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WTF... Deadspin

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Post by SawGreen Mon 13 Aug 2018 - 22:23

Kind of don't want to link this...

"Michigan State, in complete honesty, should have been razed to the ground by now. The administration, new and old, so monstrously failed its student body and athletes that it seems bizarre that the athletic department is allowed to chug along and rake in millions as though nothing happened. "

https://deadspin.com/michigan-state-probably-shouldnt-exist-but-it-does-and-1828305427
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Post by DWags Mon 13 Aug 2018 - 22:44

Brings Spartans closer together.  Fuck them.  

US vs. Them
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Post by Other Teams Pursuing That Mon 13 Aug 2018 - 23:10

At least he picked us to win the big ten it would seem

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Post by Guest Mon 13 Aug 2018 - 23:20

Has to be an obsessed scUMmer. Mentions Corley who hasn't been on the team for 18 months. And makes sure to highlight Reschke.

Never explains how the football program deserves to be destroyed because of a gymnastics doctor.

Fuck him. Fuck deadspin.
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Post by Guest Mon 13 Aug 2018 - 23:21

Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:At least he picked us to win the big ten it would seem

WTF... Deadspin 502811600

Not really when he's ranking us 16th.
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Post by AvgMSUJoe Tue 14 Aug 2018 - 10:06

Deadspin is staffed by a number of east coast um grads. (kinda like espn)

Fuck Deadspin.
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Post by Rocinante Tue 14 Aug 2018 - 11:25

I didn't think it was that bad. If you read deadspin regularly, which I do, you know that their MO is being over the top. Every school gets treated like this. And to be fair, MSU sports has been a fucking nightmare shitshow for a while now.
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Post by MiamiSpartan Tue 14 Aug 2018 - 11:33

AvgMSUJoe wrote:Deadspin is staffed by a number of east coast um grads. (kinda like espn)

Fuck Deadspin.
And a lot of them used to work/intern at ESPN. They're really just a blog site.

Did that Thiessen chick write this? I'm not going to give them a click.
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Post by DWags Tue 14 Aug 2018 - 11:54

Rocinante wrote:I didn't think it was that bad. If you read deadspin regularly, which I do, you know that their MO is being over the top. Every school gets treated like this. And to be fair, MSU sports has been a fucking nightmare shitshow for a while now.

Roc, get more sleep.
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Post by Other Teams Pursuing That Tue 14 Aug 2018 - 12:17

It’s funny to see the same fan base who called penn state, “ped state” get all bent out of shape when MSU is in the crosshairs for fucking up. You want tribalism, goose? Check out this thread - it’s not just in politics.
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Post by Robert J Sakimano Tue 14 Aug 2018 - 12:23

if you clicked on it, congrats - you did exactly what they wanted you to do.

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Post by steveschneider Tue 14 Aug 2018 - 13:04

Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:It’s funny to see the same fan base who called penn state, “ped state” get all bent out of shape when MSU is in the crosshairs for fucking up. You want tribalism, goose? Check out this thread - it’s not just in politics.

Penn State fans marched in public and cared more about the stats of a coach than the victims. I don’t see that many similarities.
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Post by NigelUno Tue 14 Aug 2018 - 13:07

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Last edited by NigelUno on Wed 15 Aug 2018 - 11:41; edited 1 time in total
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Post by AvgMSUJoe Tue 14 Aug 2018 - 13:16

steveschneider wrote:
Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:It’s funny to see the same fan base who called penn state, “ped state” get all bent out of shape when MSU is in the crosshairs for fucking up. You want tribalism, goose? Check out this thread - it’s not just in politics.

Penn State fans marched in public and cared more about the stats of a coach than the victims. I don’t see that many similarities.
Exactly. No similarities. PSU actively covered shit up.

MSU had one well-renown olympic level fucktard with an asshole boss. The rest were "optics" problems. (mostly generated by espn/deadspin)

The basketball/football issues have been well documented and thoroughly investigated by every authority... and still nothing has been found as "wrong" in dealing with the issues.

This is not tribalism.
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Post by Other Teams Pursuing That Tue 14 Aug 2018 - 13:33

steveschneider wrote:
Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:It’s funny to see the same fan base who called penn state, “ped state” get all bent out of shape when MSU is in the crosshairs for fucking up. You want tribalism, goose? Check out this thread - it’s not just in politics.

Penn State fans marched in public and cared more about the stats of a coach than the victims. I don’t see that many similarities.

