Flavor Solutions

http://nypost.com/2015/04/26/why-nothing-especially-chicken-tastes-like-it-used-to/

Excerpt:

It’s an old joke — if you can’t describe a flavor, say it “tastes like chicken.” But chicken wasn’t always synonymous with generic. Chicken used to be flavorful, expensive. As author Mark Schatzker describes in his new book, “The Dorito Effect,” that all changed starting in 1948, with a contest to make chickens more plentiful — and less delicious.

This problem also affects everything we eat in America, not just meats or fish.

Anyone who travels to Europe inevitably wonders why does the food taste so much better there. There is also the theory that Americans are such fat asses because we eat flavorless foods and eat more in search of some flavor.

You do realize that our whole agriculture business is now based on capitalism, right? There is basically an unlimited supply of consumers, their health doesn't matter that much and profits run everything. Food is cheap in the US, and there is a reason for that, don't ever think that even though a corporation has the same rights as a person, that they ever think people are worth anything.

InTenSity wrote:You do realize that our whole agriculture business is now based on capitalism, right? There is basically an unlimited supply of consumers, their health doesn't matter that much and profits run everything. Food is cheap in the US, and there is a reason for that, don't ever think that even though a corporation has the same rights as a person, that they ever think people are worth anything.

I'm starting to have my doubts in capitalism.

Green Note wrote:http://nypost.com/2015/04/26/why-nothing-especially-chicken-tastes-like-it-used-to/

Excerpt:

It’s an old joke — if you can’t describe a flavor, say it “tastes like chicken.” But chicken wasn’t always synonymous with generic. Chicken used to be flavorful, expensive. As author Mark Schatzker describes in his new book, “The Dorito Effect,” that all changed starting in 1948, with a contest to make chickens more plentiful — and less delicious.

This problem also affects everything we eat in America, not just meats or fish.

Anyone who travels to Europe inevitably wonders why does the food taste so much better there. There is also the theory that Americans are such fat asses because we eat flavorless foods and eat more in search of some flavor.

Problem in apples, too. The Red Delicious used to be a very good apple, until Washington state figured out how to grow it on a mass-produced scale with better color to sell more. Now, thanks to the apple industry there, you only get 5-6 varieties in most stores that are pretty bland compared to apples grown on smaller farms in NY and MI.

HT wrote:

Green Note wrote:http://nypost.com/2015/04/26/why-nothing-especially-chicken-tastes-like-it-used-to/

Excerpt:

It’s an old joke — if you can’t describe a flavor, say it “tastes like chicken.” But chicken wasn’t always synonymous with generic. Chicken used to be flavorful, expensive. As author Mark Schatzker describes in his new book, “The Dorito Effect,” that all changed starting in 1948, with a contest to make chickens more plentiful — and less delicious.

This problem also affects everything we eat in America, not just meats or fish.

Anyone who travels to Europe inevitably wonders why does the food taste so much better there. There is also the theory that Americans are such fat asses because we eat flavorless foods and eat more in search of some flavor.

Problem in apples, too. The Red Delicious used to be a very good apple, until Washington state figured out how to grow it on a mass-produced scale with better color to sell more. Now, thanks to the apple industry there, you only get 5-6 varieties in most stores that are pretty bland compared to apples grown on smaller farms in NY and MI.

This is true. I noticed at the store yesterday that they had replaced the "Red Delicious" apple sign with one that said, "Red It's OK I Guess" apple.

HT wrote:

Green Note wrote:http://nypost.com/2015/04/26/why-nothing-especially-chicken-tastes-like-it-used-to/

Excerpt:

It’s an old joke — if you can’t describe a flavor, say it “tastes like chicken.” But chicken wasn’t always synonymous with generic. Chicken used to be flavorful, expensive. As author Mark Schatzker describes in his new book, “The Dorito Effect,” that all changed starting in 1948, with a contest to make chickens more plentiful — and less delicious.

This problem also affects everything we eat in America, not just meats or fish.

Anyone who travels to Europe inevitably wonders why does the food taste so much better there. There is also the theory that Americans are such fat asses because we eat flavorless foods and eat more in search of some flavor.

Washington state .

Washington has overrated apples. I skip Washington apples at the store. While we are here, Wisconsin dairy is overrated, too.

