Interesting article on Harbaugh UofM vs. MSU spending on coaches and recruiting.

Based on revenue/spending (and a correlation with winning), we should be behind OSU, UM, and Penn State every year.

The problem is losing to teams that are behind us in revenue/spending like Illinois (and Arizona State).

I'd be OK with being in the top 20 in spending and finishes every year, not cheating, contending for a B1G East championship ever three years and never finishing below 9-3. Should that really be unattainable with the resources MSU has?

Sounds like according to that article spending isn’t the answer? Michigan outspends us but the gap is smaller? Maybe the answer is just identifying up and coming coaches with energy for the job and acquiring them cheap. Sure they’ll use MSU as a spring board for a better job but as long as both parties benefit what’s the harm?

Floyd Robertson wrote:I'd be OK with being in the top 20 in spending and finishes every year, not cheating, contending for a B1G East championship ever three years and never finishing below 9-3. Should that really be unattainable with the resources MSU has?

I’m slightly below that give me 8 wins a year with the occasional up year and a team capable of upsetting a top tier program.

Is this what it feels like to be Iowa?

InTenSity wrote:Is this what it feels like to be Iowa?

We ain’t even Iowa, bro.

College sports are broken anyway. The whole thing is fucked. Win one more ncaa tournament, then go university of Chicago style and turn the stadium into a research facility for grass and save your recruiting 15 year olds money.

The other answer that saves big money is just cheat. For every 35k SUV you give a kid you save millions on recruiting lounges, facility upgrades and over paid assistants that just sit there with their thumb up their ass anyway. Also, it doesn't cost that much to print off a report card with a bunch of A's on it. Fuck the NCAA arms race just cheat.

I don’t think they print report cards anymore steve I think it’s mostly on the internet now.

But that’s exactly why the whole thing is fucked and we should stop construction on munn and turn it into a research facility looking into how ice is made

InTenSity wrote:Is this what it feels like to be Iowa?

InTenSity wrote:Is this what it feels like to be Iowa?

Do you two, and so many others have alzheimers or dementia?
Look I'm hot saying things are good, they suck; and that Coach D should stay but I'm not saying it's time to boot him either.

But Iowa - yeah they are having a better year, but their program hasn't accomplished shit in a decade, maybe more.
Last time they we conference co-champions is 2004 (with Steve's favorite UM) and the last time Iowa was the outright B1G champion is 1985.
Dantonio proved that MSU can compete for the B1G, and yes it was when Michigan sucked and PSU slumped.
IMO - what has hurt this years team, is exactly the problem the program had in the late 1980's right through the Johnelle years; and that is lack of depth.

If Dantonio goes then he goes - but whoever comes in has to have the mindset that they can win at MSU (not like the pissy little shit Saban who turned tail and left)

Maybe it is time for Coach D to leave, because I certainly don't want MSU to turn into Iowa and be happy with 2 or 3 place finishes and an occasional slip. FWIW Ferentz has averaged about 7.5 wins per year in his stint at Iowa, about 8 wins a year for the last 10 years....that is mediocre, and it isn't going to change (and they have done that playing in the B1G West)

Sorry - this has turned into a long ramble....but changing coaches will be a decision point for the leadership at MSU, will the new President and AD want to make a commitment to winning, or be like DiBiaggio and kick athletics to the curb?
I, for one, don't want to see MSU return to sports as they were under that type of leadership.

On the other hand the time that we won the big ten and went to the playoff Iowa was only like a yard away from being the one that won the big ten and went to the playoff so there’s that

Wally,

I don't often convey everything I'm saying and the thoughts in my head don't finish writing things all the time. I thought Iowa was starting to put things back together, but it took Ferentz a few years of sub 500 in order to make changes necessary. I agree with you, I'm not on team #Fire Dantonio, yet. Ultimately I think it is up to him to decide if he wants to stay on for another 3-4 years to rebuild again. Unfortunately I'm not sure how good the offense is going to be, and that needs to be fixed. We're also a pretty horrible fanbase. If we aren't winning, people don't show up to games, if it isn't a premier opponent we have trouble filling the stands. I guess most other teams go through the same thing.
Anyway, I'm rambling and not making much sense. In closing, I think that Dantonio gets to figure this out on his own. If he continues to stick with the same staff that isn't producing, than that falls on him. If he is willing to make the necessary changes and see it through for a few more years before passing the whistle to another coach, I'm good with that too.

InTenSity wrote:Wally,

I don't often convey everything I'm saying and the thoughts in my head don't finish writing things all the time. I thought Iowa was starting to put things back together, but it took Ferentz a few years of sub 500 in order to make changes necessary. I agree with you, I'm not on team #Fire Dantonio, yet. Ultimately I think it is up to him to decide if he wants to stay on for another 3-4 years to rebuild again. Unfortunately I'm not sure how good the offense is going to be, and that needs to be fixed. We're also a pretty horrible fanbase. If we aren't winning, people don't show up to games, if it isn't a premier opponent we have trouble filling the stands. I guess most other teams go through the same thing.
Anyway, I'm rambling and not making much sense. In closing, I think that Dantonio gets to figure this out on his own. If he continues to stick with the same staff that isn't producing, than that falls on him. If he is willing to make the necessary changes and see it through for a few more years before passing the whistle to another coach, I'm good with that too.

I think we've had a pretty loyal fanbase throughout the years.

