Basketball. Next season. Your thoughts?

by **NigelUno** 2014-04-29, 09:48

"18. Michigan State Spartans: Our first offseason ranking of Michigan State essentially assumed that Gary Harris would leave, which he did. Branden Dawson's return is crucial, and if Denzel Valentine has a big year, Tom Izzo's team might not take as big a step back as everyone is predicting."

flower

Basketball. Next season. Your thoughts? 2599972566

http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/id/98690/revised-top-25-post-deadline-edition

by **InTenSity** 2014-04-29, 10:08

Do we still have room for any recruits? Honest question here, when is the last time the team went through a season without some debilitating injury? 2009?

We need the C position to improve. I miss Nix being an unmovable object. I'm hoping Costello makes big strides. Is there any word on Byrd and Gauna?

by **Blanch32** 2014-04-29, 10:08

Honestly no idea. Optimist sees final 4 but BC of our terrible regular season attitude mix with fife's incompetent offense, a first rd flame out isn't out of question

by **SeeRockCity** 2014-04-29, 10:10

Quite frankly, I have no earthly idea what's going to happen next year, which is going to make it fun.

by AvgMSUJoe 2014-04-29, 10:29

SeeRockCity wrote:Quite frankly, I have no earthly idea what's going to happen next year, which is going to make it fun.

This...

I gotta think the center position will improve. We have seen Costello flash moves. It usually take the bigs a couple years to develop and without Payne, he will be more of a target.

I dont see Dawson ever avging 20 per game. Maybe 15 and 12 boards.

Valentine will be more in control.

Trice can put up 10-20 per game.

We will see what AE3 will do with the basket attack.

All this said... who the hell knows. This may be an Izzo "surprise" team. He's usually best when doubted, but I can't see a FF outta these guys.

by LoneWolfSparty 2014-04-29, 10:32

OBSESSION ALERT:

24 Michigan Wolverines: The worst-case scenario for Michigan fans came true: Nik Stauskas, Glenn Robinson III and Mitch McGary all left for the NBA draft. That said, Caris LeVert is on track for a major season, and while Michigan won't have the firepower of the past two seasons, it's fair to assume the Wolverines will still put up a ton of points.

Basketball. Next season. Your thoughts? 502811600

Basketball. Next season. Your thoughts? 502811600

I see Michigan going to the NIT next year.

by **Other Teams Pursuing That** 2014-04-29, 11:19

I like Dawson, Trice, and Valentine. Outside of that? Meh. I would like to see us get that transfer from USC, he looked like he could score. Our big men are something else. They all seemed to be non factors late in the season last year. Schilling ate two bags of popcorn before each game, Costello liked to run into people and foul out, and don't even start me on Gauna. My expectations are low, but maybe that's what I need after last year.

by LoneWolfSparty 2014-04-29, 11:21

Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:I like Dawson, Trice, and Valentine. Outside of that? Meh. I would like to see us get that transfer from USC, he looked like he could score. Our big men are something else. They all seemed to be non factors late in the season last year. Schilling ate two bags of popcorn before each game, Costello liked to run into people and foul out, and don't even start me on Gauna. My expectations are low, but maybe that's what I need after last year.

Kenny Kaminsky is gonna be huge next year.

by Cosmo_Kramer 2014-04-29, 11:21

Ellis will step up, just you wait. He has talent and drive.

by JEK 2014-04-29, 11:24

Excited to watch this team. Hope they get back to their scrappy roots and play with a chip on their shoulders. Those were my favorite Izzo teams.

by **Other Teams Pursuing That** 2014-04-29, 11:28

LoneWolfSparty wrote:

Kenny Kaminsky is gonna be huge next year.

Kaminski, but I did forget about him. Maybe it was his lack of defense or anything remotely close to defense. If he can figure some type of defense out and hit some clutch 3s, then he will be a factor also.

by Bizarro Fletch 2014-04-29, 11:30

Mixed emotions about next season. Whether perception or reality, it seems like Izzo teams play better with a chip on their shoulder. But at the same time, it's going to take a while to shake off the realization that 2012-13 should have been Izzo's second title team.