Similar in the fact that people make assumptions about entire schools because of the actions of a few. It’s happening to MSU now and some of these same fans did the same with penn state
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Post by steveschneider Tue 14 Aug 2018 - 14:35

Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:
steveschneider wrote:

Penn State fans marched in public and cared more about the stats of a coach than the victims. I don’t see that many similarities.

Similar in the fact that people make assumptions about entire schools because of the actions of a few. It’s happening to MSU now and some of these same fans did the same with penn state

Got it. I think a lot of it has to do with the ridiculous moralizing that comes with college sports. The whole 'we do it the right way' and 'our coach is clean' causes a lot of fans and media to hold other schools in contempt. Try telling someone you like Coach Cal and they'll look at you like you took a shit on the floor. If you step out of line in college sports you are subjected to public shaming and made to be a disgrace. That's just how it goes.
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Post by Other Teams Pursuing That Wed 15 Aug 2018 - 2:59

steveschneider wrote:
Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:

Similar in the fact that people make assumptions about entire schools because of the actions of a few. It’s happening to MSU now and some of these same fans did the same with penn state

Got it. I think a lot of it has to do with the ridiculous moralizing that comes with college sports. The whole 'we do it the right way' and 'our coach is clean' causes a lot of fans and media to hold other schools in contempt. Try telling someone you like Coach Cal and they'll look at you like you took a shit on the floor. If you step out of line in college sports you are subjected to public shaming and made to be a disgrace. That's just how it goes.

No one cares if you’re actually dirty just don’t get caught. It’s a big dick measuring contest. Obviously not down with covering up sexual assaults and the like Baylor style - behave yourself. but if we aren’t cheating in recruiting then wtf we doing
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Post by Watch Out Pylon! Wed 15 Aug 2018 - 8:09

Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:
steveschneider wrote:

Got it. I think a lot of it has to do with the ridiculous moralizing that comes with college sports. The whole 'we do it the right way' and 'our coach is clean' causes a lot of fans and media to hold other schools in contempt. Try telling someone you like Coach Cal and they'll look at you like you took a shit on the floor. If you step out of line in college sports you are subjected to public shaming and made to be a disgrace. That's just how it goes.

No one cares if you’re actually dirty just don’t get caught. It’s a big dick measuring contest. Obviously not down with covering up sexual assaults and the like Baylor style - behave yourself. but if we aren’t cheating in recruiting then wtf we doing

Are we ever going to replace Blackwell? I guess Staten took the role on, but I'm talking a dedicated guy.
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Post by Guest Wed 15 Aug 2018 - 9:14

Watch Out Pylon! wrote:
Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:

No one cares if you’re actually dirty just don’t get caught. It’s a big dick measuring contest. Obviously not down with covering up sexual assaults and the like Baylor style - behave yourself. but if we aren’t cheating in recruiting then wtf we doing

Are we ever going to replace Blackwell? I guess Staten took the role on, but I'm talking a dedicated guy.

I thought that Sheldon White was helping with that too...
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Post by steveschneider Wed 15 Aug 2018 - 10:10

Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:
steveschneider wrote:

Got it. I think a lot of it has to do with the ridiculous moralizing that comes with college sports. The whole 'we do it the right way' and 'our coach is clean' causes a lot of fans and media to hold other schools in contempt. Try telling someone you like Coach Cal and they'll look at you like you took a shit on the floor. If you step out of line in college sports you are subjected to public shaming and made to be a disgrace. That's just how it goes.

No one cares if you’re actually dirty just don’t get caught. It’s a big dick measuring contest. Obviously not down with covering up sexual assaults and the like Baylor style - behave yourself. but if we aren’t cheating in recruiting then wtf we doing

Yeah, I guess it's part of the bigger game is to cheat but don't get caught. It's like at euchre it's a game that calls for cheating just don't get caught.

I was listening to Valenti yesterday just to get his takes on Durken and Urban....he mentioned the cover ups at ND. Horrific tragedies that caused a student to commit suicide and another kid to lose his life filming a practice.

Shit just goes away when you are a blue blood. Same shit with Duke and that kid that transferred to Maryland and that scum bag fg kicker and lewan at UofM. That shit needs to change. There needs to be accountability at all levels and maybe we are starting to see that turning point.
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Post by Cameron Wed 15 Aug 2018 - 11:35

Fucking steve, proud euchre cheat.
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Post by Guest Wed 15 Aug 2018 - 11:44

Cameron wrote:Fucking steve, proud euchre cheat.

