Inflation continues on record pace.

Zurn wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:I can answer Serenity's question, at least about new cars.

Well, you're the guy that thought Mazda made Subaru's and that Subaru is a union shop ..... so maybe you aren't the best source about things automotive after all.

Zurn wrote:

AvgMSUJoe wrote:

If inflation is because too much gubmint money and interest rates do nothing to curtail inflation, how do you explain the inflation rate dropping by multiples since it's peak just a few years ago?  

Prices haven't dropped. They are up 20-25% since the feds created all of this new money. And still rising at 3-4% annually. The profound economic ignorance out there is staggering.

Zurn wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

Inflation is economically situational.  For example, if suppliers are earn a profit they have no logical reason to increase prices just because some people can pay.

In this "situation" a supplier has a very logical reason to increase prices.   If people can (and will) pay more for the product it is very logical to raise the price to make more money!     Economics isn't that difficult!

Trapper Gus wrote:

Zurn wrote:

Well, you're the guy that thought Mazda made Subaru's and that Subaru is a union shop ..... so maybe you aren't the best source about things automotive after all.

Just shows I've forgotten more about cars then you will ever know, including that a majority of Subarus are union made.

TravelinMan wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

Just shows I've forgotten more about cars then you will ever know, including that a majority of Subarus are union made.

I would agree that you appear to have forgotten a LOT about cars based upon your displayed knowledge here on this forum.

Trapper Gus wrote:

TravelinMan wrote:

I would agree that you appear to have forgotten a LOT about cars based upon your displayed knowledge here on this forum.

:)

Still believe the electric starter was a mistake.  Real men use a crank

TravelinMan wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

:)

Still believe the electric starter was a mistake.  Real men use a crank

On this we can agree.  In fact, part of the TravelinMan 100 day agenda will be to sign an executive order outlawing the automatic transmission.  I will put an end to distracted driving by putting driving front and center again in our motorist's minds.   Vote TravelinMan 2024.  I'm TravelinMan and I approve this message.  This message paid for By TravelinMan2024 and all of his hard work.

Trapper Gus wrote:

TravelinMan wrote:

On this we can agree.  In fact, part of the TravelinMan 100 day agenda will be to sign an executive order outlawing the automatic transmission.  I will put an end to distracted driving by putting driving front and center again in our motorist's minds.   Vote TravelinMan 2024.  I'm TravelinMan and I approve this message.  This message paid for By TravelinMan2024 and all of his hard work.

It was a mistake when they turned the tiller into a wheel, moved the throttle to a pedal on the floor, and moved the gear shift lever onto the steering column

Trapper Gus wrote:Poll on who believes what about inflation, just about what anyone would expect.

The Democratic voters blame the greedy corporations.

The Republican voters blame the government.

Since there are still people who believe the earth is flat, a hard science non-question, is it any surprise that Republicans don't see the overwhelming evidence of greed driving huge corporate profits during the pandemic?

Zurn wrote:

Poll confirms that Republicans are more knowledgeable than Democrats about economics.  

No dispute that "greed" drives the motivation for more profits.   I'm all for more profits.  

Before Trapper further condemns greed keep in mind that he owns a pricey up north residence as well as a home outside of Ann Arbor and admits to venturing into Ann Arbor to eat at expensive steak restaurants.  

Zurn wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:Poll on who believes what about inflation, just about what anyone would expect.

The Democratic voters blame the greedy corporations.

The Republican voters blame the government.

Since there are still people who believe the earth is flat, a hard science non-question, is it any surprise that Republicans don't see the overwhelming evidence of greed driving huge corporate profits during the pandemic?

Poll confirms that Republicans are more knowledgeable than Democrats about economics.

No dispute that "greed" drives the motivation for more profits. I'm all for more profits.

Before Trapper further condemns greed keep in mind that he owns a pricey up north residence as well as a home outside of Ann Arbor and admits to venturing into Ann Arbor to eat at expensive steak restaurants.

Trapper Gus wrote:

Zurn wrote:

Poll confirms that Republicans are more knowledgeable than Democrats about economics.

No dispute that "greed" drives the motivation for more profits. I'm all for more profits.

Before Trapper further condemns greed keep in mind that he owns a pricey up north residence as well as a home outside of Ann Arbor and admits to venturing into Ann Arbor to eat at expensive steak restaurants.

A market-based system doesn't work the way you intend it too if the power between buyers & sellers isn't balanced. Greed by the corporations who have 95% of the power to charge whatever they want because they have no real competition destroys the market "forces" you are relying on to control prices, and greed, to a rational level.

Trapper Gus wrote:

A market-based system doesn't work the way you intend it too if the power between buyers & sellers isn't balanced.  Greed by the corporations who have 95% of the power to charge whatever they want because they have no real competition destroys the market "forces" you are relying on to control prices, and greed, to a rational level.

Trapper Gus wrote:
A market-based system doesn't work the way you intend it too if the power between buyers & sellers isn't balanced. Greed by the corporations who have 95% of the power to charge whatever they want because they have no real competition destroys the market "forces" you are relying on to control prices, and greed, to a rational level.

