Re: Biden gas prices $3->$4->$5->$6?

by **Trapper Gus** 2022-03-10, 08:44

Bredo Morstoel wrote:
Trapper Gus wrote:

No.

We have free markets, which, by definition are not a "cohesive tong term strategy". What they are is a search for a reasonable immediate solution which works for the people who have the gold.

The Progressives have been pushing for a level playing field for renewable energy, and they have made progress. The second largest generator of electricity was renewable in the US last year. and in the next 2 to 5 years EV's are set to explode on the market.

Wasn't it you who once waxed philosophically here that free markets weren't really free?

Yes, I have mostly been talking about how people who engage in exchanges in "Free Markets" seldom actually are exchanging equal value, which is the basic axiom which justifies "Free Markets".

What I will call "Real Markets" have all sorts of distortions from ideal "Free Markets", which economists know, but "Free Market" proponents often not only ignore the distortions, but they also go further and claim they don't matter and don't really exist, which is not correct. Any honest discussion of "Free Markets" should have the distortions from the ideal "Free Markets" included.

by **Trapper Gus** 2022-03-10, 08:51

Bredo Morstoel wrote:
Pervis Muldoon wrote:

Exactly. And the first step in a cohesive, long-term energy strategy is to say that electric vehicles are toasters and they're NOT READY, even if millions of people are driving them.

If every single American bought an EV in the next 5 years, the electric grid would collapse.

We have no rational, cohesive energy strategy or even plan in this country. It's ridiculous.

Studies of the question of demands electric vehicles charging will place on the electric transmission infrastructure say that the current infrastructure can handle an electric vehicle market penetration of about roughly 75% of vehicles. These studies assume that the vehicles will be muchly charged at "off peak" times during the day, however the "grid" rarely operates anywhere close to its 100% capability as that occurs typically only on very hot days in the afternoon in places such as California. Texas, with its "Free Market" transmission and generation infrastructure has issues due to poor regulation, however they occur at cold temperatures.

by **Floyd Robertson** 2022-03-10, 09:19

[tw]1501920976958803969[/tw]

by Bredo Morstoel 2022-03-10, 09:36

Trapper Gus wrote:
Bredo Morstoel wrote:

Wasn't it you who once waxed philosophically here that free markets weren't really free?

Yes, I have mostly been talking about how people who engage in exchanges in "Free Markets" seldom actually are exchanging equal value, which is the basic axiom which justifies "Free Markets".

What I will call "Real Markets" have all sorts of distortions from ideal "Free Markets", which economists know, but "Free Market" proponents often not only ignore the distortions, but they also go further and claim they don't matter and don't really exist, which is not correct. Any honest discussion of "Free Markets" should have the distortions from the ideal "Free Markets" included.

So, I'm confused. Do we have free markets or not? You can't play both sides of this.

by **Trapper Gus** 2022-03-10, 09:52

Bredo Morstoel wrote:
Trapper Gus wrote:

Yes, I have mostly been talking about how people who engage in exchanges in "Free Markets" seldom actually are exchanging equal value, which is the basic axiom which justifies "Free Markets".

What I will call "Real Markets" have all sorts of distortions from ideal "Free Markets", which economists know, but "Free Market" proponents often not only ignore the distortions, but they also go further and claim they don't matter and don't really exist, which is not correct. Any honest discussion of "Free Markets" should have the distortions from the ideal "Free Markets" included.

So, I'm confused. Do we have free markets or not? You can't play both sides of this.

What? I can't? I most certainly can!

There is no such thing as an ideal "Free Market".

It is a set of assumptions made up by economists, which have never existed in reality.

However, many Libertarians & other idealists argue that such a thing does exist. They are 100% wrong, but they are in love with the ideal, and based on their emotional attachment they refuse to talk sense, but instead make up all sorts of half-assed excuses for the "distortions"

Each real transaction in our economy is distorted from the "Free Market" ideal by countless factors.

