waste, and before him that Bell kid blew. Three kids, in a row going to the league. He sucks at finding running backs.

And Baker...and Caper.

But...you know...he doesn't follow recruiting.
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by The_Dude on Mon 9 Jan 2017 - 13:28

DWags wrote:
LooseGoose wrote:

Yeah this Scott kid sucks.

So does Langford.  Don't for get him, he was a waste, and before him that Bell kid blew.  Three kids, in a row going to the league.  He sucks at finding running backs.  

Thats my point.  He's put guys in the league, why cant he recruit any?

Dantonio has landed one good RB since 2010. Mind boggling.
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by DWags on Mon 9 Jan 2017 - 13:29

NigelUno wrote:
DWags wrote:

So does Langford.  Don't for get him, he was a waste, and before him that Bell kid blew. Three kids, in a row going to the league. He sucks at finding running backs.

And Baker...and Caper.

But...you know...he doesn't follow recruiting.

He doesn't care that he's a dumb ass either. Now, we'll be called sunshine optimists because we've just pointed out There are 4 of 5 running backs who made the league, (capers was damn good too). the same guys will say we are blowing sunshine for pointing out great college backs. And so it goes.

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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by The_Dude on Mon 9 Jan 2017 - 13:31

DWags wrote:
NigelUno wrote:

And Baker...and Caper.

But...you know...he doesn't follow recruiting.

He doesn't care that he's a dumb ass either. Now, we'll be called sunshine optimists because we've just pointed out There are 4 of 5 running backs who made the league, (capers was damn good too). the same guys will say we are blowing sunshine for pointing out great college backs. And so it goes.

Are you stupid?

Thats my fucking point you idiot. Hes put guys in the NFL, has had now 7 straight classes with only one good RB (Scott, who lacks speed to be an elite back).

We keep hearing getting to the league is the #1 priority for recruits...and he cant land guys (RBs, CBs) with that track record is crazy.
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by NigelUno on Mon 9 Jan 2017 - 13:57

DWags wrote:
NigelUno wrote:

And Baker...and Caper.

But...you know...he doesn't follow recruiting.

He doesn't care that he's a dumb ass either. Now, we'll be called sunshine optimists because we've just pointed out There are 4 of 5 running backs who made the league, (capers was damn good too). the same guys will say we are blowing sunshine for pointing out great college backs. And so it goes.

DANTONIO CAN'T RECRUIT HIGH LEVEL RB's!!!

(Backtracking ensues)
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by Clarett's Folly on Mon 9 Jan 2017 - 14:03

The_Dude wrote:
DWags wrote:

He doesn't care that he's a dumb ass either. Now, we'll be called sunshine optimists because we've just pointed out There are 4 of 5 running backs who made the league, (capers was damn good too). the same guys will say we are blowing sunshine for pointing out great college backs. And so it goes.

Are you stupid?

Thats my fucking point you idiot. Hes put guys in the NFL, has had now 7 straight classes with only one good RB (Scott, who lacks speed to be an elite back).

We keep hearing getting to the league is the #1 priority for recruits...and he cant land guys (RBs, CBs) with that track record is crazy.

The flaw in that thinking is that, by this criteria, Mark Dantonio gets more credit for signing the bustiest bust who ever busted, Derrick Green, than for signing all-everything tote game stud LeVeon Bell.
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by NigelUno on Mon 9 Jan 2017 - 14:10

Clarett's Folly wrote:
The_Dude wrote:

Are you stupid?

Thats my fucking point you idiot. Hes put guys in the NFL, has had now 7 straight classes with only one good RB (Scott, who lacks speed to be an elite back).

We keep hearing getting to the league is the #1 priority for recruits...and he cant land guys (RBs, CBs) with that track record is crazy.

The flaw in that thinking is that, by this criteria, Mark Dantonio gets more credit for signing the bustiest bust who ever busted, Derrick Green, than for signing all-everything tote game stud LeVeon Bell.

