More bad news for MSU: 16 gymnasts suing Dr. Nasser AND MSU (updated)

by **GRR Spartan** Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 10:16

MSU is in deep shit with this mess. LAKS and Hollis have a mess on their hands and it has already been linked to MSU Softball in addition to women's gymnastic team members and those coaching staffs essentially telling those athletes to be happy Dr Nasser was the team doctor.

I'm beginning to think this stuff is taking up a lot more time in the AD and University President's offices than anyone is admitting.

http://nymag.com/thecut/2017/01/16-ex-patients-sue-usa-gymnastics-doctor-larry-nassar-for-sexual-abuse.html

by **Watch Out Pylon!** Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 10:27

This is not good. Like I said in the other thread before it got stupid, all those found guilty of any wrongdoing better be punished properly. Firings/formal charges, whatever is deemed appropriate.

by Guest Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 10:34

Does either article say where they were patients? If so, I missed it. In the overall scope that means nothing. For it's impact on MSU it has some meaning. If much of this abuse and these assaults were occurring under MSU jurisdiction then the exposure to someone else knowing and not doing anything is obviously greater.

by **GRR Spartan** Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 10:49

This just broke at 9:30 am today, 1/10/17. Don't know if those filing will be indentified before trial.

16 athletes Dr Nasser is accused of assaulting/molesting of the 60 reported in the Indy Star series have filed suit against Nasser and MSU. Have to believe their lawyers are taking the avenue that MSU knew of complaints about Dr. Nasser from at least one softball player and gymnast and chose to do nothing.

We don't know what MSU did, if anything. What we do know is Dr. Nasser continued as a team physician for MSU teams after complaints were made about him and he continued to be a physician treating female athletes for USA Gymnastics after the MSU athletes lodged their complaints with MSU coaches and staff.

This has potential to be a legal nightmare and a PR disaster for Hollis and LAKS.

by TheReal_LWS Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 11:05

gHost Spartan wrote:But…. but…. Joe knew….

OUCH

by **The_Dude** Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 11:27

Wow, MSU had either admin types or others that knew and buried it. Sickening.

by **MiamiSpartan** Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 11:44

GRR Spartan wrote:This just broke at 9:30 am today, 1/10/17. Don't know if those filing will be indentified before trial.

16 athletes Dr Nasser is accused of assaulting/molesting of the 60 reported in the Indy Star series have filed suit against Nasser and MSU. Have to believe their lawyers are taking the avenue that MSU knew of complaints about Dr. Nasser from at least one softball player and gymnast and chose to do nothing.

We don't know what MSU did, if anything. What we do know is Dr. Nasser continued as a team physician for MSU teams after complaints were made about him and he continued to be a physician treating female athletes for USA Gymnastics after the MSU athletes lodged their complaints with MSU coaches and staff.

This has potential to be a legal nightmare and a PR disaster for Hollis and LAKS.

Of course the lawyers are going to do that regardless of whether anyone at MSU knew anything or not. They can't get much out of the doctor himself, and any winnings in a case will be spread out over 16 (and counting) plaintiffs.

I would think that the lawsuit wouldn't even need to show that anyone at MSU with any ability to do something about it even knew. At the very least, drag MSU's name through the mud, tons of bad PR, get a huge ass settlement from MSU to keep it from dragging further.

Disclaimer: This post is not in anyway meant to say or imply that MSU is clean on this, nor is it meant in any way to say or imply that MSU is not clean on this.

by **InTenSity** Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 11:46

The_Dude wrote:Wow, MSU had either admin types or others that knew and buried it. Sickening.

Looks like MSU will probably not be liable, now that instant conviction guy has chimed in.

by Da Mayor Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 11:50

Tanny, what's your legal take on this case?

by **Death Roe** Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 12:04

InTenSity wrote:
The_Dude wrote:Wow, MSU had either admin types or others that knew and buried it. Sickening.
Looks like MSU will probably not be liable, now that instant conviction guy has chimed in.

More bad news for MSU: 16 gymnasts suing Dr. Nasser AND MSU (updated) 502811600

by CheesySpartan Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 12:30

Question regarding procedural approach to OMT Wording may be NSWF (no pics)

Interesting post on a medical student message board...oddly similar and could be connected.

After scanning through the thread it appears it is related. Odd that the OP deleted his/her posts 2 years later but they were captured in replies.

This whole thing looks fk'd up!

The only question I have is why there wasn't someone else (an adult or medical professional) in the room during the exams/procedures? That doesn't make sense. You would think the Dr would want that for his own liability if what he was doing was legit.

by **GRR Spartan** Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 13:12

Cheesy, you are correct about how far reaching this mess might be.

Hindsight says when the first MSU athletes lodged complaints Dr. Nasser should have been banned from treating anyone untl the events were investigated and reports submitted to the Medical School, the AD's office and the president's office.

