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The End of Recycling?

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Post by steveschneider 2019-03-06, 11:46

https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2019/03/china-has-stopped-accepting-our-trash/584131/

Good read
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Post by Floyd Robertson 2019-03-06, 11:59

The best way to fix recycling is probably persuading people to buy less stuff, which would also have the benefit of reducing some of the upstream waste created when products are made.

Imagine if people did that and paid off their average $15k in credit card debit.

Good link, Steve, thanks.

It's a huge problem. Maybe tax the shit out of raw material that goes into new plastics. The other solution is less people.
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Post by steveschneider 2019-03-06, 12:25

Floyd Robertson wrote:
The best way to fix recycling is probably persuading people to buy less stuff, which would also have the benefit of reducing some of the upstream waste created when products are made.

Imagine if people did that and paid off their average $15k in credit card debit.

Good link, Steve, thanks.

It's a huge problem. Maybe tax the shit out of raw material that goes into new plastics. The other solution is less people.

Glad you enjoyed it. I agree it's a big problem and I never really had a behind the scenes look at the whole process. I didn't realize a bulk of the stuff was sent to China.

It seems like just changing the way we buy goods would help. I should start buying from the bulk bins for stuff like peanuts, almonds etc. Seems like there should be a new/better way to distribute shit like toothpaste, shampoo, shaving cream etc. Why do I need a new tube for tooth paste - a refillable container would be better.
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Post by Other Teams Pursuing That 2019-03-06, 12:31

Y’all should watch the minimalism documentary on Netflix.
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Post by Floyd Robertson 2019-03-06, 12:42

minimalism documentary on Netflix

Thanks for the idea, found it bookmarked it. Probably won't change my life, but hey.
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Post by steveschneider 2019-03-06, 12:53

Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:Y’all should watch the minimalism documentary on Netflix.

What did that doc change for you? Very curious.
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Post by Cameron 2019-03-06, 12:58

I have seen compostable plastics made from plants. We should do more of that.
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Post by By-Tor 2019-03-06, 22:26

Our trash service sent a letter last month saying China isn’t taking bulk recycling anymore so stop stuffing the recycling bins with greasy pizza boxes, glass and whatever else trash people tried to pass off as recycling. If they see anything in the recycling bin that doesn’t meet the criteria it’s going straight to the landfill.
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Post by WhiteBoyHatcher 2019-03-17, 12:47

Most pizza boxes have that cardboard strip pad. If you take that out, and clean the pizza boxes relatively well, are they recycleable?

I went grocery shopping this weekend with an eye out for plastic. Here are some things I simply don't know how you can get without plastic.

Pretzels
Tortilla chips
Strawberries and most berry-type of fruit
Yogurt
Disinfectant type of spray/wipes
Cheese
Paper towel/toilet paper
Cereal (plastic bag contained within box)
Bread! Any kind - buns, sliced, english muffins, bagels - all come in plastic bags
I'm sure I missed some stuff

I was able to switch with a few things to cardboard:
Milk
OJ
eggs
laundry detergent
meat straight from the butcher
trash bags (can buy compostable ones)
cat litter
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Post by Rocinante 2019-03-17, 12:57

There are options for all of those things without plastic. But they cost more. The only solutions are legislative. We have to make hard choices. We are not good at that.
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Post by WhiteBoyHatcher 2019-03-17, 13:00

Cost is not a barrier for me but obviously it is for the manufacturer.

I do not know how to get those things without plastic in my hometown. And some are simply not replaceable by other options because kids don't necessarily care enough about recycling to change what they will eat in their lunches.
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Post by Rocinante 2019-03-17, 14:25

That’s what I mean about hard choices. As a society we have to make the choice to outlaw some types of plastics, increase public funding for facilities to process trash, including incinerators, and spend what it takes to clean up our mess. The freedom of the individual to pursue any damn thing that he sees fit in order to secure himself profit is needs to be less of a priority. We live in a society, we’re not a bunch of individuals and it’s far past time we stopped acting like it if we care about the world we leave our kids. I think, right now anyway, people claim to, but really don’t.
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Post by WhiteBoyHatcher 2019-03-17, 14:34

I feel you. And I don't think we'll ever get there - or even close, at least not in this country. People are too selfish.
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Post by Floyd Robertson 2019-03-17, 16:42

Rocinante wrote:There are options for all of those things without plastic. But they cost more. The only solutions are legislative. We have to make hard choices. We are not good at that.

MD is making a start, a small dent.

Bill passes to make Maryland 1st state to ban foam food containers
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Post by WhiteBoyHatcher 2019-03-18, 09:14

According to commercials that air during sporting events, engineering students at Michigan State University are working to develop green, biodegradable plastics. I am certain that manufacturing companies will jump all over these solutions as soon as the students come up with something.
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Post by steveschneider 2019-03-18, 11:48

We bought these washable mesh bags that we take to the grocery store for our produce.

Bought a thermos for my coffee and find that the shops give a discount when I bring it.

Also, in the Prius this weekend I traveled 12 miles on a day trip and got 64 MPG. Woot woot!