Now I know how fans of teams that had the talent to win it all like IU 2012 feel. Thankfully a "down" season for Izzo still means competing for the B10 and a decent run in the tournament. For most programs it means starting from rock bottom.

by **The_Dude** 2014-04-29, 11:42

I think Denzel and Dawson will both be big time players. All MSU needs after that is the frontcourt guys to all improve, aka Kaminsky, Schilling, and Costello. If that happens, MSU could be a final four contender.

I think Ellis and Nairn both come off the bench and contribute. Ellis could actually be a very good player for us.

by tanfan! 2014-04-29, 11:48

Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:I like Dawson, Trice, and Valentine. Outside of that? Meh. I would like to see us get that transfer from USC, he looked like he could score. Our big men are something else. They all seemed to be non factors late in the season last year. Schilling ate two bags of popcorn before each game, Costello liked to run into people and foul out, and don't even start me on Gauna. My expectations are low, but maybe that's what I need after last year.

I agree. Last year was Toms chance to win it all. Too bad appling evaporated at the end. I don't see tom getting back to a final four for a while.

by **Giant Moose** 2014-04-29, 11:59

We lost a lot obviously, but at the most key position last season (PG) we had a below average player due to his injury. So that alone will improve.

The question is do we have something to replace Payne and Harris? Are three 3 good players (say Valentine, Dawson, one of Trice/Kaminski) enough to average out losing 2 great players (Payne, Harris) and one below average player (Appling)? And only calling Valentine and Dawson good might be undervaluing them next season...

by **SeeRockCity** 2014-04-29, 12:02

Valentine factor will be interesting. Having a true leader in the locker room has always bode well for TI. Interested to see how that plays out.

by **Giant Moose** 2014-04-29, 12:04

And honestly, with Appling healthy, it's not like he ever led the team to the Final Four.

You can dismiss this year as the injury, but the dude couldn't get it done with good seeds the previous 2 years. Maybe a change at PG will be just what the doctor ordered.

by LoneWolfSparty 2014-04-29, 12:15

Tanfan! wrote:

I agree. Last year was Toms chance to win it all. Too bad appling evaporated at the end. I don't see tom getting back to a final four for a while.

Signed,

Tanner in 2005

by **InTenSity** 2014-04-29, 12:21

Giant Moose wrote:And honestly, with Appling healthy, it's not like he ever led the team to the Final Four.

You can dismiss this year as the injury, but the dude couldn't get it done with good seeds the previous 2 years. Maybe a change at PG will be just what the doctor ordered.

Wasn't Dawson hurt last year, and Harris had to have surgery after the season on his shoulder.

Why are athletes compared to themselves when they are healthy to when they are injured?

by Spartan Punk 2014-04-29, 12:24

I think it's going to be a struggle next year. Looking to a .500 conference record and being a bubble team.

Valentine will become a star next year, but I don't think Dawson will. I don't see him getting a reliable outside shot or learning how to handle a basketball. He'll be a good rebounder, defender and will get his share of putbacks, but I don't see him taking the next step than most of you seem to be predicting.

by **Giant Moose** 2014-04-29, 12:26

Spartan Punk wrote:I think it's going to be a struggle next year. Looking to a .500 conference record and being a bubble team.

Valentine will become a star next year, but I don't think Dawson will. I don't see him getting a reliable outside shot or learning how to handle a basketball. He'll be a good rebounder, defender and will get his share of putbacks, but I don't see him taking the next step than most of you seem to be predicting.

Is Dawson the guy we saw in the Virginia game or the guy we saw in the UConn game? I really do think he has the potential to be great, but I can see the opposite based on his inconsistencies.

by JEK 2014-04-29, 12:28

I think with a pass-first PG running the show, Dawson's offensive game will improve quite a bit.

by Spartan Punk 2014-04-29, 12:31

Giant Moose wrote:

Is Dawson the guy we saw in the Virginia game or the guy we saw in the UConn game? I really do think he has the potential to be great, but I can see the opposite based on his inconsistencies.