So, the best that reasonably could be argued is that we have a "Distorted Free Market". However, since we cannot identify all the "distortions" what that "Market" really is cannot be defined, which is why the economists have so much trouble attempting to reach agreement to predict what it will do.

This "Distorted Free Market" is the strategy for many items we sell and buy, addressing your point about having an energy policy. It is not "long-term" as Markets are existential. What forward looking in time distortions there are have been created via laws, such as subsidizing the purchase of BEV's, and thousands of other distortions. Proponents of these will argue that they are needed to counter other distortions in the "Free Market". This IMO is what you are thinking of when you suggest a "long term energy policy"

by **Trapper Gus** 2022-03-10, 10:30

This seemed interesting as background on gas prices ...

What to do about Gas Prices

by **NigelUno** 2022-03-10, 10:57

Trapper Gus wrote:
Bredo Morstoel wrote:

So, I'm confused. Do we have free markets or not? You can't play both sides of this.

What? I can't? I most certainly can!

There is no such thing as an ideal "Free Market".

It is a set of assumptions made up by economists, which have never existed in reality.

However, many Libertarians & other idealists argue that such a thing does exist. They are 100% wrong, but they are in love with the ideal, and based on their emotional attachment they refuse to talk sense, but instead make up all sorts of half-assed excuses for the "distortions"

Each real transaction in our economy is distorted from the "Free Market" ideal by countless factors.

So, the best that reasonably could be argued is that we have a "Distorted Free Market". However, since we cannot identify all the "distortions" what that "Market" really is cannot be defined, which is why the economists have so much trouble attempting to reach agreement to predict what it will do.

This "Distorted Free Market" is the strategy for many items we sell and buy, addressing your point about having an energy policy. It is not "long-term" as Markets are existential. What forward looking in time distortions there are have been created via laws, such as subsidizing the purchase of BEV's, and thousands of other distortions. Proponents of these will argue that they are needed to counter other distortions in the "Free Market". This IMO is what you are thinking of when you suggest a "long term energy policy"

Is this going to be on the mid-term?

by **kingstonlake** 2022-03-10, 11:58

No idea why people continue to defend inflation. Current situation is 100% traceable to failed tax cut policy, pandemic mismanagement, corporate friendly policy, and deregulation.

by **Floyd Robertson** 2022-03-10, 12:29

[tw]1501943076775862282[/tw]

by **Trapper Gus** 2022-03-11, 08:42

Current WTI Oil price right now is 113.9 USD

A few days ago, oil prices were over 130 USD

In reality, cutting off Russia from the Free World will cause Russia oil to flow to China, and China will get a discount, lowering oil prices.

The experts are using questionable logic regarding oil prices.

by AvgMSUJoe 2022-03-11, 08:49

Floyd Robertson wrote:[tw]1501943076775862282[/tw]

Whatever happened with the proposal limiting foreign companies/govts from purchasing politicians? Why doesn't the msm ask the pols why they are so keen on pushing a Canadian oil company on us?

by **Trapper Gus** 2022-03-11, 09:02

AvgMSUJoe wrote:
Floyd Robertson wrote:[tw]1501943076775862282[/tw]
Whatever happened with the proposal limiting foreign companies/govts from purchasing politicians? Why doesn't the msm ask the pols why they are so keen on pushing a Canadian oil company on us?

Foreign companies/governments are people who have 1st Amendment Rights, too, according tSCOTUS which is stacked full of Justices whose first alliance it to corporations/foreign governments.

Since 90% of voters don't understand how much power tSCOTUS has they don't care that their voting for Republicans has stacked the Court with elites who believe that only money has rights.

by **Trapper Gus** 2022-03-17, 09:02

Worth noting: To the degree the U.S. does still import oil, more of it is coming from our closest ally. Canada was the source of 51% of U.S. petroleum imports in the first 10 months of 2021, compared with 8% from the Persian Gulf.

https://www.axios.com/us-energy-independent-petroleum-2982ed18-9110-4c31-ad67-82abe643f661.html

by RQA 2022-03-17, 10:32

Where will we get to first?