Turtleneck wrote:

HT wrote:

Washington state .

Washington has overrated apples. I skip Washington apples at the store. While we are here, Wisconsin dairy is overrated, too.

LMFAO...
"Wisconsin Cheese wins more national and international awards than any other state or country. Our tradition of cheesemaking excellence began more than 150 years ago and many of these historic methods are practiced unchanged today."

http://www.eatwisconsincheese.com/wisconsin-cheese/awards

InTenSity wrote:You do realize that our whole agriculture business is now based on capitalism, right? There is basically an unlimited supply of consumers, their health doesn't matter that much and profits run everything. Food is cheap in the US, and there is a reason for that, don't ever think that even though a corporation has the same rights as a person, that they ever think people are worth anything.

I think you missed the memo.. corporations are people.

Eat the dark meat. That's where the flavor is. The beasts are dry and bland.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/27/business/chipotle-to-stop-serving-genetically-altered-food.html

Big corporation, Chipolte moving away from GMOs along with other corporate giants like Whole Foods. The market seems to be working.

Green Note wrote:http://nypost.com/2015/04/26/why-nothing-especially-chicken-tastes-like-it-used-to/

Excerpt:

It’s an old joke — if you can’t describe a flavor, say it “tastes like chicken.” But chicken wasn’t always synonymous with generic. Chicken used to be flavorful, expensive. As author Mark Schatzker describes in his new book, “The Dorito Effect,” that all changed starting in 1948, with a contest to make chickens more plentiful — and less delicious.

This problem also affects everything we eat in America, not just meats or fish.

Anyone who travels to Europe inevitably wonders why does the food taste so much better there. There is also the theory that Americans are such fat asses because we eat flavorless foods and eat more in search of some flavor.

why would I ever travel to Europe? I have everything I need right here in 'Merica.. my walker, my insulin pump, and my diabetic supplies are all right here in the good 'ol US of A.

CheesySpartan wrote:

Turtleneck wrote:

Washington has overrated apples. I skip Washington apples at the store. While we are here, Wisconsin dairy is overrated, too.

LMFAO...
"Wisconsin Cheese wins more national and international awards than any other state or country. Our tradition of cheesemaking excellence began more than 150 years ago and many of these historic methods are practiced unchanged today."

http://www.eatwisconsincheese.com/wisconsin-cheese/awards

Vermont dairy > Wisconsin dairy. Vermont production is way lower by comparison. Nowhere close to California or Wisconsin in terms of volume, but Vermont puts out some good dairy products.

Turtleneck wrote:

CheesySpartan wrote:

LMFAO...
"Wisconsin Cheese wins more national and international awards than any other state or country. Our tradition of cheesemaking excellence began more than 150 years ago and many of these historic methods are practiced unchanged today."

http://www.eatwisconsincheese.com/wisconsin-cheese/awards

Vermont dairy > Wisconsin dairy. Vermont production is way lower by comparison. Nowhere close to California or Wisconsin in terms of volume, but Vermont puts out some good dairy products.

Agreed. It's like that with apples, too where NY has way better apples but produces less (and I'd argue we grow better peaches than Georgia, too). The state's known for products aren't necessarily making/growing the best products. They can just do so on a larger scale and/or marketed themselves way better for a long time.

CheesySpartan wrote:

Turtleneck wrote:

Washington has overrated apples. I skip Washington apples at the store. While we are here, Wisconsin dairy is overrated, too.

LMFAO...
"Wisconsin Cheese wins more national and international awards than any other state or country. Our tradition of cheesemaking excellence began more than 150 years ago and many of these historic methods are practiced unchanged today."

http://www.eatwisconsincheese.com/wisconsin-cheese/awards

Your beer is overrated too. New Glarus Spotted Cow tastes like an overpriced Molson Canadian.

HT wrote:

Turtleneck wrote:

Vermont dairy > Wisconsin dairy. Vermont production is way lower by comparison. Nowhere close to California or Wisconsin in terms of volume, but Vermont puts out some good dairy products.

Agreed. It's like that with apples, too where NY has way better apples but produces less (and I'd argue we grow better peaches than Georgia, too). The state's known for products aren't necessarily making/growing the best products. They can just do so on a larger scale and/or marketed themselves way better for a long time.