I join you in your condemnation of this outrage.
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Post by steveschneider Wed 15 Aug 2018 - 12:15

I've always had subtle little signals, where I rest my hand on the table, a touch of the shoulder, the way I hold the cards that tips off to my partner if they should pass or call the card as trump.
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Post by tGreenWay Wed 15 Aug 2018 - 12:48

That’s it. I’m calling the president of euchre.
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Post by AvgMSUJoe Wed 15 Aug 2018 - 13:53

Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:It’s funny to see the same fan base who called penn state, “ped state” get all bent out of shape when MSU is in the crosshairs for fucking up. You want tribalism, goose? Check out this thread - it’s not just in politics.

You want tribalism...
Here's your MTHAFKNG tribalism...


“A few major donors have called me,” one longtime booster said. “They’ve all expressed that basically DJ is getting made to hang out to dry and that some of these so-called athletes are looking for participation trophies. Life is not about participation. It’s about learning life skills. DJ has been a great teacher of those.”

A damn child died and this dickhead regurgitates "pussification" takes....

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/terrapins-insider/wp/2018/08/14/maryland-football-coach-dj-durkin-still-has-support-of-many-players-parents/?utm_term=.a5fb05b982d8

No one supported any part of the Nasser thing that I saw.
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Post by steveschneider Wed 15 Aug 2018 - 13:57

AvgMSUJoe wrote:
Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:It’s funny to see the same fan base who called penn state, “ped state” get all bent out of shape when MSU is in the crosshairs for fucking up. You want tribalism, goose? Check out this thread - it’s not just in politics.

You want tribalism...
Here's your MTHAFKNG tribalism...


“A few major donors have called me,” one longtime booster said. “They’ve all expressed that basically DJ is getting made to hang out to dry and that some of these so-called athletes are looking for participation trophies. Life is not about participation. It’s about learning life skills. DJ has been a great teacher of those.”

A damn child died and this dickhead regurgitates "pussification" takes....

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/terrapins-insider/wp/2018/08/14/maryland-football-coach-dj-durkin-still-has-support-of-many-players-parents/?utm_term=.a5fb05b982d8

No one supported any part of the Nasser thing that I saw.

I agree with your last statement. I think the problem is in the minds of idiots in other fan bases they think Izzo and Dantonio contribute to a culture of rape thanks to that shit head Lavigne.
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Post by Wally Fairway Wed 15 Aug 2018 - 14:20

AvgMSUJoe wrote:
steveschneider wrote:

Penn State fans marched in public and cared more about the stats of a coach than the victims. I don’t see that many similarities.
Exactly. No similarities. PSU actively covered shit up.

MSU had one well-renown olympic level fucktard with an asshole boss. The rest were "optics" problems. (mostly generated by espn/deadspin)

The basketball/football issues have been well documented and thoroughly investigated by every authority... and still nothing has been found as "wrong" in dealing with the issues.

This is not tribalism.
Joe - I hope you don't actually believe that it was just 2 people at MSU. The University is to blame for that when the general counsel wrote 2 separate version of a review of the investigation into Nassar, and in the super secret one said that if the truth were found out it would be a huge problem. And don't forget the coach(s) and trainers who did not report the allegations against Nassar. And the administration personnel who knew Dean Strampel was more than creepy (this includes Lou Anna when she was provost).
I'm not going to rehash it - but also you shouldn't downplay how the administration allowed there to be a culture that Nassar took advantage of. And FWIW, I will try not to point out overly simplistic explanations, but I couldn't let this one slide.

I do think that the media overplayed the problems in Izzo and Coach D's programs, but let's not act like there weren't issues there that could have been better handled either. Don't get caught up in the every program has problems so it isn't a big deal. If not before, MSU needs to be better than that, and I think they will.
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Post by DWags Wed 15 Aug 2018 - 16:29

Wally Fairway wrote:
AvgMSUJoe wrote:
Exactly. No similarities. PSU actively covered shit up.

MSU had one well-renown olympic level fucktard with an asshole boss. The rest were "optics" problems. (mostly generated by espn/deadspin)

The basketball/football issues have been well documented and thoroughly investigated by every authority... and still nothing has been found as "wrong" in dealing with the issues.