$3/gallon gas or $5/gallon gas.

Biden gas prices $3->$4->$5->$6? - Page 3 2753

by **Trapper Gus** 2022-03-17, 11:02

RQA wrote:Where will we get to first?

$3/gallon gas or $5/gallon gas.

The Republicans and the oil companies, who didn't invest their Trump tax cut dollars in capital investment. aka drilling, but instead did stock buy backs to increase the wealth of the 1%, will cause gas prices to go up.

by **Trapper Gus** 2022-03-17, 15:25

”Principles always matter, and they matter most when they are under pressure,” Robertson said in the Koch Industries statement. The principle at work here, as journalist Jane Mayer suggests, is profit.

Mayer, who wrote the definitive exposé of the Kochs in Dark Money: The Hidden History of the Billionaires Behind the Rise of the Radical Right, tweeted: “Given how small Koch says its Russian operation is, hard not to see this as purely symbolic, sending the message that all Koch’s talk of rights and liberty means nothing. Making money is what they value.”

by **NigelUno** 2022-03-17, 15:27

RQA wrote:Where will we get to first?

$3/gallon gas or $5/gallon gas.

If you're a shareholder, you want $5/gallon.

Hope that helps you understand a few things also.

You're welcome.

by **GRR Spartan** 2022-03-17, 16:47

RQA wrote:Where will we get to first?

$3/gallon gas or $5/gallon gas.

Why do you care? If you really own your own business you’ve got your vehicles registered under the business name and buy gas with business credit/debit cards that show up as tax deductions.

by RQA 2022-03-17, 16:55

NigelUno wrote:
If you're a shareholder, you want $5/gallon.

Hope that helps you understand a few things also.

You're welcome.

I went in on MRO at $3/share.

by RQA 2022-03-17, 17:20

GRR Spartan wrote:
RQA wrote:Where will we get to first?

$3/gallon gas or $5/gallon gas.

Why do you care? If you really own your own business you’ve got your vehicles registered under the business name and buy gas with business credit/debit cards that show up as tax deductions.

My business vehicles are registered to the business. My personal vehicles are registered to me.

You seem to be advocating tax fraud.

by **NigelUno** 2022-03-17, 17:41

RQA wrote:
NigelUno wrote:
If you're a shareholder, you want $5/gallon.

Hope that helps you understand a few things also.

You're welcome.

I went in on MRO at $3/share.

Sure you did.

And IF you did, then you obviously understand why gas prices are high right now.

And this thread is just a straight up troll job. I mean...we all knew that anyway.

by PennSpartan 2022-03-17, 17:49

I just love these gas prices. It puts the trailer park Trumpers in a real quandary. “Do I buy gas or ammo?” Biden gas prices $3->$4->$5->$6? - Page 3 2803167989

by Pervis Muldoon 2022-03-17, 18:09

I just opened a business in direct competition with RQA's. Customers are already leaving him in droves and beating down my doors, even though my prices are higher. They say they're tired of dishonesty, incompetence and racism.

by **Trapper Gus** 2022-03-17, 19:11

RQA wrote:
NigelUno wrote:
If you're a shareholder, you want $5/gallon.

Hope that helps you understand a few things also.

You're welcome.

I went in on MRO at $3/share.

MRO hasn't been that low since 1962

by RQA 2022-03-17, 22:11

Trapper Gus wrote:

MRO hasn't been that low since 1962

MRO was 3 dollars and change in March 2020

by **NigelUno** 2022-03-17, 23:18

RQA wrote:
Trapper Gus wrote:

MRO hasn't been that low since 1962

MRO was 3 dollars and change in March 2020

Why did you start this thread if you're rooting for higher gas prices so you can make money?

And why deflect and blame Biden when you know why gas prices are up?

