Why is the Women's team not hosting games in the NCAA Tournament?

Is the circus in town or something?

I think Hollis made another mistake and instead had a contract with high school hoops.

Giant Moose wrote:I think Hollis made another mistake and instead had a contract with high school hoops.

Would it still be a mistake if the contract was made before the NCAA allowed the on campus hosting?

LooseGoose wrote:

Giant Moose wrote:I think Hollis made another mistake and instead had a contract with high school hoops.

Would it still be a mistake if the contract was made before the NCAA allowed the on campus hosting?

Yes. It's not complicated contract stuff. The contract with the high school tournament should have had a clause to let MSU renegotiate or back-out in case MSU needed the venue. And then Hollis should have used that clause as soon as the NCAA passed this rule.

The NCAA didn't pass this rule without notice. He would have some time to address the issue, but instead it appears there was no clause and it blew up in his face. If there was a clause and he didn't use it, then he seems content with hurting the women's basketball program. Either way, it's not good.

Hollis does a lot of good for MSU, but he gets owned in these contract things sometimes.

LooseGoose wrote:

Giant Moose wrote:I think Hollis made another mistake and instead had a contract with high school hoops.

Would it still be a mistake if the contract was made before the NCAA allowed the on campus hosting?

Is Hollis in charge of leasing Breslin?

I'm going to guess no, but I could be wrong.

Giant Moose wrote:

LooseGoose wrote:

Would it still be a mistake if the contract was made before the NCAA allowed the on campus hosting?

Yes. It's not complicated contract stuff. The contract with the high school tournament should have had a clause to let MSU renegotiate or back-out in case MSU needed the venue. And then Hollis should have used that clause as soon as the NCAA passed this rule.

The NCAA didn't pass this rule without notice. He would have some time to address the issue, but instead it appears there was no clause and it blew up in his face. If there was a clause and he didn't use it, then he seems content with hurting the women's basketball program. Either way, it's not good.

Hollis does a lot of good for MSU, but he gets owned in these contract things sometimes.

Telling the MHSAA to move their games with four days' notice doesn't seem like the right thing to do.

Floyd Robertson wrote:

Giant Moose wrote:
Yes. It's not complicated contract stuff. The contract with the high school tournament should have had a clause to let MSU renegotiate or back-out in case MSU needed the venue. And then Hollis should have used that clause as soon as the NCAA passed this rule.

The NCAA didn't pass this rule without notice. He would have some time to address the issue, but instead it appears there was no clause and it blew up in his face. If there was a clause and he didn't use it, then he seems content with hurting the women's basketball program. Either way, it's not good.

Hollis does a lot of good for MSU, but he gets owned in these contract things sometimes.

Telling the MHSAA to move their games with four days' notice doesn't seem like the right thing to do.

It wouldn't have been 4 days notice. It would have been when the NCAA passed the rule.

Giant Moose wrote:

Floyd Robertson wrote:

Telling the MHSAA to move their games with four days' notice doesn't seem like the right thing to do.

It wouldn't have been 4 days notice. It would have been when the NCAA passed the rule.

Well, "or back-out in case MSU needed the venue" sounds like just that.

Giant Moose wrote:

Floyd Robertson wrote:

Telling the MHSAA to move their games with four days' notice doesn't seem like the right thing to do.

It wouldn't have been 4 days notice. It would have been when the NCAA passed the rule.

So, never host the MHSAA again?

Floyd Robertson wrote:

Giant Moose wrote:
It wouldn't have been 4 days notice. It would have been when the NCAA passed the rule.

Well, "or back-out in case MSU needed the venue" sounds like just that.

Once MSU knew of the rule change then they knew they may need the venue.

NigelUno wrote:

Giant Moose wrote:
It wouldn't have been 4 days notice. It would have been when the NCAA passed the rule.

So, never host the MHSAA again?

Dates of a high school tourney can't be moved?

Defend MSU at all costs even when we look stupid! Swarm, swarm!

Giant Moose wrote:

NigelUno wrote:

So, never host the MHSAA again?

Dates of a high school tourney can't be moved?

Now, you want to change the dates? And not the venue?

Not sure what fantasy world you're living in, but I don't think the MHSAA would book an arena knowing they might have to push back an event a week.