At this point you wonder how many people employed by the university and how many departments have been involved in letting Dr. Nasser continue at MSU.

by **GRR Spartan** Tue 10 Jan 2017 - 14:12

More details from ESPN and its not getting any simpler for MSU.

From the link:

"The plaintiffs who filed suit Tuesday participated in a variety of sports, including gymnastics, swimming, figure skating, track and field, field hockey, basketball and soccer.

Some were treated at Nassar's campus office within the Michigan State sports medicine facility, and others were treated at Twistars Gym, a gymnastics training center near Lansing where Nassar also saw patients.

In addition to Nassar, Michigan State University, Twistars and USA Gymnastics are all named as defendants in the lawsuit, which says that all three institutions should have stopped Nassar's alleged behavior years before they finally severed ties with him."

http://www.espn.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/18443691/more-women-allege-abuse-former-usa-gymnastics-msu-doctor

by **Robert J Sakimano** Wed 11 Jan 2017 - 8:20

article on CNN right now (believe what you will about the veracity of the article itself)

18 Women Sue Ex-USA Gymnastics Doctor

by **NigelUno** Wed 11 Jan 2017 - 8:55

Da Mayor wrote:Tanny, what's your legal take on this case?

Pretty sure we have ghost on retainer.

by Da Mayor Wed 11 Jan 2017 - 8:59

NigelUno wrote:
Da Mayor wrote:Tanny, what's your legal take on this case?

Pretty sure we have ghost on retainer.

OK. We're good then.

by Guest Wed 11 Jan 2017 - 10:40

Robert J Sakimano wrote:article on CNN right now (believe what you will about the veracity of the article itself)

18 Women Sue Ex-USA Gymnastics Doctor

Amazing - a thread Bobby doesn't want to mock. Bad news for MSU and he's happy as a pig in mud.

by **Robert J Sakimano** Wed 11 Jan 2017 - 10:43

LooseGoose wrote:
Robert J Sakimano wrote:article on CNN right now (believe what you will about the veracity of the article itself)

18 Women Sue Ex-USA Gymnastics Doctor

Amazing - a thread Bobby doesn't want to mock. Bad news for MSU and he's happy as a pig in mud.

I'm sorry that my post upset you.

by **Other Teams Pursuing That** Wed 11 Jan 2017 - 10:45

Please stop posting relevant links Bob. Goose never posts links.

by Guest Wed 11 Jan 2017 - 10:49

Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:Please stop posting relevant links Bob. Goose never posts links.

As if that was the point I made. Let me know when you pull your head out of your ass.

by **Robert J Sakimano** Wed 11 Jan 2017 - 10:54

Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:Please stop posting relevant links Bob. Goose never posts links.

some rather unhappy folks get upset when we act goofy.. some rather unhappy folks get upset when we post actual links involving MSU.

I suppose unhappy folks with be unhappy regardless. More bad news for MSU: 16 gymnasts suing Dr. Nasser AND MSU (updated) 2599972566

More bad news for MSU: 16 gymnasts suing Dr. Nasser AND MSU (updated) 2599972566

by **Other Teams Pursuing That** Wed 11 Jan 2017 - 14:29

Robert J Sakimano wrote:
Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:Please stop posting relevant links Bob. Goose never posts links.
some rather unhappy folks get upset when we act goofy.. some rather unhappy folks get upset when we post actual links involving MSU.

I suppose unhappy folks with be unhappy regardless.

Seems to be the case bobby.

by Guest Tue 25 Apr 2017 - 21:33

Doctor at center of USA Gymnastics scandal left warning signs at Michigan State

by **WhiteBoyHatcher** Tue 25 Apr 2017 - 22:25

LooseGoose wrote:Doctor at center of USA Gymnastics scandal left warning signs at Michigan State

Welp that sucks. Sounds like MSU was even more complicit than USA Gymnastics.

by **Blanch32** Tue 25 Apr 2017 - 22:34

the question is: which swill poster or poaters must be sacrificed for Nassar's sins? this may take a few in order to aPease the sunshine blowing gods.

by **Blanch32** Tue 25 Apr 2017 - 22:43

.....and wtf isn't strampel not on leave himself right now? let me guess he's a white male unlike Curtis blackwell

by Guest Tue 25 Apr 2017 - 23:33

Can some mod just sack up and end this?

by **Blanch32** Wed 26 Apr 2017 - 8:08

I agree. rods need to take a stand against those who chronicly support sexual predictors.

by **Death Roe** Wed 26 Apr 2017 - 8:16

Blanch32 wrote:I agree. rods need to take a stand against those who chronicly support sexual predictors.

You're an idiot and an asshole.

by **Blanch32** Wed 26 Apr 2017 - 9:20

....so I guess that includes you as well due to your self selection lol

by MSU addict Wed 26 Apr 2017 - 9:59

Simon reiterated previous apologies to Nassar’s accusers, but she also left open the possibility that nothing more could have been done.