California is becoming known as a dairy state, but that is based on sheer volume of production. They produce more dairy than any other state (that really bugs the Wisconsin crowd) but I do not think there is anything special about California dairy products.

As for NY, it's agriculture is underrated.  Probably because people think NY is pretty much NY city. They do not realize how rural the state actually is, and do not think about NY products when making choices. They just connect Washington to apples and think they produce the best apples.

HT wrote:

CheesySpartan wrote:

LMFAO...
"Wisconsin Cheese wins more national and international awards than any other state or country. Our tradition of cheesemaking excellence began more than 150 years ago and many of these historic methods are practiced unchanged today."

http://www.eatwisconsincheese.com/wisconsin-cheese/awards

Your beer is overrated too. New Glarus Spotted Cow tastes like an overpriced Molson Canadian.

I wonder why bars in other states are selling it illegally then???

http://chicagoist.com/2015/04/21/no_spotted_cow_for_you_minnesota_ba.php

CheesySpartan wrote:

HT wrote:

Your beer is overrated too. New Glarus Spotted Cow tastes like an overpriced Molson Canadian.

I wonder why bars in other states are selling it illegally then???

http://chicagoist.com/2015/04/21/no_spotted_cow_for_you_minnesota_ba.php

\

Don't you have some cows to milk, Wisconsinite?

Turtleneck wrote:

HT wrote:

Agreed. It's like that with apples, too where NY has way better apples but produces less (and I'd argue we grow better peaches than Georgia, too). The state's known for products aren't necessarily making/growing the best products. They can just do so on a larger scale and/or marketed themselves way better for a long time.

California is becoming known as a dairy state, but that is based on sheer volume of production. They produce more dairy than any other state (that really bugs the Wisconsin crowd) but I do not think there is anything special about California dairy products.

As for NY, it's agriculture is underrated.  Probably because people think NY is pretty much NY city. They do not realize how rural the state actually is, and do not think about NY products when making choices. They just connect Washington to apples and think they produce the best apples.

Doesn't bug me...Quality over quantity all day long. BTW here is the breakdown of dairy awards at last years world dairy expo. Of course, you'll notice that WI is listed far more then other state but hey don't let that fact influence your own fact-less statement.

http://www.worlddairyexpo.com/pages/World-Dairy-Expo-Dairy-Championship-Dairy-Product-Contest.php

http://www.worlddairyexpo.com/file_open.php?id=150

Turtleneck wrote:

CheesySpartan wrote:

I wonder why bars in other states are selling it illegally then???

http://chicagoist.com/2015/04/21/no_spotted_cow_for_you_minnesota_ba.php

\

Don't you have some cows to milk, Wisconsinite?

Nope...never milked a cow bro...nice come back though

CheesySpartan wrote:

Turtleneck wrote:\

Don't you have some cows to milk, Wisconsinite?

Nope...never milked a cow bro...nice come back though

You really take your dairy awards seriously.

Also, the quality versus quantity thing does not apply to Vermont since Wisconsin produces more than Vermont. Wisconsin is the second largest producer or dairy after California. Vermont is not a top 10 dairy state in terms of production, and probably not even a top 15.

HT wrote:

CheesySpartan wrote:

LMFAO...
"Wisconsin Cheese wins more national and international awards than any other state or country. Our tradition of cheesemaking excellence began more than 150 years ago and many of these historic methods are practiced unchanged today."

http://www.eatwisconsincheese.com/wisconsin-cheese/awards

Your beer is overrated too. New Glarus Spotted Cow tastes like an overpriced Molson Canadian.

I'll just leave this here...http://www.newglarusbrewing.com/index.cfm/beers/awards

Turtleneck wrote:

CheesySpartan wrote:

Nope...never milked a cow bro...nice come back though

You really take your dairy awards seriously.

I find it really helps to have FACTS like those when arguing about "Best Dairy State"....

CheesySpartan wrote:

Turtleneck wrote:

You really take your dairy awards seriously.

You don't have facts. You want to talks afacts. Do me a favor and find a way to make

I find it really helps to have FACTS like those when arguing about "Best Dairy State"....