And another flaw would be believing the Dude when he says he doesn't follow recruiting.
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by DWags on Mon 9 Jan 2017 - 14:36

NigelUno wrote:
DWags wrote:

He doesn't care that he's a dumb ass either. Now, we'll be called sunshine optimists because we've just pointed out There are 4 of 5 running backs who made the league, (capers was damn good too). the same guys will say we are blowing sunshine for pointing out great college backs. And so it goes.

DANTONIO CAN'T RECRUIT HIGH LEVEL RB's!!!

(Backtracking ensues)

I don't understand him half the time, but I think he means "high number of star" running backs not "High level" running backs. Clearly, he's taken by the stars and not the fact we hae NFL running backs. Again, I'm blowing sunshine.

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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by DWags on Mon 9 Jan 2017 - 14:38

Clarett's Folly wrote:
The_Dude wrote:

Are you stupid?

Thats my fucking point you idiot. Hes put guys in the NFL, has had now 7 straight classes with only one good RB (Scott, who lacks speed to be an elite back).

We keep hearing getting to the league is the #1 priority for recruits...and he cant land guys (RBs, CBs) with that track record is crazy.

The flaw in that thinking is that, by this criteria, Mark Dantonio gets more credit for signing the bustiest bust who ever busted, Derrick Green, than for signing all-everything tote game stud LeVeon Bell.

He's obviously looking for stars and not quality.

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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by tGreenWay on Mon 9 Jan 2017 - 14:42

DWags wrote:
Clarett's Folly wrote:

The flaw in that thinking is that, by this criteria, Mark Dantonio gets more credit for signing the bustiest bust who ever busted, Derrick Green, than for signing all-everything tote game stud LeVeon Bell.

He's obviously looking for stars and not quality.

That's the nut of the disagreement, right there. When MD wants a RB, it says he thinks you have potential to be a successful college back, which also means, by extension, that the player has potential to get to the pros. All the douche wants are the RBs with the highest number of stars, and not getting them is a failure.


Edit: I continue to be fascinated by how much the douche can post about these things, given how little attention he pays to recruiting.
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by Steve81 on Mon 9 Jan 2017 - 15:24

I can't wait to hear that we got a verbal. Seems like it has been forever.
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by Nordic on Mon 9 Jan 2017 - 16:32

DWags wrote:
NigelUno wrote:

DANTONIO CAN'T RECRUIT HIGH LEVEL RB's!!!

(Backtracking ensues)

I don't understand him half the time, but I think he means "high number of star" running backs not "High level" running backs. Clearly, he's taken by the stars and not the fact we hae NFL running backs. Again, I'm blowing sunshine.

Starzzzzzz!!!!!
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by Herbie Green on Mon 9 Jan 2017 - 17:07

What I find more frustrating is how bad MSU's rushing stats are with all this NFL talent. Is that because of playcalling? Scheme? Offensive line? We have had great qb play and low sack numbers to my knowledge
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by Steve81 on Mon 9 Jan 2017 - 17:37

Herbie Green wrote:What I find more frustrating is how bad MSU's rushing stats are with all this NFL talent. Is that because of playcalling? Scheme? Offensive line? We have had great qb play and low sack numbers to my knowledge
Seems to me that we run a lot on 1st and 2nd downs. There are good and bad things about that. I don't see Dantonio changing.
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by Nordic on Mon 9 Jan 2017 - 17:39

Herbie Green wrote:What I find more frustrating is how bad MSU's rushing stats are with all this NFL talent. Is that because of playcalling? Scheme? Offensive line? We have had great qb play and low sack numbers to my knowledge

Offensive stats need to be put into perspective of offensive tempo. Regurgitating stats outside of context of the team's tempo and playing style is foolish.

That said our rushing #s have sucked the last two years. They absolutely should be better.

However, this is also myopic. Langord had back-to-back ~1500 yard rushing years and as a team was over 2500 total yds rushing combined. Bell 1700 the year before. Bell + Baker combined for 1700 the year before that.