“I have been told it is virtually impossible to stop a determined sexual predator and pedophile, that they will go to incomprehensible lengths to keep what they do in the shadows,” she told trustees.

This statement really, really bothers me.

When you employ someone for 20 years - and the complaints begin in the VERY FIRST YEAR - I do not think you can suggest nothing more could have been done.

When you conduct an investigation and find no wrongdoing - when in fact actual crimes were committed in those cases - and you fail to find anything while investigating one of the most pervasive sexual predators known - it is time to take a hard look in the mirror. You need to ask your self some tough questions about how you failed so miserably.

I personally feel the University needs a new direction and a new President.

by **DWags** Wed 26 Apr 2017 - 11:52

Yeah, at this point enough bad shit has come out where I don't see what information could now come out and make MSU look "good" in this. I'm just wondering where the fire wall is that will stop people up the ladder from being fired. Who "knew" enough and just blew it off to the point where they can be considered a contributor to his salvage behavior? Who is real deniability in it that is both factual and believable. Most important thing is that we keep the victims in mind first and foremost going forward.

by **Blanch32** Wed 26 Apr 2017 - 12:03

agreed. if these statements are public, and laks stands by them, so gone and Ferguson and other NOT supporters too. this was not hard to figure out if complaints were taken seriously from the start. they were not and instead dismissed by all in authority

by **Vlad** Wed 26 Apr 2017 - 12:07

Tell me again how this is different than the PSU/Sandusky thing??

1. A university employee who sexually abused young victims for years. Check.
2. Warning signs from years ago. Check.
3. Those who knew took little or no action (or chose to believe Nasser over the accusers), including coaches and administrators. Check.

Other than this being in gymnastics versus football, how are the two situations different?

Our Prez and AD are gonners.

by **Wally Fairway** Wed 26 Apr 2017 - 12:31

I am by no means an apologist for MSU's involvement - but there was an investigation made by the Ingham County Prosecutor and the Meridian police dept and in those cases they decided not to bring charges.
It is easy now that everyone has come forward, but remember that when they cut ties with Nassar USA gymnastics didn't say he was fired nor that there were people filing charges.

IMO - if you want to ask for people to lose their jobs at MSU, then it starts with the head of the Medical College, who put in new rules for Nassar but never followed up to see if they were implemented. It doesn't matter to me if you want to call for everyone to lose their job, not that is will solve anything. It certainly won't help the victims, but maybe the bystanders will feel better because it looks like something is being done.

The difference between MSU and PSU is that the sports tie in at MSU is an after thought, as Nassar used his international acclaim as the team doctor for USA Gymnastics to make a name for himself and create and hide behind an air of fame and acclaim. Sandusky did the same hiding behind the fame and acclaim of the PSU football program and his affiliation with that and with Coach Paterno.

by **MiamiSpartan** Wed 26 Apr 2017 - 12:57

Vlad wrote:Tell me again how this is different than the PSU/Sandusky thing??

1. A university employee who sexually abused young victims for years. Check.
2. Warning signs from years ago. Check.
3. Those who knew took little or no action (or chose to believe Nasser over the accusers), including coaches and administrators. Check.

Other than this being in gymnastics versus football, how are the two situations different?

Our Prez and AD are gonners.

That's hardly a minor difference, and is an even greater difference when you consider the status of football and Paterno at PSU. I mean, no one could even remotely seriously claim that Kathly Klages is, or ever was, the most powerful person at the University, and one of the most famous athletic figures in the entire nation. As Spartans, I don't think we can relate to just how big JoePa was there, and how important football is/was to PSU. My point in saying how big that difference is, is because there was an absolutely HUGE incentive to cover that up at PSU.

What's the incentive for a cover up, beyond Klages? I'm not saying that there wasn't a cover up, I just don't understand any real incentive for it. Why would the police, when investigating him multiple times, find no charges? Again, with PSU, and the power that Paterno and the football program had, it's easier to see where the police/prosecutors would have more trouble bringing charges. I can't see the police/prosecutors worrying about the power of the MSU women's gymnastics program.

I think another important difference is that it was Nasser's job to touch girls...APPROPRIATELY in relation to legitimate examinations. The problem obviously comes when he crosses that line to being INappropriate, and in terms of what is and isn't appropriate apparently has some blurred lines, which is why investigations into allegations in the past were deemed that he was doing a medical procedure (didn't he even post a video of that type of examination)? I don't think Sandusky posted a Youtube video to show the procedure of fucking a boy in the ass, nor do I think that part of his job description was to be naked in the showers with boys. What it sounds like Nasser did was take legitimate procedures to an illegitimate level, and the fucker should burn in hell for it, as should anyone who covered up his actions.