Giant Moose wrote:Defend MSU at all costs even when we look stupid! Swarm, swarm!

Is Hollis in charge of booking events for Breslin?

NigelUno wrote:

Giant Moose wrote:
Dates of a high school tourney can't be moved?

Now, you want to change the dates? And not the venue?

Not sure what fantasy world you're living in, but I don't think the MHSAA would book an arena knowing they might have to push back an event a week.

Then fuck them. It's for MSU not them.

NigelUno wrote:

Giant Moose wrote:Defend MSU at all costs even when we look stupid! Swarm, swarm!

Is Hollis in charge of booking events for Breslin?

You really think the athletic director has no say in athletic events at Breslin?

Giant Moose wrote:

NigelUno wrote:

Is Hollis in charge of booking events for Breslin?

You really think the athletic director has no say in athletic events at Breslin?

Is Hollis in charge of booking events for Breslin?

NigelUno wrote:

Giant Moose wrote:
You really think the athletic director has no say in athletic events at Breslin?

Is Hollis in charge of booking events for Breslin?

Please provide a link where it says Hollis has no input on athletic events at Breslin.

Giant Moose wrote:

NigelUno wrote:

Now, you want to change the dates? And not the venue?

Not sure what fantasy world you're living in, but I don't think the MHSAA would book an arena knowing they might have to push back an event a week.

Then fuck them. It's for MSU not them.

And to further answer your question...

No, you can't push the girls tournament back a week, because the boys tournament uses it the following week.

Giant Moose wrote:

NigelUno wrote:

Is Hollis in charge of booking events for Breslin?

Please provide a link where it says Hollis has no input on athletic events at Breslin.

Is Hollis in charge of booking events for Breslin?

NigelUno wrote:

Giant Moose wrote:
Then fuck them. It's for MSU not them.

And to further answer your question...

No, you can't push the girls tournament back a week, because the boys tournament uses it the following week.

And that can't be pushed back a week? High school sports are serious stuff. It's OK to admit that MSU and Hollis make mistakes, Nigel. duffy won't really take your Spartan card away.

Giant Moose wrote:

NigelUno wrote:

And to further answer your question...

No, you can't push the girls tournament back a week, because the boys tournament uses it the following week.

And that can't be pushed back a week? High school sports are serious stuff. It's OK to admit that MSU and Hollis make mistakes, Nigel. duffy won't really take your Spartan card away.

Is Hollis in charge of booking events for Breslin?

NigelUno wrote:

Giant Moose wrote:
And that can't be pushed back a week? High school sports are serious stuff. It's OK to admit that MSU and Hollis make mistakes, Nigel. duffy won't really take your Spartan card away.

Is Hollis in charge of booking events for Breslin?

So he's not quoted in the press release of the MHSAA and Breslin Center announcement? You look really foolish.

https://www.mhsaa.com/news/press-releases/articletype/articleview/articleid/261/mhsaa-basketball-finals-to-stay-at-breslin-center-through-2017-march-magic-hoopfest-to-continue

Sure seems like a guy who didn't play any part in the contract negotiation...

“When you think of some of the greatest moments in the Michigan high school basketball tournament, they took place on this campus, and it is that history that we want to continue to be a part of,” said Mark Hollis, director of intercollegiate athletics at Michigan State University. “Many of us grew up watching the games in Jenison Field House when it was the toughest ticket in the state to obtain, and we’re pleased to be providing today’s student-athletes with the great experience of being on this campus and playing in one of the nation’s premiere basketball arenas. It’s great for our University and community to host teams and fans from across our State for this terrific event”

Giant Moose wrote:

NigelUno wrote:

Is Hollis in charge of booking events for Breslin?

So he's not quoted in the press release of the MHSAA and Breslin Center announcement? You look really foolish.

https://www.mhsaa.com/news/press-releases/articletype/articleview/articleid/261/mhsaa-basketball-finals-to-stay-at-breslin-center-through-2017-march-magic-hoopfest-to-continue

It looks like he is quoted. That doesn't mean he is in charge of booking events for Breslin.

It also says the MHSAA has a contract with the University, not the Athletic Department.

Cool, from now on I'm going to refer to our sports teams as the Michigan State University Athletic Department Spartans.

Giant Moose wrote:Cool, from now on I'm going to refer to our sports teams as the Michigan State University Athletic Department Spartans.

