Design your best MSU hoops squad going back 17 years.

I am watching this Nuggets game on one TV and GSW game on the other TV. These guys are studs. I hate that cheating is so prolific that we couldn't win a natty with either of them.

My squad would definitely feature Gary at the 2 and Day Day at the 3 or 4. This is gonna be a Natty squad, not just an offensive juggernaut and we need guys who can play both ends and make plays. You get 3 guys off the bench.

I'm inclined to think I'd go with:

1. Mateen
2. Gary
3. Mo Pete
4. Day Day
5. AP. I need length, post game and ability to stretch floor.

B1: Denzel - Jackknife. Really hard to top his versatility. Could run point, play 2 or play 3.
B2: Paul Davis - Backup big with very good game at both ends
B3: Deciding between JRich and BJ here. Need more O or D? I'm going to take BJ because I think we have enough offense already.

If I needed a backup pure 1 I would go Appling pre-injury and gun obsession. But Zel can run point and so could Day Day or Gary in a pinch.

I need to start watching more Nuggets games - miss watching Gary. One of my favorite Spartans, he was smooooooth. I was about to say WHERE THE FUCK IS MAGIC?! And then saw your 17 year thing.

Kalin Lucas
Denzel Valentine
Shannon Brown
Draymond Green
Z-Bo

Bench: Mateen Cleaves, Paul Davis, Gary Harris

boom. You may disagree, but I'm rolling with these motherfuckers.

WhiteBoyHatcher wrote:
I'm inclined to think I'd go with:
1. Mateen
2. Gary
3. Mo Pete
4. Day Day
5. AP. I need length, post game and ability to stretch floor.

B1: Denzel - Jackknife. Really hard to top his versatility. Could run point, play 2 or play 3.
B2: Paul Davis - Backup big with very good game at both ends
B3: Deciding between JRich and BJ here. Need more O or D? I'm going to take BJ because I think we have enough offense already.

1. Mateen - toughness and leadership.
2. Charlie Bell
3. Mo Pete
4. Draymond
5. Zach R

Denzel backs up the 1 & 2.
Jason R - backs up the 2 & 3
Davis backs up the 4 & 5.

Funny that all 3 of us have picked Paul Davis, perhaps the most underappreciated guy of the era. What's up with him? I think he was the beginning of the end. Guy could have been top 3 (reportedly) out of HS. But he came to MSU. And no one ever thought he lived up to the hype.

WhiteBoyHatcher wrote:Funny that all 3 of us have picked Paul Davis, perhaps the most underappreciated guy of the era. What's up with him? I think he was the beginning of the end. Guy could have been top 3 (reportedly) out of HS. But he came to MSU. And no one ever thought he lived up to the hype.

It came down to him or Lorbeck for me. I was never a big AP fan. Davis was a good college big man, did a lot of things well be nothing great.

I liked GaryH a lot but he's further down my list than yours, I would have taken Alan Anderson ahead of him. Went with JR over AA just for the physicality that he could bring as a change of pace. It's pretty likely that Bridges takes that spot in the future.

Mateen

Harris

Peterson

Green

Hutson
.........
Denzel

Charlie Bell

Richardson

Payne

Davis

duffy munn wrote:Mateen

Harris

Peterson

Green

Hutson
.........
Denzel

Charlie Bell

Richardson

Payne

Davis

Crazy good players I left out:

Randolph, Shannon Brown, Kalin Lucas, Neitzel, Forbes, Antonio, Appling, Dawson, Ager, Anderson

Unreal the talent under Izzo.

duffy munn wrote:Mateen

Harris

Peterson

Green

Hutson
.........
Denzel

Charlie Bell

Richardson

Payne

Davis

Davis? lol

WhiteBoyHatcher wrote:I am watching this Nuggets game on one TV and GSW game on the other TV. These guys are studs. I hate that cheating is so prolific that we couldn't win a natty with either of them.

My squad would definitely feature Gary at the 2 and Day Day at the 3 or 4. This is gonna be a Natty squad, not just an offensive juggernaut and we need guys who can play both ends and make plays. You get 3 guys off the bench.

I'm inclined to think I'd go with:

1. Mateen
2. Gary
3. Mo Pete
4. Day Day
5. AP. I need length, post game and ability to stretch floor.

B1: Denzel - Jackknife. Really hard to top his versatility. Could run point, play 2 or play 3.
B2: Paul Davis - Backup big with very good game at both ends
B3: Deciding between JRich and BJ here. Need more O or D? I'm going to take BJ because I think we have enough offense already.

If I needed a backup pure 1 I would go Appling pre-injury and gun obsession. But Zel can run point and so could Day Day or Gary in a pinch.

Can't argue with this except I want a way to put Bell and Hutson on my team. I think Duffy nailed it if you go to 10

BleacherSwill wrote:

duffy munn wrote:Mateen

Harris

Peterson

Green

Hutson
.........
Denzel

Charlie Bell

Richardson

Payne

Davis

Davis? lol

You don't agree? Paul Davis I would imagine .. obviously not Deyonta. Izzo botched his one year here.

