SCOTUS agrees to rule on independent legislature theory

Trapper Gus wrote:

GRR Spartan wrote:Trapper, you are a hoot.

The thread I happened to start has drifted to multiple subjects and you are chiding me to be more specific?

If you were a prof in my political science class and you were leading the discussion, okay.  Telling me to be more specific about a thread I started that’s all over the place, no.

This place is nice because you can’t herd cats.  Free form is a constant.

I am aware that for some posters on this board I can do nothing right ...

However, ...

I was responding to Penn, whom I quoted, and in response to his post I believe my response makes sense.

As for taking this thread off track, it was well off track before I joined into the new topic under discussion, thus all that I can be blamed for is continuing, after a number of off-track posts by other posters, on the off-track topic.  I was only correcting a mistake in knowledge by one of the posters in the off-track topic, to begin my off-track posts, and really wasn't trying to go any further, except Penn added responses to me, which I tried to answer.

On page one I was responding to the topic of the thread.

Trapper Gus wrote:

PennSpartan wrote:
You just contradicted yourself. I’ll let you figure out how. The student debt relief proposal is badly conceived. It doesn’t address those who paid their debt themselves and future student debt. I proposed something better here a few days ago. Have the government pay the interest and fees associated with the debt and the student pays the principal. And they can take as long as they want to pay it. 50 years to pay $50k in debt would be easy. Problem solved.

As I explained, those who support student dept relief, for a deeply flawed system (which you agreed is deeply flawed), also support free post high school education for everyone who wants it.  That addresses your point. I believe that some student debt legislative proposals have proposals to refund excess interest & fees already paid within them, which addresses another point you have.

As to what you believe is a contradiction, if you really want to make a point of it, which you don't, you need to be more specific, as there were three subjects discussed.

PennSpartan wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

As I explained, those who support student dept relief, for a deeply flawed system (which you agreed is deeply flawed), also support free post high school education for everyone who wants it.  That addresses your point. I believe that some student debt legislative proposals have proposals to refund excess interest & fees already paid within them, which addresses another point you have.

As to what you believe is a contradiction, if you really want to make a point of it, which you don't, you need to be more specific, as there were three subjects discussed.

Trap, if you can get free college through this Congress as well as student debt relief and Medicare for All, go for it. You’ve already educated me on the idea that the national debt is meaningless, so let’s shoot for the moon. Keep us updated.

kingstonlake wrote:

PennSpartan wrote:
Trap, if you can get free college through this Congress as well as student debt relief and Medicare for All, go for it. You’ve already educated me on the idea that the national debt is meaningless, so let’s shoot for the moon. Keep us updated.

It’s gonna be hard. To many people keep voting for people who oppose an open competition to develop great minds.

PennSpartan wrote:

kingstonlake wrote:

It’s gonna be hard. To many people keep voting for people who oppose  an open competition to develop great minds.

People are entitled to vote for whoever they wish. I haven’t been able to get you to see things my way, and I doubt you will get me to agree with you.  That's the great conundrum.

kingstonlake wrote:

PennSpartan wrote:
People are entitled to vote for whoever they wish. I haven’t been able to get you to see things my way, and I doubt you will get me to agree with you.  That's the great conundrum.

We can all take comfort in knowing that the people with student loan debt that were partying in Cancun will be leading our country in the work force. God forbid we let people who want to learn without going into lifetime debt lead us.

PennSpartan wrote:

kingstonlake wrote:

We can all take comfort in knowing that the people with student loan debt that were partying in Cancun will be leading our country in the work force. God forbid we let people who want to learn without going into lifetime debt lead us.

For some reason I never hear Republicans or Moderate Dems complaining about student debt. Just Progressives. Why is that? My kids managed to get it done.

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:

PennSpartan wrote:
For some reason I never hear Republicans or Moderate Dems complaining about student debt. Just Progressives. Why is that? My kids managed to get it done.

Because you think that anyone that complains about student debt is a progressive you fucking numbskull. People don’t wander around with progressive tattooed on their forehead.

PennSpartan wrote:

kingstonlake wrote:

We can all take comfort in knowing that the people with student loan debt that were partying in Cancun will be leading our country in the work force. God forbid we let people who want to learn without going into lifetime debt lead us.

For some reason I never hear Republicans or Moderate Dems complaining about student debt. Just Progressives. Why is that? My kids managed to get it done.

PennSpartan wrote:

kingstonlake wrote:

We can all take comfort in knowing that the people with student loan debt that were partying in Cancun will be leading our country in the work force. God forbid we let people who want to learn without going into lifetime debt lead us.

For some reason I never hear Republicans or Moderate Dems complaining about student debt. Just Progressives. Why is that? My kids managed to get it done.

kingstonlake wrote:

PennSpartan wrote:
For some reason I never hear Republicans or Moderate Dems complaining about student debt. Just Progressives. Why is that? My kids managed to get it done.