Of course your facts do not account for the sizable variation in producers between the states, and how that impacts the number of contestants in something like the World Dairy Expo. In your analysis, I think you need to find a way to equally weight Wisconsin and Vermont entries and then create a model that tells how often each state should win a category versus how many they actually win. Or something like that. Also, the first link you use in the thread to justify Wisconsin's dairy supremacy is from a Wisconsin-based group whose mission is to promote Wisconsin dairy products. Not exactly a source anybody will take seriously given the nature of the conversation. Sorry if I am not taking your analysis of the best dairy states in the U.S. seriously.

Turtleneck wrote:

CheesySpartan wrote:

Nope...never milked a cow bro...nice come back though

You really take your dairy awards seriously.

Also, the quality versus quantity thing does not apply to Vermont since Wisconsin produces more than Vermont. Wisconsin is the second largest producer or dairy after California. Vermont is not a top 10 dairy state in terms of production, and probably not even a top 15.

I thought the discussion was about whether WI Dairy was "overrated"?

Last time... 2014 Wisconsin cheesemakers capture 40% of all awards presented at the World Championship Cheese Contest, including 29 awards won by Wisconsin Master Cheesemakers. VT had 10%.

Turtleneck wrote:

CheesySpartan wrote:

You don't have facts. You want to talks afacts. Do me a favor and find a way to make

I find it really helps to have FACTS like those when arguing about "Best Dairy State"....

Of course your facts do not account for the sizable variation in producers between the states, and how that impacts the number of contestants in something like the World Dairy Expo. In your analysis, I think you need to find a way to equally weight Wisconsin and Vermont entries and then create a model that tells how often each state should win a category versus how many they actually win. Or something like that. Also, the first link you use in the thread to justify Wisconsin's dairy supremacy is from a Wisconsin-based group whose mission is to promote Wisconsin dairy products. Not exactly a source anybody will take seriously given the nature of the conversation. Sorry if I am not taking your analysis of the best dairy states in the U.S. seriously.

What about the "World Dairy Expo" link? Is that objective enough you? Best is still the best regardless of how many entries you have in my opinion.

CheesySpartan wrote:

Turtleneck wrote:

Of course your facts do not account for the sizable variation in producers between the states, and how that impacts the number of contestants in something like the World Dairy Expo. In your analysis, I think you need to find a way to equally weight Wisconsin and Vermont entries and then create a model that tells how often each state should win a category versus how many they actually win. Or something like that. Also, the first link you use in the thread to justify Wisconsin's dairy supremacy is from a Wisconsin-based group whose mission is to promote Wisconsin dairy products. Not exactly a source anybody will take seriously given the nature of the conversation. Sorry if I am not taking your analysis of the best dairy states in the U.S. seriously.

What about the "World Dairy Expo" link?  Is that objective enough you?  Best is still the best regardless of how many entries you have in my opinion.

CheesySpartan wrote:

Turtleneck wrote:

Of course your facts do not account for the sizable variation in producers between the states, and how that impacts the number of contestants in something like the World Dairy Expo. In your analysis, I think you need to find a way to equally weight Wisconsin and Vermont entries and then create a model that tells how often each state should win a category versus how many they actually win. Or something like that. Also, the first link you use in the thread to justify Wisconsin's dairy supremacy is from a Wisconsin-based group whose mission is to promote Wisconsin dairy products. Not exactly a source anybody will take seriously given the nature of the conversation. Sorry if I am not taking your analysis of the best dairy states in the U.S. seriously.

What about the "World Dairy Expo" link?  Is that objective enough you?  Best is still the best regardless of how many entries you have in my opinion.

I do not disagree with you (best is best), but wonder if Wisconsin is punching at its weight while a smaller producer like Vermont is punching well above its weight. If I recall, Vermont  has fewer than 1,000 dairy farms where Wisconsin has thousands. Additionally, I should probably clarify that it is not that Wisconsin is overrated as much as we treat it as the best (just like we treat Washington apples as the best). I disagree. For me, Wisconsin is still top 3-5 but in my book not a lock for #1. For example, Vermont cheese is pretty solid stuff. Like super solid.

http://host.madison.com/news/local/vermont-cheese-takes-top-honors-at-american-cheese-society-event/article_b2c634d3-33dc-50ec-922b-4e560d436868.html

You know it's a slow day when we're arguing about dairy.