Suton, his senior year was pretty good iirc.

duffy munn wrote:

duffy munn wrote:Mateen

Harris

Peterson

Green

Hutson
.........
Denzel

Charlie Bell

Richardson

Payne

Davis

Crazy good players I left out:

Randolph, Shannon Brown, Kalin Lucas, Neitzel, Forbes, Antonio, Appling, Dawson, Ager, Anderson

Unreal the talent under Izzo.

I thought about 'Tone but I think he's outside the 17 year limit.   If you wanted a leader he'd be the one. We owe much of what we've enjoyed for 20 years to him.

Mateen
DV
Mo Pete
Payne
Suton

Bench

Lucas
Brown
Dawson
Forbes
Davis

Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:

BleacherSwill wrote:

Davis? lol

You don't agree? Paul Davis I would imagine .. obviously not Deyonta. Izzo botched his one year here.

My bad on the Davis. Yes on Paul Davis, no on DD.

Whoever you put on that recent squad I will take Jud's stars to beat them.  Proviso of course is that these were about the only star players in those years and that is why most of those teams were not very good. Izzo has recruited way more total amount of better players on the same team than all but a few other years in Spartan history. There's like 30 possible choices for an all star Izzo squad where these ten I list did not have much else on the court.

M Johnson  AA
Scott Skiles  AA
Shawn Respert  AA
Steve Smith AA
Mike Peplowlski
Match Stegeganza or the Kleevon TOrborg of the 90s.
Jay Vincent AA
Sam Vincent AA
Jamie Fieck
Kevin Willis
Eric Snow

And the 20 years before that with 6 All Americans.

Johnny Green AA
Greg Kelser AA
Terry Furlow AA
Mike Robinson
Ralph Simpson AA
Julius McCoy AA
Stan Washington
Lee Lafayette
Horace Walker AA
Bill Kilgore
Lindsey Hairston

BleacherSwill wrote:Whoever you put on that recent squad I will take Jud's stars to beat them.  Proviso of course is that these were about the only star players in those years and that is why most of those teams were not very good.  Izzo has recruited way more total amount of better players on the same team than all but a few other years in Spartan history.   There's like 30 possible choices for an all star Izzo squad where these ten I list did not have much else on the court.

M Johnson  AA
Scott Skiles  AA
Shawn Respert  AA
Steve Smith AA
Mike Peplowlski
Match Stegeganza or the Kleevon TOrborg of the 90s.
Jay Vincent AA
Sam Vincent AA
Jamie Fieck
Kevin Willis
Eric Snow

An All-Jud team without Kelser???

Edit: I see you included special K in your next post

BleacherSwill wrote:Whoever you put on that recent squad I will take Jud's stars to beat them.  Proviso of course is that these were about the only star players in those years and that is why most of those teams were not very good. Izzo has recruited way more total amount of better players on the same team than all but a few other years in Spartan history. There's like 30 possible choices for an all star Izzo squad where these ten I list did not have much else on the court.

M Johnson  AA
Scott Skiles  AA
Shawn Respert  AA
Steve Smith AA
Mike Peplowlski
Match Stegeganza or the Kleevon TOrborg of the 90s.
Jay Vincent AA
Sam Vincent AA
Jamie Fieck
Kevin Willis
Eric Snow

Missed Kelser...Better be a shootout because aside from Snow is anyone going to play D? I need more balance. Plus who are the coaches? Izzo would run circles on Jud

Mateen
Gary
Mo Pete
Draymond
AP

Bench:
Denzel - back up multiple positions
Forbes - instant offense
Davis - big man depth

Mateen
Bell
JRich
Zbo
Paul Davis

Shannon Brown, Valentine, Mo Pete.

People seem to be under valuing just how good C Bell was in this thread.

Crap 8 is hard, forgot Day Day

How many of you guys used Bridges?

I love C Bell but Gary is an inch or two taller and better on both ends of the floor. Bell was a very good defender, but not as good as Harris. Better passer, probably a better rebounder than Harris but Gary could create his own offense. Stud.

aualum06 wrote:Mateen
Bell
JRich
Zbo
Paul Davis

Shannon Brown, Valentine, Mo Pete.

People seem to be under valuing just how good C Bell was in this thread.

Crap 8 is hard, forgot Day Day

Agreed 100% Maybe the younger generation here didnt see him for 4 years as some of us did or they value offense too much. IMO starting backcourt is Cleaves and Bell no question and goes from there

Bell was an all-american and played in three final fours.

BTW, wiki says he is assistant D-Leauge coach for Texas Legends.

WhiteBoyHatcher wrote:I love C Bell but Gary is an inch or two taller and better on both ends of the floor. Bell was a very good defender, but not as good as Harris. Better passer, probably a better rebounder than Harris but Gary could create his own offense. Stud.