Now you’re just lying.

kingstonlake wrote:

PennSpartan wrote:
For some reason I never hear Republicans or Moderate Dems complaining about student debt. Just Progressives. Why is that? My kids managed to get it done.

Now you’re just lying.

PennSpartan wrote:

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:

Because you think that anyone that complains about student debt is a progressive you fucking numbskull. People don’t wander around with progressive tattooed on their forehead.

Personal attacks now.  Great.  Let me explain something to you.  You don’t need to convince ME.  You need to convince Congress and the President.  The voters have already spoken.  Get busy.  Good luck.  

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:

PennSpartan wrote:
Personal attacks now.  Great.  Let me explain something to you.  You don’t need to convince ME.  You need to convince Congress and the President.  The voters have already spoken.  Get busy.  Good luck.  

I’m glad that I don’t have to convince you as the number of times you have been slapped in the face with being wildly incorrect and still come back to the same incorrect conclusions is breathtakingly stupid and a wonder to behold.

PennSpartan wrote:

kingstonlake wrote:

Now you’re just lying.

Show me the list of Republicans supporting student debt relief.

kingstonlake wrote:

PennSpartan wrote:
Show me the list of Republicans supporting student debt relief.

Uh, that’s not what you said.

PennSpartan wrote:

kingstonlake wrote:

Uh, that’s not what you said.

I don’t see many people on the right holding rallies for debt relief.  I don’t see many politicians on the right promoting it.  It was pretty much a Bernie and friends idea.  I know for a fact my Congressman and Senator never mentioned it.  And they’re both moderate Dems.

kingstonlake wrote:

PennSpartan wrote:
I don’t see many people on the right holding rallies for debt relief.  I don’t see many politicians on the right promoting it.  It was pretty much a Bernie and friends idea.  I know for a fact my Congressman and Senator never mentioned it.  And they’re both moderate Dems.

You said you never hear moderates or republicans complain about student debt. I do. A lot. You then moved the goal post to moderate or Republican politicians supporting student debt relief. Those are two completely different things. You talk to lots of politicians? Damn, you must be an insiders in the moderate/Republican world. I can assure you many people from all political spectrums complain about their student debt. I don’t give a fuck what a politician thinks about it. I’m well aware of the game they play to get support from boomers who are worried about what someone else is getting that they won’t and frankly aren’t entitled too.

PennSpartan wrote:

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:

I’m glad that I don’t have to convince you as the number of times you have been slapped in the face with being wildly incorrect and still come back to the same incorrect conclusions is breathtakingly stupid and a wonder to behold.

More personal attacks. Great.

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:

PennSpartan wrote:
More personal attacks. Great.

That’s not a personal attack, that’s an observation. Toughen up butter cup

PennSpartan wrote:

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:

That’s not a personal attack, that’s an observation. Toughen up butter cup

When you start calling people stupid or a fucking numbskull that’s a personal attack.

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:

PennSpartan wrote:
When you start calling people stupid or a fucking numbskull that’s a personal attack.

I’m sorry if I hurt your fe fe’s :( but at the end of the day it’s not my fault that you’re going to go back to the same old refrains every time no matter how many times people tell you that you’re wrong. You can hardly blame me for thinking that you might be a skooch unable to keep up

PennSpartan wrote:

kingstonlake wrote:

You said you never hear moderates or republicans complain about student debt. I do. A lot. You then moved the goal post to moderate or Republican politicians supporting student debt relief. Those are two completely different things. You talk to lots of politicians? Damn, you must be an insiders in the moderate/Republican world. I can assure you many people from all political spectrums complain about their student debt. I don’t give a fuck what a politician thinks about it. I’m well aware of the game they play to get support from boomers who are worried about what someone else is getting that they won’t and frankly aren’t entitled too.

Your “evidence” is anecdotal.  You know people who want student debt relief.  Show me the movement on the right or middle pushing for this.  If you want to get it passed that’s what you need.  I keep saying this, you need a majority.  You don’t need me.  

kingstonlake wrote:

PennSpartan wrote:
Your “evidence” is anecdotal.  You know people who want student debt relief.  Show me the movement on the right or middle pushing for this.  If you want to get it passed that’s what you need.  I keep saying this, you need a majority.  You don’t need me.  

You said you never hear moderates or republicans complain about student debt. And you call my evidence anecdotal? Lol.

The subjects of student debt and student debt relief are different, Penn. way different.

PennSpartan wrote:

kingstonlake wrote:

You said you never hear moderates or republicans complain about student debt. And you call my evidence anecdotal? Lol.

The subjects of student debt and student debt relief are different, Penn. way different.

Fair enough.  Do something about it.  Contact your Representative or Senator.  I contacted my Senator a couple of years ago regarding an issue and he assigned a person in his office to assist me.  It was great and I was truly grateful.  Good luck.