Do you enjoy being a hypocrite?

by RQA 2022-03-17, 23:43

NigelUno wrote:

Why did you start this thread if you're rooting for higher gas prices so you can make money?

If I wanted to make money off of higher gas prices I would have bought MPC not MRO

by **NigelUno** 2022-03-18, 08:31

RQA wrote:
NigelUno wrote:

Why did you start this thread if you're rooting for higher gas prices so you can make money?

If I wanted to make money off of higher gas prices I would have bought MPC not MRO

Weird deflection.

I mean...you bragged about buying MRO low and it's gone up. So, you're not making money?

Odd you skipped the other questions.*

*(Not really)

by **NigelUno** 2022-03-18, 08:35

RQA wrote:
NigelUno wrote:

You are literally rooting for Putin/Russia.

Putin benefits from higher oil prices.

What do I favor?

Drill! Drill! Drill!
Reopen federal lands for oil development
Support pipelines including Keystone
Fracking!!
Nuclear energy

All of which would reduce the price of oil and hurt Putin.

So, literally, I am not rooting for Putin/Russia.

But feel free to continue with your dishonesty.

As as owner of MRO (unless you made that up), you are benefiting from higher oil prices. Just like Putin.

Odd you didn't mention that when you started the thread.

by AvgMSUJoe 2022-03-18, 08:43

[tw]1504073842871963653[/tw]

by AvgMSUJoe 2022-03-18, 08:44

I do see it jumped since this tweet, but it should still be less then $4 based on history.

by **Cameron** 2022-03-18, 10:23

This is how capitalism works. You don't charge the price that would bring you a reasonable profit margin, you charge the highest price the market will bear, then shower the CEO with money.

by Bredo Morstoel 2022-03-18, 11:32

Trapper Gus wrote:
RQA wrote:

I went in on MRO at $3/share.

MRO hasn't been that low since 1962

Says the guy that was shown to blatantly lie about Ford gains on the other board. Biden gas prices $3->$4->$5->$6? - Page 3 502811600

by **Motown Spartan** 2022-03-18, 12:50

MRO was in the $3 range in March of 2020 and in the $4 range in October of 2020.

by **Trapper Gus** 2022-03-18, 16:43

MRO

RQA is talking the same way I did.

Lowest MRO has been recently was $3.29 March 1st 2020.

He was claiming $3.00 ...

I can accept he was speaking, as I was, about Ford, in generalities.

However, since you are being it up, you can start ragging on him about his lie.

by RQA 2022-03-19, 10:07

NigelUno wrote:

I mean...you bragged about buying MRO low and it's gone up. So, you're not making money?

Yes. On higher oil prices, not higher gas prices.

You are really bad at this. I hope a professional manages your money for you.

by RQA 2022-03-19, 10:08

Trapper Gus wrote:

Lowest MRO has been recently was $3.29 March 1st 2020.

He was claiming $3.00 ...

Oh, I am such a liar. Biden gas prices $3->$4->$5->$6? - Page 3 2803167989

by **Trapper Gus** 2022-03-19, 10:10

RQA wrote:
Trapper Gus wrote:

Lowest MRO has been recently was $3.29 March 1st 2020.

He was claiming $3.00 ...

Oh, I am such a liar.

The Lier from Crete defense doesn't work in this case, dude.

You lied and unlike me you are doubling down on your lie.

by **Trapper Gus** 2022-03-19, 10:12

RQA wrote:
NigelUno wrote:

I mean...you bragged about buying MRO low and it's gone up. So, you're not making money?

Yes. On higher oil prices, not higher gas prices.

You are really bad at this. I hope a professional manages your money for you.

I would say that sometimes I wonder about how stupid you are, but that wouldn't be correct. It is all the time.

btw - because you apparently don't know this, one of the major products produced from oil is gasoline and as MRO's Web page claims, they are the Nation's Largest Refiner

by **Motown Spartan** 2022-03-19, 11:36

Is $3.29 the closing price? Because the intraday price could have gone that low.

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