This is not tribalism.
Joe - I hope you don't actually believe that it was just 2 people at MSU. The University is to blame for that when the general counsel wrote 2 separate version of a review of the investigation into Nassar, and in the super secret one said that if the truth were found out it would be a huge problem. And don't forget the coach(s) and trainers who did not report the allegations against Nassar. And the administration personnel who knew Dean Strampel was more than creepy (this includes Lou Anna when she was provost).
I'm not going to rehash it - but also you shouldn't downplay how the administration allowed there to be a culture that Nassar took advantage of. And FWIW, I will try not to point out overly simplistic explanations, but I couldn't let this one slide.

I do think that the media overplayed the problems in Izzo and Coach D's programs, but let's not act like there weren't issues there that could have been better handled either. Don't get caught up in the every program has problems so it isn't a big deal. If not before, MSU needs to be better than that, and I think they will.

Which issues would you have handled differently if you were Izzo or Dantonio?
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Post by WhiteBoyHatcher Wed 15 Aug 2018 - 17:39

I would have told my players every year that if they participate in a gang bang, they're kicked off the team. And I'm being serious.
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Post by Guest Wed 15 Aug 2018 - 17:49

WhiteBoyHatcher wrote:I would have told my players every year that if they participate in a gang bang, they're kicked off the team. And I'm being serious.

Prude.
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Post by DWags Wed 15 Aug 2018 - 18:11

WhiteBoyHatcher wrote:I would have told my players every year that if they participate in a gang bang, they're kicked off the team. And I'm being serious.


Well, that's probably good advice.   However, I want to know how Wally would have done it differently than Izzo and Dantonio.   I know it's easy to arm chair qb, and I'm not saying that those two were saints.   I'm legit curious.  Anyone can chime in, not just  wally.
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Post by SawGreen Wed 15 Aug 2018 - 18:53

WhiteBoyHatcher wrote:I would have told my players every year that if they participate in a gang bang, they're kicked off the team. And I'm being serious.

I agree. I think part of the reason the kids even participate is the shared blame and maybe a little peer pressure.
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Post by Dr. Strangelove Wed 15 Aug 2018 - 20:23

WhiteBoyHatcher wrote:I would have told my players every year that if they participate in a gang bang, they're kicked off the team. And I'm being serious.
What about Eiffel Towers?
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Post by AvgMSUJoe Wed 15 Aug 2018 - 20:53

Wally Fairway wrote:
AvgMSUJoe wrote:
Exactly. No similarities. PSU actively covered shit up.

MSU had one well-renown olympic level fucktard with an asshole boss. The rest were "optics" problems. (mostly generated by espn/deadspin)

The basketball/football issues have been well documented and thoroughly investigated by every authority... and still nothing has been found as "wrong" in dealing with the issues.

This is not tribalism.
Joe - I hope you don't actually believe that it was just 2 people at MSU. The University is to blame for that when the general counsel wrote 2 separate version of a review of the investigation into Nassar, and in the super secret one said that if the truth were found out it would be a huge problem. And don't forget the coach(s) and trainers who did not report the allegations against Nassar. And the administration personnel who knew Dean Strampel was more than creepy (this includes Lou Anna when she was provost).
I'm not going to rehash it - but also you shouldn't downplay how the administration allowed there to be a culture that Nassar took advantage of. And FWIW, I will try not to point out overly simplistic explanations, but I couldn't let this one slide.

I do think that the media overplayed the problems in Izzo and Coach D's programs, but let's not act like there weren't issues there that could have been better handled either. Don't get caught up in the every program has problems so it isn't a big deal. If not before, MSU needs to be better than that, and I think they will.
Yeah, there were a handful that should have done more. Still, no one protected anyone after the fact.
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Post by steveschneider Wed 15 Aug 2018 - 23:11

WhiteBoyHatcher wrote:I would have told my players every year that if they participate in a gang bang, they're kicked off the team. And I'm being serious.

Gang bangs are legal and happen all the time in nature. You can’t regulate sexual preferences as long as it is consensual.
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Post by WhiteBoyHatcher Wed 15 Aug 2018 - 23:16

steveschneider wrote:
WhiteBoyHatcher wrote:I would have told my players every year that if they participate in a gang bang, they're kicked off the team. And I'm being serious.

Gang bangs are legal and happen all the time in nature. You can’t regulate sexual preferences as long as it is consensual.