Watch Out Pylon! wrote:You know it's a slow day when we're arguing about dairy.

You got a beef with this thread, Pylon?

Watch Out Pylon! wrote:You know it's a slow day when we're arguing about dairy.

I've had to resist from joining the conversation multiple times.. I get real fired up when it comes to my state's dairy production.

Turtleneck wrote:

CheesySpartan wrote:

What about the "World Dairy Expo" link?  Is that objective enough you?  Best is still the best regardless of how many entries you have in my opinion.

CheesySpartan wrote:

What about the "World Dairy Expo" link?  Is that objective enough you?  Best is still the best regardless of how many entries you have in my opinion.

I do not disagree with you (best is best), but wonder if Wisconsin is punching at its weight while a smaller producer like Vermont is punching well above its weight. If I recall, Vermont  has fewer than 1,000 dairy farms where Wisconsin has thousands. Additionally, I should probably clarify that it is not that Wisconsin is overrated as much as we treat it as the best (just like we treat Washington apples as the best). I disagree. For me, Wisconsin is still top 3-5 but in my book not a lock for #1. For example, Vermont cheese is pretty solid stuff. Like super solid.

http://host.madison.com/news/local/vermont-cheese-takes-top-honors-at-american-cheese-society-event/article_b2c634d3-33dc-50ec-922b-4e560d436868.html

Yes WI has more farms but that doesn't necessary equate to more awards. Look at CA for example. If you consistently win best dairy product at the world expo that means you have an award-winning product and it has nothing to do with volume. WI has more award-winning dairy products then any other state and its not even close. VT produces some nice products but head-to-head, year-to-year, in category after category, its WI over and over.

Turtleneck wrote:

Watch Out Pylon! wrote:You know it's a slow day when we're arguing about dairy.

You got a beef with this thread, Pylon?

Quit milking this thread.

CheesySpartan wrote:

HT wrote:

Your beer is overrated too. New Glarus Spotted Cow tastes like an overpriced Molson Canadian.

I'll just leave this here...http://www.newglarusbrewing.com/index.cfm/beers/awards

Haha, it won an award 10 years ago and 20 years ago. Nice work.

New Glarus is hyped like crazy by Wisconsin people, but I've never heard a single outside craft beer aficionado who liked it. I think Founders in Grand Rapids is also similarly overhyped by starry eyed locals, but at least people in other places enjoy it.

Marc Summers wrote:

CheesySpartan wrote:

I'll just leave this here...http://www.newglarusbrewing.com/index.cfm/beers/awards

Haha, it won an award 10 years ago and 20 years ago. Nice work.

New Glarus is hyped like crazy by Wisconsin people, but I've never heard a single outside craft beer aficionado who liked it. I think Founders in Grand Rapids is also similarly overhyped by starry eyed locals, but at least people in other places enjoy it.

Their beers have won over 50 awards in the last ten years alone including dozens of them at the Great American Beer Festival (top in USA) but I guess that doesn't count in your book. The following is the brewery's list of awards...each beer also has its own on the link.