Agree 100%. He followed up his 2 best scoring games with a 5 pt game vs UConn. When he has a quickness advantage over his opponent, he can look great. When he doesn't, he dissappears.

I think what we'll see from Dawson next is what we've seen from his for 3 years. Some great moments followed by wondering where he is.

by **InTenSity** 2014-04-29, 12:31

Can't find the quote pixel to quote Spartan Punk right now.

Who is going to be good in the B1G next year?

Wisky, OSU at the top?
Then Neb, Iowa, Minny, Maryland?
Then MSU, UM, IU, PU, Illini?
Then NU, PSU, Rutgers?

MSU is going to be competitive, and I could see them struggling to be 500 or taking 3rd. I'm not even sure OSU will be the second best team. I don't follow enough recruiting enough to know if any team is supposed to take a big step forward or not, but I have to believe we'll be just as good as Neb, Iowa, Minny and Maryland.

by Bizarro Fletch 2014-04-29, 12:43

Spartan Punk wrote:I think it's going to be a struggle next year. Looking to a .500 conference record and being a bubble team.

Valentine will become a star next year, but I don't think Dawson will. I don't see him getting a reliable outside shot or learning how to handle a basketball. He'll be a good rebounder, defender and will get his share of putbacks, but I don't see him taking the next step than most of you seem to be predicting.

I certainly won't be holding my breath for Dawson to be knocking down 17 foot jumpers, but I do think this will be the first time in his career plays are regularly run for him. To this point he hasn't received a significant number of scoring opportunities beyond the putbacks, lobs, etc. you mentioned because the offense was run through numerous other options first (Harris, Appling, Payne, Nix, etc.). That all changes next season. He averaged 11 ppg this year as MAYBE the fourth offensive option on the floor, so it seems with increased opportunity will come increased production.

As for the team's overall record, it would be disappointing if they end up struggling to get to .500 in conference considering the sizable step back the B10 is taking. Beyond Wisky the conference is looking pretty thin. I think people are underestimating the core of Valentine, Trice and Dawson.

by JEK 2014-04-29, 12:57

Spartan Punk wrote:I think it's going to be a struggle next year. Looking to a .500 conference record and being a bubble team.

Valentine will become a star next year, but I don't think Dawson will. I don't see him getting a reliable outside shot or learning how to handle a basketball. He'll be a good rebounder, defender and will get his share of putbacks, but I don't see him taking the next step than most of you seem to be predicting.

If we go .500 then that means there will probably be about 5 or 6 teams ahead of us.

I'm curious, who are all these teams that you think will have a combined talent/experience/coaching advantage over us? Are you just looking at MSU in a vacuum, or are you comparing us to what other teams will look like next year?

by Spartan Punk 2014-04-29, 13:11

JEK wrote:

If we go .500 then that means there will probably be about 5 or 6 teams ahead of us.

I'm curious, who are all these teams that you think will have a combined talent/experience/coaching advantage over us? Are you just looking at MSU in a vacuum, or are you comparing us to what other teams will look like next year?

I did not going through each team and look at who returns and who doesn't.

by **Giant Moose** 2014-04-29, 13:22

Spartan Punk wrote:
I did not going through each team and look at who returns and who doesn't.

Slacker.

by Cosmo_Kramer 2014-04-29, 13:23

InTenSityX wrote:Can't find the quote pixel to quote Spartan Punk right now.

Who is going to be good in the B1G next year?

Wisky, OSU at the top?
Then Neb, Iowa, Minny, Maryland?
Then MSU, UM, IU, PU, Illini?
Then NU, PSU, Rutgers?

MSU is going to be competitive, and I could see them struggling to be 500 or taking 3rd. I'm not even sure OSU will be the second best team. I don't follow enough recruiting enough to know if any team is supposed to take a big step forward or not, but I have to believe we'll be just as good as Neb, Iowa, Minny and Maryland.

OSU lost Craft and Ross, so they are pretty young and lack experience. Nebraska is probably better than OSU.

by JEK 2014-04-29, 13:28

Spartan Punk wrote:I did not going through each team and look at who returns and who doesn't.