I know that people on this board like to misconstrue what others are saying, so PLEASE no one take this as any defense of Nasser, Klages, Hollis, Simon, or anyone else. I'm just answering Vlad's question on the differences between these situations. There's no doubt there are some disturbing similarities, but the influence of the PSU football program versus MSU gymnastics, and the type of position that Sandusky had versus Nasser, are, IMO, key differences that allowed this to go on, without it necessarily being a malicious and intentional cover up (even if a cover up wasn't intentional, that does not absolve any higher ups from any responsibility...after all, a lack of intent is not good defense, if you were careless or negligent).

by MSU addict Wed 26 Apr 2017 - 12:57

DWags wrote:Yeah, at this point enough bad shit has come out where I don't see what information could now come out and make MSU look "good" in this. I'm just wondering where the fire wall is that will stop people up the ladder from being fired. Who "knew" enough and just blew it off to the point where they can be considered a contributor to his salvage behavior? Who is real deniability in it that is both factual and believable. Most important thing is that we keep the victims in mind first and foremost going forward.

There are situations where it is never acceptable to stick your head in the sand and claim you did not know.

If you do that when a player is smoking weed, maybe takes some money, I understand it.

But when you get wind of a child, or children, being sexually abused it is NEVER acceptable. Ignoring the situation and seeking plausible deniability has one outcome - children continue to be abused and more children become victimized.

When you are in charge you set the tone and like it or not, you have a responsibility to ensure that you do everything in your power to investigate even the hint of child sexual abuse.

by **Vlad** Wed 26 Apr 2017 - 13:04

MSU addict wrote:
DWags wrote:Yeah, at this point enough bad shit has come out where I don't see what information could now come out and make MSU look "good" in this. I'm just wondering where the fire wall is that will stop people up the ladder from being fired. Who "knew" enough and just blew it off to the point where they can be considered a contributor to his salvage behavior? Who is real deniability in it that is both factual and believable. Most important thing is that we keep the victims in mind first and foremost going forward.
There are situations where it is never acceptable to stick your head in the sand and claim you did not know.

If you do that when a player is smoking weed, maybe takes some money, I understand it.

But when you get wind of a child, or children, being sexually abused it is NEVER acceptable. Ignoring the situation and seeking plausible deniability has one outcome - children continue to be abused and more children become victimized.

When you are in charge you set the tone and like it or not, you have a responsibility to ensure that you do everything in your power to investigate even the hint of child sexual abuse.

Agree.

PSU failed to act, we failed to act.

by Clarett's Folly Wed 26 Apr 2017 - 14:05

It's already costing us basketball recruits per Vlad!!

by **MiamiSpartan** Wed 26 Apr 2017 - 14:35

MSU addict wrote:
DWags wrote:Yeah, at this point enough bad shit has come out where I don't see what information could now come out and make MSU look "good" in this. I'm just wondering where the fire wall is that will stop people up the ladder from being fired. Who "knew" enough and just blew it off to the point where they can be considered a contributor to his salvage behavior? Who is real deniability in it that is both factual and believable. Most important thing is that we keep the victims in mind first and foremost going forward.
There are situations where it is never acceptable to stick your head in the sand and claim you did not know.

If you do that when a player is smoking weed, maybe takes some money, I understand it.

But when you get wind of a child, or children, being sexually abused it is NEVER acceptable. Ignoring the situation and seeking plausible deniability has one outcome - children continue to be abused and more children become victimized.

When you are in charge you set the tone and like it or not, you have a responsibility to ensure that you do everything in your power to investigate even the hint of child sexual abuse.

I agree. It's hard to wrap my head around it being malicious or intentional, like "I know this dude is touching these girls inappropriately, but oh well, I'll just pretend I don't know". That's pretty monstrous to think like that. Not saying it doesn't happen, but it's just hard to imagine.

But I think it's very easy to let your own biases or disbelief impact how you look something. It's basically confirmation bias, you see what you want to see. You start thinking, "I know this guy and his family, have known him for years. He's one of the most respected in his field. Surely he couldn't be capable of this, right? The girls don't know the medical stuff like he did, they must have just misinterpreted something." It's how he could get away with it for so long, and how many molesters do. Child molesters aren't all anti-social freaks in a windowless van. They can be teachers, coaches, fathers, uncles, etc. They often have access to kids, and have earned trust from parents, friends, family, and the community which gives them the opportunities not only to do something, but to get away with it, sometimes for years.

It's natural to have these biases toward someone you know, but when it comes to something so abhorrent, especially involving children, you need to take precautions. Fine, you don't believe the kid making some accusations. But it should at least raise your antenna, make you more vigilant, etc. You may not believe it, but are you willing to bet the safety and well-being of children on that? At the very least, that's where Klages and others at MSU failed, and such carelessness/negligence should be punished.

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