Zurn wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

A market-based system doesn't work the way you intend it too if the power between buyers & sellers isn't balanced. Greed by the corporations who have 95% of the power to charge whatever they want because they have no real competition destroys the market "forces" you are relying on to control prices, and greed, to a rational level.

Generally any limitation on marketplace competition exists because of government interference in the marketplace.

Let's take autos. I can buy a car from at least 15 different manufacturer from around the world. If Subaru (made my Mazda according to you) wants to charge $80k for an Outback what would happen.

Elsewhere in this thread people were complaining about Publix and somebody made the observation they could by food for 1/2 the price at Target. What would you do in that situation.

Your claim that corporations can charge whatever they want is obvious foolery simply because corporations don't do that unless the government allows them to in a government limited marketplace for specific products.

Barriers to entry are factors that prevent or hinder new entrants from competing with existing firms in a market. A monopoly is a market structure where there is only one firm that offers a product or service, and faces no competition. A monopoly can form barriers to entry by using its market power and resources to set the price, control the supply, or create legal or technical obstacles for potential competitors. Barriers to entry can lead to market inefficiency and reduced consumer welfare.

AvgMSUJoe wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:
A market-based system doesn't work the way you intend it too if the power between buyers & sellers isn't balanced. Greed by the corporations who have 95% of the power to charge whatever they want because they have no real competition destroys the market "forces" you are relying on to control prices, and greed, to a rational level.

Zurn doesn't want "the market" to fix the economy, he wants govt price controls.

https://spartanswill.forumotion.com/t23593p640-inflation-continues-on-record-pace#902792

Trapper Gus wrote:

Zurn wrote:

Generally any limitation on marketplace competition exists because of government interference in the marketplace.

Let's take autos. I can buy a car from at least 15 different manufacturer from around the world. If Subaru (made my Mazda according to you) wants to charge $80k for an Outback what would happen.

Elsewhere in this thread people were complaining about Publix and somebody made the observation they could by food for 1/2 the price at Target. What would you do in that situation.

Your claim that corporations can charge whatever they want is obvious foolery simply because corporations don't do that unless the government allows them to in a government limited marketplace for specific products.

No.

Idealists like you are wrong in the idea that "markets" are some sort of organization that is created in a power vacuum naturally. They are not. They exist when governments set up conditions, such as the sanctity of contracts, and property rights and hundreds of other laws.

People who study this sort of thing for a living tell us the following:

Barriers to entry are factors that prevent or hinder new entrants from competing with existing firms in a market. A monopoly is a market structure where there is only one firm that offers a product or service, and faces no competition. A monopoly can form barriers to entry by using its market power and resources to set the price, control the supply, or create legal or technical obstacles for potential competitors. Barriers to entry can lead to market inefficiency and reduced consumer welfare.

Zurn wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

No.

Idealists like you are wrong in the idea that "markets" are some sort of organization that is created in a power vacuum naturally.  They are not.  They exist when governments set up conditions, such as the sanctity of contracts, and property rights and hundreds of other laws.  

People who study this sort of thing for a living tell us the following:

More "blah, blah, blah" from Trapper, but notice he didn't attempt to answer my questions.  

According to a 2021 investigation by the Guardian and Food and Water Watch, a small number of companies control the majority of the market share for almost 80% of groceries purchased by Americans. In particular, the investigation found that:

Four or fewer firms: Control at least 50% of the market for 79% of groceries

Top firms: Control at least 75% of the market share for almost a third of shopping items

WASHINGTON (AP) — A measure of prices that is closely tracked by the Federal Reserve suggests that inflation pressures in the U.S. economy are continuing to ease.

Friday’s Commerce Department report showed that consumer prices were flat from April to May, the mildest such performance in more than four years. Measured from a year earlier, prices rose 2.6% last month, slightly less than in April.

Excluding volatile food and energy prices, so-called core inflation rose 0.1% from April to May, the smallest increase since the spring of 2020, when the pandemic erupted and shut down the economy. And compared with a year earlier, core prices were up 2.6% in May, the lowest increase in more than three years.

Prices for physical goods actually fell 0.4% from April to May. Gasoline prices, for example, dropped 3.4%, furniture prices 1% and the prices of recreational goods and vehicles 1.6%. On the other hand, prices for services, which include items like restaurant meals and airline fares, ticked up 0.2%.

CONSUMER PRICE INDEX - JUNE 2024

The Consumer Price Index for All Urban Consumers (CPI-U) declined 0.1 percent on a seasonally adjusted basis, after being unchanged in May, the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics reported today. Over the last 12 months, the all items index increased 3.0 percent before seasonal adjustment.

The index for gasoline fell 3.8 percent in June, after declining 3.6 percent in May, more than offsetting an increase in shelter. The energy index fell 2.0 percent over the month, as it did the preceding month.

The index for food increased 0.2 percent in June. The food away from home index rose 0.4 percent over the month, while the food at home index increased 0.1 percent.