Harris was a better defensive player then Bell? Really? Your old enough to have seen them both

CheesySpartan wrote:

WhiteBoyHatcher wrote:I love C Bell but Gary is an inch or two taller and better on both ends of the floor. Bell was a very good defender, but not as good as Harris. Better passer, probably a better rebounder than Harris but Gary could create his own offense. Stud.

Harris was a better defensive player then Bell? Really? Your old enough to have seen them both

WBH has seen both. Believe me. He's old enough. Not saying I agree with him, but don't worry about his age.

WhiteBoyHatcher wrote:I love C Bell but Gary is an inch or two taller and better on both ends of the floor. Bell was a very good defender, but not as good as Harris. Better passer, probably a better rebounder than Harris but Gary could create his own offense. Stud.

Gary is longer and a better shooter. I'll admit to that. Better defender? I'll take bell. Bell is a better rebounder as well.

Yes I think Harris was a better defender than Bell.

WhiteBoyHatcher wrote:Yes I think Harris was a better defender than Bell.

Fair enough...Agree to disagree bro

InTenSity wrote:

CheesySpartan wrote:

Harris was a better defensive player then Bell? Really? Your old enough to have seen them both

WBH has seen both. Believe me. He's old enough. Not saying I agree with him, but don't worry about his age.

I figured...we are about the same age

1. Mateen
2. JRich
3. Mo Pete
4. Randolph
5. Davis

B1: Bell
B2: DayDay
B3: Harris

InTenSity wrote:

CheesySpartan wrote:

Harris was a better defensive player then Bell? Really? Your old enough to have seen them both

WBH has seen both. Believe me. He's old enough. Not saying I agree with him, but don't worry about his age.

He might have watched Bell, but I don't think he ever saw him play.

Probably should put "P Davis" since some are thinking D Davis. Loved DD but he is not in this discussion

WhiteBoyHatcher wrote:I am watching this Nuggets game on one TV and GSW game on the other TV. These guys are studs. I hate that cheating is so prolific that we couldn't win a natty with either of them.

My squad would definitely feature Gary at the 2 and Day Day at the 3 or 4. This is gonna be a Natty squad, not just an offensive juggernaut and we need guys who can play both ends and make plays. You get 3 guys off the bench.

I'm inclined to think I'd go with:

1. Mateen
2. Gary
3. Mo Pete
4. Day Day
5. AP. I need length, post game and ability to stretch floor.

B1: Denzel - Jackknife. Really hard to top his versatility. Could run point, play 2 or play 3.
B2: Paul Davis - Backup big with very good game at both ends
B3: Deciding between JRich and BJ here. Need more O or D? I'm going to take BJ because I think we have enough offense already.

If I needed a backup pure 1 I would go Appling pre-injury and gun obsession. But Zel can run point and so could Day Day or Gary in a pinch.

Re-reading your original post...C Bell ran the point most of his Sr year=#1 ranking, BIG champs, Final Four

Re: Bell vs. Gary, it's an interesting debate. I do stand by my opinion, but I would be curious to hear Coach's opinion on it. Someone tweet the question to him and see if he responds.

WhiteBoyHatcher wrote:Re: Bell vs. Gary, it's an interesting debate. I do stand by my opinion, but I would be curious to hear Coach's opinion on it. Someone tweet the question to him and see if he responds.

Agreed, fun debate. No way Izzo takes Harris over Bell. I literally watched every game they both played and to me its not even close.

WhiteBoyHatcher wrote:Re: Bell vs. Gary, it's an interesting debate. I do stand by my opinion, but I would be curious to hear Coach's opinion on it. Someone tweet the question to him and see if he responds.

LOL at tweeting Izzo

CheesySpartan wrote:

WhiteBoyHatcher wrote:Re: Bell vs. Gary, it's an interesting debate. I do stand by my opinion, but I would be curious to hear Coach's opinion on it. Someone tweet the question to him and see if he responds.

Agreed, fun debate. No way Izzo takes Harris over Bell. I literally watched every game they both played and to me its not even close.

I'm not sure. Izzo remarked multiple times that Gary was our best defender when he was on the team, both his frosh and soph years. We are also comparing 4 years of work to 2. Bell obviously was one of the best players in the country by his Sr year. I just think Gary's length and athleticism + pure offensive game elevates him a tad over Charlie.

WhiteBoyHatcher wrote:

CheesySpartan wrote:

Agreed, fun debate. No way Izzo takes Harris over Bell. I literally watched every game they both played and to me its not even close.

I'm not sure. Izzo remarked multiple times that Gary was our best defender when he was on the team, both his frosh and soph years. We are also comparing 4 years of work to 2. Bell obviously was one of the best players in the country by his Sr year. I just think Gary's length and athleticism + pure offensive game elevates him a tad over Charlie.

Mateen and MoPete got the accolades but those teams are run of the mill without Charlie Bell. He was the Leatherman tool of those teams. Doing whatever needed done to win.

TimBo.

and the other 4 guys can take the day off.