You can probably put Wisconsin in their own tier at the top. After that, 2-5 is pretty wide open.

by Murphy Green 2014-04-29, 18:54

Tanfan! wrote:

I agree. Last year was Toms chance to win it all. Too bad appling evaporated at the end. I don't see tom getting back to a final four for a while.

are you trying to steal Victory Bell's reverse jinx? Razz

by **Floyd Robertson** 2014-04-29, 18:59

SeeRockCity wrote:Quite frankly, I have no earthly idea what's going to happen next year, which is going to make it fun.

I'm pretty sure there will be a basketball season.

by Heathens '87 2014-04-29, 20:00

A few...

- Trice and Tum-Tum make for a nice PG pairing. We might be vulnerable to some defensive size, but we should be able to push the ball well.

- Valentine needs to grow in his consistency and in his decision-making. He will be an impact player, especially if he takes the next step in his progress.

- Dawson needs to listen to Izzo on what it will take for him to make the NBA - defense, complete game focus, aggressiveness, some range, etc.

- Ellis could be special in a 6th man role. He showed little fear and a speed game will suit him just fine.

The season likely comes down to Costello, Kaminski and Schilling. Kenny needs to become that stretch scorer that draws defenders out, Schilling needs to play minutes and be an Izzo big - defense and boards, and Costello needs to become a 12-point/10 rebound impact player. Forget the feed Payne in the paint game-planning...we're going to run in transition and play more of an NBA wing-dominated game for Dawson and Valentine.

My guess is 3-4 in the Big Ten, 21-22 wins, a few surprises in either direction along the way, and a 5-6 NCAA seed. But if we get some leadership, someone becomes that go-to scorer, and we commit to defense, it could be a real fun team to watch.........

by Gob Bluth 2014-04-29, 21:21

Ellis played with some huge balls this year as a freshman. I'm sure he's going to make a big leap and fight for serious playing time as a sophomore. Schilling showed flashes of great athleticism, though he probably won't play more than a bit part next year because he's still got a lot of developing to do.

We need Tum-Tum to be able to make a good impact almost right away. Depth at PG is a huge weakness if he doesn't, especially since Trice always seems to get hit by injury/plague at some point in the season.

Really excited about Dawson after his BTT/NCAA performances. Even though it was incredibly fucking stupid at the time, breaking his hand and sitting out seemed to really light a fire under his ass and we got "Good Dawson" like 98% of the time after that.

The bigs are a question mark. Will Costello finally fulfill the promise that has nysparty1 creaming himself several times a game, or will he frustrate fans and Izzo alike? If we want to have a good season, Costello needs to play very well because aside from him and Dawson, there's not much depth or experience in the frontcourt.

My prediction (without seeing any of the incoming freshmen yet): 21 wins, trip to the Sweet 16.

by tanfan! 2014-04-29, 21:40

LoneWolfSparty wrote:

Signed,

Tanner in 2005

Wut?

by tanfan! 2014-04-29, 21:42

Murphy Green wrote:

are you trying to steal Victory Bell's reverse jinx?

You know the rcmb sucks ass when vb is now a premium poster. His annoying threads linking his articles knowing he won't get made fun of like the good ole days personifies the complete blower mentality that now exists.

by **Snake Plissken** 2014-04-29, 21:44

Tanfan! wrote:

You know the rcmb sucks ass when vb is now a premium poster. His annoying threads linking his articles knowing he won't get made fun of like the good ole days personifies the complete blower mentality that now exists.

Oh Jesus Fucking Christ give it a break man. Seriously. Why make this board into the Tanfan hates tRCMB board? It's not necessary.

by **duffy munn** 2014-04-29, 21:54

LoneWolfSparty wrote:

Signed,

Tanner in 2005

And 2009. Worst Izzo tem ever.

by tanfan! 2014-04-29, 21:55

duffy munn wrote:

Don't forget 2002! Come on Duffy. You are slipping.

And 2009. Worst Izzo tem ever.

by tanfan! 2014-04-29, 21:56

Don't forget 2002! Come on Duffy. You are slipping.

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