New Glarus Brewing Company
2012 Top 100 Food and Beverage Companies Inc.500|5000
2011 Top 100 Food and Beverage Companies Inc.500|5000
2011 Top 50 Craft Brewing Companies Brewers Association
2010 Best Breweries zymurgy
2010 Best Portfolios zymurgy
2010 Gold Medal - Top Brewers in the World Rate Beer - Santa Rosa, CA
2010 Gold Medal- Best Breweries to Visit Rate Beer - Santa Rosa, CA
2010 Top 100 Food and Beverage Companies Inc. 500|5000
2010 Wisconsin Companies to Watch Wisconsin Entrepreneurs’ Network
2009 Shared Savings Award Alliant Energy
2009 Gold Medal- Best Breweries to Visit Rate Beer - Santa Rosa, CA
2009 Gold Medal- Top Brewers in the World Rate Beer - Santa Rosa, CA
2009 Top 10 Breweries America's Best and Top 10
2009 Gold Medal Thirsty Troll Brewfest
2009 Madison's 5 Greenest Beers Examiner
2009 The 25 Best American Breweries of the Decade Paste Magazine
2009 Top 10 Midwest Craft Breweries BeerDorks
2009 Top 100 Food and Beverage Companies Inc. 500|5000
2009 Top 3 Midwest Craft Breweries The Full Pint
2009 Top 5 American Micro-Breweries Trifter
2009 Top 50 Craft Brewing Companies Brewers Association
2009 Top 50 Overall Brewing Companies Brewers Association
2009 Top Twenty Craft Beer Sales IRI
2009 Wisconsin's 10 Best Brews Moon Travel Guide
2008 Outstanding Business of the Year Green County Development Corporation
2008 Best Brewery Madison Beer Review
2008 Silver Medal - Best Microbrew of Madison Madison Magazine
2008 Silver Medal-People's Choice Award Between the Bluffs Beer & Cheese Festival
2008 All Time Top Breweries on Planet Earth BeerAdvocate Magazine
2008 9 Noteworthy Breweries Fine Living - On Television
2008 Top 10 Best Micro Brews Men's Fitness Magazine
2008 Top 10 Midwest Breweries BeerDorks
2008 Gold Medal- Top Brewers in the World Rate Beer - Santa Rosa, CA
2008 Top 100 Food and Beverage Companies Inc. 500|5000
2008 Top 10 Breweries America's Best and Top 10
2008 12 Top-Notch Midwest Breweries Chicago Sun-Times
2008 Top 50 Craft Brewing Companies Brewers Association
2008 Top 50 Overall Brewing Companies Brewers Association
2007 Gold Medal- Top 3 American Breweries SportingNews
2007 Dan Carey: Top 10 Tastemaker: Wine, Beer & Spirits Forbes
2007 Top 50 Overall Brewing Companies Brewers Association
2007 Top 50 Craft Brewing Companies Brewers Association
2007 Gold Medal- People's Choice Award Between the Bluffs Beer & Cheese Festival
2007 Gold Medal-Top Brewers in the World Rate Beer - Santa Rosa, CA
2007 Bronze Medal - Best Microbrew of Madison Madison Magazine
2007 25 Best Microbreweries in the Country TravelHacker
2007 Top 100 Food and Beverage Companies Inc. 500|5000
2007 Top 15 Best Portfolios zymurgy
2007 Top 15 Breweries zymurgy
2006 Dan Carey - Innovation in Craft Brewing Russell Schehrer Award - Brewers Association
2006 Dan Carey, Brewer of the Year (Midsize) Great American Beer Festival
2006 Brewery of the Year (Midsize) Great American Beer Festival
2006 Top 50 Overall Brewing Companies Brewers Association
2006 Top 50 'Craft Brewing' Companies Brewers Association
2006 All Time Top 25 Breweries on Planet Earth BeerAdvocate
2006 Top 10 Midwest Breweries BeerDorks
2006 10 Noteworthy Breweries Fine Living
2006 Bronze Medal - Best of Madison-Microbrew Madison Magazine
2006 Gold Medal- Top 100 Brewers in the World Rate Beer - Santa Rosa, CA
2005 Brewers of the Year (Mid-Size)-New Glarus Brewers Great American Beer Festival
2005 Brewery of the Year (Mid-Size) Association of Brewers - Great American Beer Festival
2005 Top 50 Breweries Brewers Association
2005 Best Local Beer The Badger Herald
2005 50 Best Brewers Rate Beer - Santa Rosa, CA
2005 50 Best Brewers CNN/Money
2004 10 Noteworthy Breweries (#4) Fine Living
2004 Top 100 Brewers in the World Rate Beer - Santa Rosa, CA

Marc Summers wrote:

CheesySpartan wrote:

I'll just leave this here...http://www.newglarusbrewing.com/index.cfm/beers/awards

Haha, it won an award 10 years ago and 20 years ago. Nice work.

New Glarus is hyped like crazy by Wisconsin people, but I've never heard a single outside craft beer aficionado who liked it. I think Founders in Grand Rapids is also similarly overhyped by starry eyed locals, but at least people in other places enjoy it.

For once, I actually agree with you. I've heard nothing but hype for New Glarus, but then when I finally tried it, I was really underwhelmed and felt like I was ripped off considering how much more expensive it is than Molson Canadian.