OK. Not sure what that means.

Do local high schools contact Hollis to use Breslin for commencement ceremonies also? Maybe you could find a quote on that.

NigelUno wrote:

Giant Moose wrote:Cool, from now on I'm going to refer to our sports teams as the Michigan State University Athletic Department Spartans.

OK. Not sure what that means.

Do local high schools contact Hollis to use Breslin for commencement ceremonies also? Maybe you could find a quote on that.

I think you are missing a key point. The high school basketball tourney is an athletic event. If you think our AD isn't involved in athletic events, then I don't know what to tell you.

Giant Moose wrote:

NigelUno wrote:

OK. Not sure what that means.

Do local high schools contact Hollis to use Breslin for commencement ceremonies also? Maybe you could find a quote on that.

I think you are missing a key point. The high school basketball tourney is an athletic event. If you think our AD isn't involved in athletic events, then I don't know what to tell you.

It is clear you don't know what to tell me. Because, you don't really know.

Nigel obsesses over technicality that Breslin isn't an athletic department-owned building. Hollis and MSU deserve no blame for screwing over our women's hoops team.

MSU is the best!

Giant Moose wrote:Cool, from now on I'm going to refer to our sports teams as the Michigan State University Athletic Department Spartans.

You get worked up over the stupidest things, and then spaz out like Costello. How's Byrd doing this morning?

So MSU is supposed to leave a venue open, probably years in advance on the offchance that the woman's BBall team is ranked high enough in the WBB NCAA tournament, that they get to play at home? Or the University can have a contract with the state of Michigan public schools, setup years in advance for guaranteed revenue, in an event that brings in high school kids? Wouldn't this more be a call for President LAKS?

InTenSity wrote:So MSU is supposed to leave a venue open, probably years in advance on the offchance that the woman's BBall team is ranked high enough in the WBB NCAA tournament, that they get to play at home? Or the University can have a contract with the state of Michigan public schools, setup years in advance for guaranteed revenue, in an event that brings in high school kids? Wouldn't this more be a call for President LAKS?

So MSU shouldn't do what it takes to support one of its major sports? It's OK that we've screwed the women's hoops team?

Watch Out Pylon! wrote:

Giant Moose wrote:Cool, from now on I'm going to refer to our sports teams as the Michigan State University Athletic Department Spartans.

You get worked up over the stupidest things, and then spaz out like Costello. How's Byrd doing this morning?

His wife is probably pissed that MSU screwed over the women's hoops team.

Watch Out Pylon! wrote:

Giant Moose wrote:Cool, from now on I'm going to refer to our sports teams as the Michigan State University Athletic Department Spartans.

You get worked up over the stupidest things, and then spaz out like Costello. How's Byrd doing this morning?

is that the guy that kissed the floor?

I get them confused.

LooseGoose wrote:

Giant Moose wrote:I think Hollis made another mistake and instead had a contract with high school hoops.

Would it still be a mistake if the contract was made before the NCAA allowed the on campus hosting?  

I believe the NCAA reverted to on campus sites for the Top 16 seeds in 2013, and the MHSAA contract was signed in 2011.  A back out clause, or a 'Hey, can you just change the dates' clause, or a 'Hey, can you just go somewhere else' clause was apparently not put in the contract ahead of time.  

Incidentally, a few #1 seeds did not play on campus as a result of the change (and possibly having their venue booked for other events).

What are the costs/benefits associated with hosting these two events? Which one, after accounting for any costs associated with hosting, do you think provides MSU with a greater benefit?

Turtleneck wrote:What are the costs/benefits associated with hosting these two events? Which one, after accounting for any costs associated with hosting, do you think provides MSU with a greater benefit?

I don't know.. I suspect people have more interest in state championship level high school hoops. I know I do - EL wins tonight, they're playing Friday at 2:50..  

and, for what it's worth to the MSU yahoos.. there is a kid at East Lansing who will be playing for MSU next year.

We should just offer to play all of our games on aircraft carriers and let Lansing high schools have the Breslin Center.

Giant Moose wrote:We should just offer to play all of our games on aircraft carriers and let Lansing high schools have the Breslin Center.

I've often advocated that Hollis arrange a game to be played on the body of George Perles.. this might just be the opportunity.