The index for all items less food and energy rose 0.1 percent in June, after rising 0.2 percent the preceding month. Indexes which increased in June include shelter, motor vehicle insurance, household furnishings and operations, medical care, and personal care. The indexes for airline fares, used cars and trucks, and communication were among those that decreased over the month.

The all-items index rose 3.0 percent for the 12 months ending June, a smaller increase than the 3.3-percent increase for the 12 months ending May. The all items less food and energy index rose 3.3 percent over the last 12 months and was the smallest 12-month increase in that index since April 2021.

The energy index increased 1.0 percent for the 12 months ending June. The food index increased 2.2 percent over the last year.

Jake from State Farm wrote:I think this fits better here than it does in random ramblings:

According to the U.S. Department of Energy, the national average for the cost of gasoline remained steady for the first three years of the 1950s at $0.27 per gallon. That low price might sound practically idyllic, but the average household income at the time was $3,300 per year. Adjusted for inflation, $0.27 in 1950 equates to about $3.52/gallon in today’s dollars. Nowadays, the median household income is $74,580.

AvgMSUJoe wrote:

Jake from State Farm wrote:I think this fits better here than it does in random ramblings:

According to the U.S. Department of Energy, the national average for the cost of gasoline remained steady for the first three years of the 1950s at $0.27 per gallon. That low price might sound practically idyllic, but the average household income at the time was $3,300 per year. Adjusted for inflation, $0.27 in 1950 equates to about $3.52/gallon in today’s dollars. Nowadays, the median household income is $74,580.

Math and logic aren't Rs strong suit... Well, I should say the "rank in file"s strong suit... the evil ones behind the scenes riling up idiots about trans library rights know exactly what they are doing.

"I did that" stickers ??? Christ.

kingstonlake wrote:The price of gas is the least of Americas worries. The average price of a home in 1950 was like $8,000 compared to household average income of $3,300

Now do 2024

TravelinMan wrote:

kingstonlake wrote:The price of gas is the least of Americas worries. The average price of a home in 1950 was like $8,000 compared to household average income of $3,300

Now do 2024

I always laugh when Americans bitch and moan about sub-$5 gasoline costs.

Tell me you've never been overseas without telling me you've never been overseas!

Trapper Gus wrote:

TravelinMan wrote:

I always laugh when Americans bitch and moan about sub-$5 gasoline costs.

Tell me you've never been overseas without telling me you've never been overseas!

While I have never purchased gas overseas I do know that prices in the EU are high and prices in the middle-east are low, so that is a mixed bag.

TravelinMan wrote:

kingstonlake wrote:The price of gas is the least of Americas worries. The average price of a home in 1950 was like $8,000 compared to household average income of $3,300

Now do 2024

I always laugh when Americans bitch and moan about sub-$5 gasoline costs.

Tell me you've never been overseas without telling me you've never been overseas!

Trapper Gus wrote:So, one US gallon = 3.78541178 liters

Lowest middle east price is 24 US cents per liter = 91 US cents per gallon

Highest middle east price is $1.57 per liter = $5.94 cents per gallon

I'm going to the cheap station at $0.91

https://www.indexmundi.com/facts/indicators/EP.PMP.SGAS.CD/map/middle-east

In a better-than-expected report, consumer prices declined 0.1% from May to June after having remained flat the previous month, the Labor Department said Thursday. It was the first monthly decline in overall inflation since May 2020, when the economy was paralyzed by the pandemic.

And measured from one year earlier, prices were up 3% in June, cooler than the 3.3% annual rate in May.

Here is the unreported good news: Aside from shelter, CPI Inflation and core inflation rose only 1.8 percent over the past 12 months and were either flat or falling over the last two.

GRR Spartan wrote:If  the economy is so bad why can’t visitors to Michigan resort cities  along Lake Michigan, “Up North” like Gaylord and others with golf resorts , Mackinac and  the up find vacant hotel rooms?

Why are so many flights regardless of where you’re flying to or from full?

So many people vacationing trying to fight thru the economic collapse that started when Biden was elected?

The GDP report also showed that inflation continues to ease, while still remaining above the Federal Reserve’s 2% target. The central bank’s favored inflation gauge rose at a 2.6% annual rate last quarter, down from 3.4% in the first quarter of the year. Excluding volatile food and energy prices, so-called core PCE inflation increased at a 2.9% pace. That was down from 3.7% from January through March.

TravelinMan wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

A market-based system doesn't work the way you intend it too if the power between buyers & sellers isn't balanced. Greed by the corporations who have 95% of the power to charge whatever they want because they have no real competition destroys the market "forces" you are relying on to control prices, and greed, to a rational level.

Can you tell us when corporations became so greedy? Can you overlay it on an inflation map?

bea wrote:...the PCE price index for June increased 2.5 percent (table 7). Prices for goods decreased 0.2 percent and prices for services increased 3.9 percent. Food prices increased 1.4 percent and energy prices increased 2.0 percent. Excluding food and energy, the PCE price index increased 2.6 percent from one year ago.