The last two years we've been at ~2000 total rushing yards. Not enough for our style of play and tempo. Needs to be in the 2500+ yd range IMO. We got away with it in 2015 because we had Cook. Last year our QB situation was an abortion.
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by Herbie Green on Mon 9 Jan 2017 - 19:19

Nordic wrote:
Herbie Green wrote:What I find more frustrating is how bad MSU's rushing stats are with all this NFL talent. Is that because of playcalling? Scheme? Offensive line? We have had great qb play and low sack numbers to my knowledge

Offensive stats need to be put into perspective of offensive tempo. Regurgitating stats outside of context of the team's tempo and playing style is foolish.

That said our rushing #s have sucked the last two years. They absolutely should be better.

However, this is also myopic. Langord had back-to-back ~1500 yard rushing years and as a team was over 2500 total yds rushing combined. Bell 1700 the year before. Bell + Baker combined for 1700 the year before that.

The last two years we've been at ~2000 total rushing yards. Not enough for our style of play and tempo. Needs to be in the 2500+ yd range IMO. We got away with it in 2015 because we had Cook. Last year our QB situation was an abortion.

Do you have a link to these tempo stats? Wouldn't yards per rush be a tempo stat?

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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by FupaTuba on Mon 9 Jan 2017 - 19:49

Cassius Peat will be back. That's good news
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by The_Dude on Mon 9 Jan 2017 - 20:37

FupaTuba wrote:Cassius Peat will be back. That's good news

Is it?
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by Nordic on Mon 9 Jan 2017 - 21:44

Herbie Green wrote:
Nordic wrote:

Offensive stats need to be put into perspective of offensive tempo. Regurgitating stats outside of context of the team's tempo and playing style is foolish.

That said our rushing #s have sucked the last two years. They absolutely should be better.

However, this is also myopic. Langord had back-to-back ~1500 yard rushing years and as a team was over 2500 total yds rushing combined. Bell 1700 the year before. Bell + Baker combined for 1700 the year before that.

The last two years we've been at ~2000 total rushing yards. Not enough for our style of play and tempo. Needs to be in the 2500+ yd range IMO.  We got away with it in 2015 because we had Cook. Last year our QB situation was an abortion.

Do you have a link to these tempo stats?  Wouldn't yards per rush be a tempo stat?


YPR would be somewhat of tempo equalizer...but any stat looked at in a vacuum is silly.  Honestly, I don't give a shit enough to find 'tempo' stats. But if you watch a lick of college football, you know the difference between tempo teams (Texas Tech, Baylor, Memphis....hell now Vtech) and non-tempo teams (MSU, Iowa, etc.). Texas Tech is probably the quickest tempo team in CF (but I could be wrong) and look at their D stats.

And tempo doesn't mean spread, though the two usually go hand and hand.

Our run game has sucked the last two years. But not the previous 5. Bottomline.
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by LooseGoose on Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 12:33

Preferred Walk on:

Brent Mossburg

Inside Linebacker

Ht 6-3 Wt 205 CLASS OF 17


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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by tGreenWay on Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 12:39

LooseGoose wrote:Preferred Walk on:

Brent Mossburg

Inside Linebacker

Ht 6-3 Wt 205 CLASS OF 17


I always liked his opening line: "You are looking live..."

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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by tanfan! on Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 12:52

I see the new weight room is attracting zilly recruits! Moar preferred walk ons please!

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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by The_Dude on Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 12:54

tanfan! wrote:I see the new weight room is attracting zilly recruits! Moar preferred walk ons please!

2 star diamonds in the rough Rolling Eyes
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by Floyd Robertson on Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 13:24

tGreenWay wrote:
LooseGoose wrote:Preferred Walk on:

Brent Mossburg

Inside Linebacker

Ht 6-3 Wt 205 CLASS OF 17


I always liked his opening line: "You are looking live..."