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Post by Rocinante 2019-03-18, 12:09

As long as the cost of regular ass plastic is cheaper and there’s no statutory pressure to adopt biodegradable plastics, they will not be adopted. We need laws. In addition, unfortunately “biodegradable” assumes some exposure to the elements, which is not a normal condition in most landfills. Sorry to be negative Nancy but there are no solutions that “THE MARKET(tm)” will adopt because they eat into profit which is all that matters in our world.
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Post by steveschneider 2019-03-18, 12:34

Rocinante wrote:As long as the cost of regular ass plastic is cheaper and there’s no statutory pressure to adopt biodegradable plastics, they will not be adopted. We need laws. In addition, unfortunately “biodegradable” assumes some exposure to the elements, which is not a normal condition in most landfills. Sorry to be negative Nancy but there are no solutions that “THE MARKET(tm)” will adopt because they eat into profit which is all that matters in our world.

I agree for the most part. I do think more people are aware of this stuff now and it will create some opportunities. They have package less stores now in Europe and who knows there might be an opportunity for them in the US before too long. The demand for a greener approach is on the rise and I'm optimistic businesses will evolve to meet this demand.
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Post by WhiteBoyHatcher 2019-03-18, 13:27

Steve tell me about these produce bags. How do you transfer the UPC and whatnot. If you want strawberries do you just dump them out of the plastic container into your bag and leave it there?
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Post by steveschneider 2019-03-18, 15:44

WhiteBoyHatcher wrote:Steve tell me about these produce bags. How do you transfer the UPC and whatnot. If you want strawberries do you just dump them out of the plastic container into your bag and leave it there?

Sure.

I couldn't find the exact one we have but very similar.

https://www.amazon.com/Outtills-Reusable-Produce-Bags-Lightweight/dp/B07BKPN8SF/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?hvadid=214464650070&hvdev=c&hvlocphy=1023024&hvnetw=g&hvpos=1t1&hvqmt=e&hvrand=14930137767633835878&hvtargid=aud-647846986281%3Akwd-355875552211&keywords=reusable+washable+produce+bags&qid=1552936721&s=gateway&sr=8-1-spons&tag=googhydr-20&psc=1

I'm sure the purists out there use the muslin cotton ones but whatever there's perks to a re-usable plastic container too. Yeah, there's labels on the veggies that we put on there. I think on broccoli there's a scan code tied to it, so we just untwist and put it on the bag. Hasn't caused any problems. We go to just the regular blue collar grocery store in our town and I find most of the cashiers are into the re-usable containers.

Regarding strawberries that come in those plastic clamp shells, I don't think it would work for that. I think we buy ours in those card board containers that break down. Same with blue berries and cherries. Also, if you have a farmers market near you that's worth checking out. Our good friend Loosegoose would agree. You can get some unbelievable produce at those things and you can get a good deal too.
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Post by AvgMSUJoe 2019-03-18, 19:31

Ya know. Back in the day, paper bags... And milk bottles recycled. Cans get recycled... We theoretically could do the same for milk jugs and juice and everything... But manufacturers would have to take ownership. Like back when America was great again.
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Post by Floyd Robertson 2019-03-18, 20:20

AvgMSUJoe wrote:Ya know. Back in the day, paper bags... And milk bottles recycled. Cans get recycled... We theoretically could do the same for milk jugs and juice and everything... But manufacturers would have to take ownership. Like back when America was great again.

Imagine milk getting delivered in glass bottles to an insulated box on your porch.
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Post by WhiteBoyHatcher 2019-03-18, 20:23

Oberweiss does that. My kids don't like it obviously.
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Post by Floyd Robertson 2019-03-18, 20:26

WhiteBoyHatcher wrote:Oberweiss does that. My kids don't like it obviously.

I thought you were shitting me until I looked them up. I had no idea anyone was doing this in 2019.
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Post by steveschneider 2019-03-19, 07:55

https://www.washingtonpost.com/science/2019/03/18/whales-keep-eating-plastic-dying-this-ones-stomach-had-pounds-calcifying-trash/
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Post by Floyd Robertson 2019-04-11, 11:18

Tiny bottles of shampoo, conditioner, lotion may not be given to hotel guests in California

SACRAMENTO, California ( KOVR ) — Hotels in California may no longer be able to provide guests with tiny bottles of shampoo, conditioner, lotion, or other personal care products.
Assembly Bill 1162 passed the Natural Resources committee on Monday by a vote of 6-3 (two Assemblymembers did not vote.)

So do room rates go down $1 per day?
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Post by Floyd Robertson 2019-05-08, 07:39

Breakthrough discovery: New plastic could be 'holy grail' of recycling

Sounds promising so I expect it will never be adopted.
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Post by DWags 2019-05-08, 09:30

Whatever happened to this MSU advance?

MSU scientists using sunlight to produce plastic that is biodegradable.
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Post by steveschneider 2019-05-08, 12:51

I'm stoked to read about this new plastic. Fingers crossed that it happens. We've been looking at this local CSA (Community Supported Agriculture). You pay something like $450 upfront for the season and you get all your produce directly from the local farmers. Might be worth looking into your area to see if you have something similar.
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Post by Floyd Robertson 2019-05-22, 10:40

Soylent Green Plant Food

SEATTLE (AP) — Ashes to ashes, guts to dirt.

Gov. Jay Inslee signed legislation Tuesday making Washington the first state to approve composting as an alternative to burying or cremating human remains.
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