Yes you can. Team rule. Coach rule. It's not legislating shit. It's we're under the microscope and if you engage in this behavior you are putting yourself, your teammates, my staff and my job at risk. It's playing with fire. Absolute recipe for disaster.
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Post by Wally Fairway Thu 16 Aug 2018 - 9:40

DWags wrote:Which issues would you have handled differently if you were Izzo or Dantonio?
Coach D has been burned (sometimes) by giving kids a 2nd chance; I like that he is will to do that, however in today's world that makes him putting his job and the program at risk.
The best (or maybe worst) example is Austin Robertson, kid had problems in HS but coach D stuck with him. I certainly don't know the whole story of the trouble with that recruiting class, but he seems to have been in the middle of much of it.

The troubles with the hoops program are harder to define, but the Travis Winston situation and keeping him on the basketball staff is troubling. And, IMO, there have been things handled internally that should have been done either outside the basketball or AD department. The way some of the issues were handled make it look like a cover-up, and it is part of the bad look for the program.
Then again the philosophy of handling things internally has made MSU look terrible in many of the current problems; and still does with Engler and his bumbling statements, and those by the BOT. There has been a circle the wagons mentality, that is a natural reaction but someone in a leadership position needs to step in and break that chain.

Serious question - I get why Lou Anna Simon resigned, but when Hollis stepped down so quickly and unexpectedly I was surprised and I'm still not sure if he did so to fall on the sword with the reported troubles in the program. Or if it is a where there is smoke there is fire thing and he knew about more of this stuff than was being reported.

Don't get me wrong - my post was mainly about AvgJoe saying MSU only had a problem with Nassar and Stampel. I don't have any serious problems with how Izzo and Coach D have handled their programs; but how things were done in the past will not be acceptable from here forward.

Question for WBH - is a threesome (or more) with 1 dude and multiple chicks considered a gang bang or is that an orgy? Is an orgy okay if everyone signs a consent form? I've got kids in college and I want to be very specific when I give them rules.
Answer with words or pictures (no lemonparties) - your choice

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Post by Guest Thu 16 Aug 2018 - 10:04

Wally Fairway wrote:The troubles with the hoops program are harder to define, but the Travis Winston situation and keeping him on the basketball staff is troubling.

I seem to recall that this was a LaVigne invention. Was he a member of the staff?

And the whole 2nd chances thing bothers me. I'm a firm believer in 2nd chances. I think we punish many kids too severely for youthful mistakes. That said, I agree the chances Robertson got were above and beyond.

2nd chances are one of those damned if you do, damned if you don't things. I hope CoachD keeps giving them but perhaps is more careful about doing so where there's any history at all of assault.
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WTF... Deadspin Empty Re: WTF... Deadspin

Post by AvgMSUJoe Thu 16 Aug 2018 - 10:35

Wally Fairway wrote:...
The troubles with the hoops program are harder to define, but the Travis Winston situation and keeping him on the basketball staff is troubling. And, IMO, there have been things handled internally that should have been done either outside the basketball or AD department. The way some of the issues were handled make it look like a cover-up, and it is part of the bad look for the program.
...

As I read the TW situation, Izzo, the athletic dept. and even possibly TW wasn't even aware there was a situation until after he was gone. At that point, it was investigated and nothing happened.

Izzo looked like he was blindsided by that in the interview with ESPN. (I suppose he could have been "oh shit they know" as opposed to "WTF?", but I read it as "WTF?")
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Post by MiamiSpartan Thu 16 Aug 2018 - 13:59

Wally Fairway wrote:
The troubles with the hoops program are harder to define, but the Travis Winston situation and keeping him on the basketball staff is troubling. And, IMO, there have been things handled internally that should have been done either outside the basketball or AD department. The way some of the issues were handled make it look like a cover-up, and it is part of the bad look for the program.
Then again the philosophy of handling things internally has made MSU look terrible in many of the current problems; and still does with Engler and his bumbling statements, and those by the BOT. There has been a circle the wagons mentality, that is a natural reaction but someone in a leadership position needs to step in and break that chain.
People have already questioned you on your issue with the Walton thing, so I won't pile on about that, but what was handled internally? The only things in Lavigne's hatchet job that did not go to police is when the victims themselves specifically did not want to go to the police. Should Izzo have gone to the police and said, "Look, this girl doesn't want an investigation or to press charges, and the guys claim that it was all consensual, but dammit, I think you should spend your time, effort, and budget to investigate them anyway." I'm sorry, but the criminal justice system doesn't work that way.
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