When there's a quality game we've showed up. I guess our fan base realizes there's better things to do than watch MSU vs a cup cake. Maybe let us drink in the stadium and we'll show up.

steveschneider wrote:When there's a quality game we've showed up. I guess our fan base realizes there's better things to do than watch MSU vs a cup cake. Maybe let us drink in the stadium and we'll show up.

Historically...we've had a very loyal fan base (win or lose).

We've showed up for cupcake early season games.

NigelUno wrote:

steveschneider wrote:When there's a quality game we've showed up. I guess our fan base realizes there's better things to do than watch MSU vs a cup cake. Maybe let us drink in the stadium and we'll show up.

Historically...we've had a very loyal fan base (win or lose).

We've showed up for cupcake early season games.

The biggest faction of the fanbase is the one who shows up for nice weather, big games and homecoming. They don't show up to the same games though. When this group of fans checks out and the weather is dicey it gets ugly in SS. Nov 30 will be ugly unless the weather really cooperates.

By-Tor wrote: When this group of fans checks out and the weather is dicey it gets ugly in SS. Nov 30 will be ugly unless the weather really cooperates.

Oh you should be prepared for it to be ugly, very ugly
Glance at Stubhub or SeatGeek and you can buy all the $10-$15 tickets you want (and that is including the site fees)

Between the expectation for bad weather and the prospect of playing a team worse than MSU, apparently that is enough to set some people against coming to East Lansing for Thanksgiving Saturday.

Wally Fairway wrote:

By-Tor wrote: When this group of fans checks out and the weather is dicey it gets ugly in SS. Nov 30 will be ugly unless the weather really cooperates.

Oh you should be prepared for it to be ugly, very ugly
Glance at Stubhub or SeatGeek and you can buy all the $10-$15 tickets you want (and that is including the site fees)

Between the expectation for bad weather and the prospect of playing a team worse than MSU, apparently that is enough to set some people against coming to East Lansing for Thanksgiving Saturday.

The really extended forecast: High of 42° and 50% chance of showers.

Wally, MSU is a lot more like Iowa and Wisconsin than it ever will be like Big Ten East members OSU, PSU and umaa.

Kinnick has 5000 fewer seats than Spartan Stadium while Camp Randall seats 5000 more. That’s about equal. Both are n smaller population states but MSU shares MI with umaa so MI’s 10M population is split between the schools.

6 home games selling up to 35,000 (40,000 more in aa) pays for bigger recruiting budgets or high assistant coach salaries or both.

Ohio State is getting their money’s worth and while to date AD’s at State College and aa are paying big money for their football programs with the help of their stadiums without the results other Big Ten schools have seen with less.

Unless MSU finds its version of Phil Knight or umaa’s Ross it’s going to be a challenge to match Dantonio even with the last 4 seasons.

Jake from State Farm wrote:

Wally Fairway wrote:
Oh you should be prepared for it to be ugly, very ugly
Glance at Stubhub or SeatGeek and you can buy all the $10-$15 tickets you want (and that is including the site fees)

Between the expectation for bad weather and the prospect of playing a team worse than MSU, apparently that is enough to set some people against coming to East Lansing for Thanksgiving Saturday.

The really extended forecast: High of 42° and 50% chance of showers.

That sounds hideous.

DWags wrote:

Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:

That sounds hideous.

Well she's a guy so

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:College sports are broken anyway. The whole thing is fucked. Win one more ncaa tournament, then go university of Chicago style and turn the stadium into a research facility for grass and save your recruiting 15 year olds money.

This. College sports have become so fucking grotesque.

https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/28079797/notre-dame-sellout-streak-expected-end-273-games

NigelUno wrote:https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/28079797/notre-dame-sellout-streak-expected-end-273-games

They could hire David Brandon as a consultant, he made that problem disappear in AA. All it takes is a coke and a smile.

NigelUno wrote:Based on revenue/spending (and a correlation with winning), we should be behind OSU, UM, and Penn State every year.

The problem is losing to teams that are behind us in revenue/spending like Illinois (and Arizona State).

The problem with this reasoning is it also means we should be losing to teams ahead of us every year. Which is not the case over MD's tenure.

Nordic wrote:

NigelUno wrote:Based on revenue/spending (and a correlation with winning), we should be behind OSU, UM, and Penn State every year.

The problem is losing to teams that are behind us in revenue/spending like Illinois (and Arizona State).

The problem with this reasoning is it also means we should be losing to teams ahead of us every year. Which is not the case over MD's tenure.

Yeah. That's why he's been a great coach.

But, I don't think it's realistic to expect that to continue (or to expect it at all with a new coach). Not saying it won't happen, but when we're $50-60 million behind in revenue/spending than the 2 top teams? That's a lot.

If we're going to pop a team with greater resources than us, then we're probably occasionally going to get popped by teams which have less resources. Just the nature of the game. But 6-6 or 5-7 is a disappointment. No way around it.

If our baseline is 8-4 (+/-2), we can't hover around that lower end for a few years (and not take a hard look at the program).

Who hacked Nigels account?

DWags wrote:Dwags will be at SS 11/30/19. If it’s his last at SS, I’m going to make sure I’m there.

if I'm on campus, I'll swing by the DWags tailgate.

Robert J Sakimano wrote:

DWags wrote:Dwags will be at SS 11/30/19. If it’s his last at SS, I’m going to make sure I’m there.

if I'm on campus, I'll swing by the DWags tailgate.

Call ahead.