Bahahaha
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by Herbie Green on Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 13:30

Steve81 wrote:
Herbie Green wrote:What I find more frustrating is how bad MSU's rushing stats are with all this NFL talent. Is that because of playcalling? Scheme? Offensive line? We have had great qb play and low sack numbers to my knowledge
Seems to me that we run a lot on 1st and 2nd downs. There are good and bad things about that. I don't see Dantonio changing.

I think this has a lot more to do with it. When MSU had Ringer and Bell it seemed we spent the majority of downs running into a brick wall and we put up mediocre team rushing stats despite having NFL backs that were putting up big individual numbers. Langford era seemed better.

I guess I will have to do more research, but I am guessing you see Wisconsin ranking consistently high in rushing stats and that is the kind of team MSU aspires to be with "Pound green pound" and all the rhetoric. But in reality I think we are a team designed to run the football that doesn't actually run the football very well.

I think a lot of offensive deficiencies got masked by having a great defenses.
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by The_Dude on Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 13:34

DWags wrote:
Clarett's Folly wrote:

The flaw in that thinking is that, by this criteria, Mark Dantonio gets more credit for signing the bustiest bust who ever busted, Derrick Green, than for signing all-everything tote game stud LeVeon Bell.

He's obviously looking for stars and not quality.

Stars basically equal quality, unless you are going to argue exceptions are the norm.

I wonder where Bama, Clemson, FSU and OUs (the big bowl game winners) recruiting classes have ranked.
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by Herbie Green on Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 13:50

The_Dude wrote:
DWags wrote:

He's obviously looking for stars and not quality.

Stars basically equal quality, unless you are going to argue exceptions are the norm.

I wonder where Bama, Clemson, FSU and OUs (the big bowl game winners) recruiting classes have ranked.

I can tell you that Clemson's ranked behind Ohio State's and Alabama's.
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by LooseGoose on Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 14:03

Weak-Side Defensive End

Ht 6-4 Wt 235 CLASS OF 17

Will Rodgers

1st Cousin of Jason Richardson


1/27 visit

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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by Clarett's Folly on Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 16:06

The_Dude wrote:
DWags wrote:

He's obviously looking for stars and not quality.

Stars basically equal quality, unless you are going to argue exceptions are the norm.

I wonder where Bama, Clemson, FSU and OUs (the big bowl game winners) recruiting classes have ranked.

Did you know that in last year's NFL Draft there were as many former 2-or-below stars taken in the first round (Butler, Wentz, Conklin, Doctson) as there were former 5 stars (Hargraves, Tunsill, Treadwell, Nkemdiche)?
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by The_Dude on Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 19:06

Clarett's Folly wrote:
The_Dude wrote:

Stars basically equal quality, unless you are going to argue exceptions are the norm.

I wonder where Bama, Clemson, FSU and OUs (the big bowl game winners) recruiting classes have ranked.

Did you know that in last year's NFL Draft there were as many former 2-or-below stars taken in the first round (Butler, Wentz, Conklin, Doctson) as there were former 5 stars (Hargraves, Tunsill, Treadwell, Nkemdiche)?

Read what you said, then think critically about it for a bit. I'll check back in later to see if you realized how stupid that comment was in the context you put it.
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by Clarett's Folly on Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 19:22

The_Dude wrote:
Clarett's Folly wrote:

Did you know that in last year's NFL Draft there were as many former 2-or-below stars taken in the first round (Butler, Wentz, Conklin, Doctson) as there were former 5 stars (Hargraves, Tunsill, Treadwell, Nkemdiche)?

Read what you said, then think critically about it for a bit. I'll check back in later to see if you realized how stupid that comment was in the context you put it.

Is it stupid because it punches a big fat hole in your argument?
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by Floyd Robertson on Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 19:28

The_Dude wrote:
Clarett's Folly wrote:

Did you know that in last year's NFL Draft there were as many former 2-or-below stars taken in the first round (Butler, Wentz, Conklin, Doctson) as there were former 5 stars (Hargraves, Tunsill, Treadwell, Nkemdiche)?

Read what you said, then think critically about it for a bit. I'll check back in later to see if you realized how stupid that comment was in the context you put it.