Turtleneck wrote:

HT wrote:

Agreed. It's like that with apples, too where NY has way better apples but produces less (and I'd argue we grow better peaches than Georgia, too). The state's known for products aren't necessarily making/growing the best products. They can just do so on a larger scale and/or marketed themselves way better for a long time.

California is becoming known as a dairy state, but that is based on sheer volume of production. They produce more dairy than any other state (that really bugs the Wisconsin crowd) but I do not think there is anything special about California dairy products.

As for NY, it's agriculture is underrated.  Probably because people think NY is pretty much NY city. They do not realize how rural the state actually is, and do not think about NY products when making choices. They just connect Washington to apples and think they produce the best apples.

Biochemically speaking, the cooler growing season in NY makes for much better development of flavor compounds in fruits like apples, peaches and grapes. We may not grow as much as California/Washington, but I would put the fruit we grow up against anywhere else in the world and feel good about our chances of winning. A classic example is the McIntosh. A Mac grown in NY has so much more color and flavor than a Mac grown in Washington that it's not even funny, and it's all because of Lake Ontario and our cooler growing season here.

When I was at Washington State for grad school, my dad would ship me Empires and Cortlands once we started picking them at home because I refused to eat any of the apples grown there (you get really picky about fruit if you grew up working an orchard). I'd hand them out to the ag school faculty, and they'd be blown away by the taste and they'd say how they never tasted an apple like that before and that those are what apples should taste like. They'd usually ask why you couldn't get Empires and Cortlands in Washington, either. Always felt really satisfying to see how much people liked those apples, especially after hearing about how great Washington apples were.

HT wrote:

Marc Summers wrote:
Haha, it won an award 10 years ago and 20 years ago. Nice work.

New Glarus is hyped like crazy by Wisconsin people, but I've never heard a single outside craft beer aficionado who liked it. I think Founders in Grand Rapids is also similarly overhyped by starry eyed locals, but at least people in other places enjoy it.

For once, I actually agree with you. I've heard nothing but hype for New Glarus, but then when I finally tried it, I was really underwhelmed and felt like I was ripped off considering how much more expensive it is than Molson Canadian.

The fact that you keep bringing up Molson is frickin hilarious. For starters son Molson Canadian is a pale lager while Spotted Cow is a farmhouse ale. You're young so I'll give you a pass...you can come back in 7-10 years and sit at the big boy beer table and we can have a real discussion then.

Watch Out Pylon! wrote:

Turtleneck wrote:

You got a beef with this thread, Pylon?

Quit milking this thread.

Stop egging me on.

CheesySpartan wrote:

Turtleneck wrote:


I do not disagree with you (best is best), but wonder if Wisconsin is punching at its weight while a smaller producer like Vermont is punching well above its weight. If I recall, Vermont  has fewer than 1,000 dairy farms where Wisconsin has thousands. Additionally, I should probably clarify that it is not that Wisconsin is overrated as much as we treat it as the best (just like we treat Washington apples as the best). I disagree. For me, Wisconsin is still top 3-5 but in my book not a lock for #1. For example, Vermont cheese is pretty solid stuff. Like super solid.

http://host.madison.com/news/local/vermont-cheese-takes-top-honors-at-american-cheese-society-event/article_b2c634d3-33dc-50ec-922b-4e560d436868.html

Yes WI has more farms but that doesn't necessary equate to more awards.  Look at CA for example.  If you consistently win best dairy product at the world expo that means you have an award-winning product and it has nothing to do with volume.  WI has more award-winning dairy products then any other state and its not even close.  VT produces some nice products but head-to-head, year-to-year, in category after category, its WI over and over.

I think Anheuser-Busch wins a lot of awards, too. But I would prefer a beer from Short's.

Turtleneck wrote:

CheesySpartan wrote:

Yes WI has more farms but that doesn't necessary equate to more awards.  Look at CA for example.  If you consistently win best dairy product at the world expo that means you have an award-winning product and it has nothing to do with volume.  WI has more award-winning dairy products then any other state and its not even close.  VT produces some nice products but head-to-head, year-to-year, in category after category, its WI over and over.

I think Anheuser-Busch wins a lot of awards, too. But I would prefer a beer from Short's.

That's your comeback???...yeah, we're done...I win.