You're going to try to sell the argument that those equal numbers are somehow representative of the distribution of star rankings in CFB when the are probably enough five stars to fill the entire first round?
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by DWags on Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 20:04

Floyd Robertson wrote:
The_Dude wrote:

Read what you said, then think critically about it for a bit. I'll check back in later to see if you realized how stupid that comment was in the context you put it.

You're going to try to sell the argument that those equal numbers are somehow representative of the distribution of star rankings in CFB when the are probably enough five stars to fill the entire first round?

He doesn't follow recruiting. He doesn't know stars.

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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by Nordic on Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 20:07

tDude is saying that there are far less 5 stars than 2 stars. So the % chance of a 5 star being sweet good is higher than a 2 star. He's done the secret math on how to successfully recruit. Just sign high star players.

But what he chooses to ignore is their are more 2 and 3 star players out their that will pan out than 5 star. And there are teams that have a proven track record of identifing/developing those players...like MSU, Wisconsin, etc.

Now tDude will counter with, how many Championships have those teams won and point to team crootin' rankings of NC teams.

Well, there are plenty of teams that fail hard with these so called can't miss croots. It is not the stars that make the player. It is the teams that can evaluate the good from the trash regardless of star level. Would I rather pull from the so calles elite pool? Yep. BUT WE WILL NEVER OUT RECRUIT BAMA/ETC. So that is not a sustainable option.

We can, however, recruit players that win BIG Champioships. And that is usually good enough to get in the playoffs.

But but but but...Penn St didn't get in this year?!? Yeah, but a BIG team did and has every year, including MSU.

But I'm afraid to go again Bluto, we lost a gazillion to nothing last time. I don't want to go without 5 star croots. Yep and so did OSU. And we probably lose again, but if you have a chip and a chair anything can happen.

Did I cover everything? This topic is more stale than tanfan/duffy street fight.
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by LooseGoose on Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 20:20

What bothers me is the denigrating of players on here. This kid agrees to walk on at Michigan State. NONE of us and NO ONE else knows how it may turn out. Is he another Jack Conklin? Or is he someone we never hear about again? Yet the braying jackasses on here can't wait to cut the kid to shreds based on nothing more than lashing out of their own miserable existence.

Can't you at least let the kid have their day in the sun? Most of them have worked their asses off for this. Being a PWO at MSU is more than most of you ever did in your football lives. Does it give you an erection to cut this kid down? If so, I guess enjoy it otherwise shut the fuck up.

There are no false claims of greatness being made that you need to refute. The fact is that you don't need to do anything except be magnanimous and acknowledge the hard work that got the kid here. It's telling that even that is too much for you.


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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by Nordic on Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 20:23

The_Dude wrote:
DWags wrote:

So does Langford.  Don't for get him, he was a waste, and before him that Bell kid blew.  Three kids, in a row going to the league.  He sucks at finding running backs.  

Thats my point.  He's put guys in the league, why cant he recruit any?

Dantonio has landed one good RB since 2010. Mind boggling.

scratch Shocked Suspect confused
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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by WhiteBoyHatcher on Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 20:46

Why even engage.

Going to have at least 2 new Spartans by Monday I think. Peat and Cumberlander. The staff is reportedly very high on Cumberlander. And what do I know but his film and competition level as well as interest level from our staff given track record tells me a lot more than his star rating.

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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by GRR Spartan on Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 20:56

Denigrating MSU incoming recruits and players is a regular past time of some posters.

They remember what all those stars did for RichRod and Hoke

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Re: tOfficial MSU Football Recruiting Thread: Class of 2017

Post by Clarett's Folly on Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 21:02

WhiteBoyHatcher wrote:Why even engage.

Going to have at least 2 new Spartans by Monday I think. Peat and Cumberlander. The staff is reportedly very high on Cumberlander. And what do I know but his film and competition level as well as interest level from our staff given track record tells me a lot more than his star rating.

Cumberlander can ball.
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