Sam Harris, Joe Rogan, Jordan Petersen, etc - The Intellectual Dark Web

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/08/opinion/intellectual-dark-web.html

Becoming a pretty influential group no question about it. Any reactions or thoughts you guys have about them?

Page Not Found
We’re sorry, we seem to have lost this page, but we don’t want to lose you. Report the broken link here.

Get your shit together, steve. I googled nytimes intellectual dark web and found the piece. It was meh.

I enjoy Joe Rogan's podcast. He's a bit of a meathead sometimes, but I find it entertaining. Sam Harris is one of the smartest people alive and there is very little that I disagree with him about. I do disagree with some of what Jordan Peterson says, but I find him to be an interesting and thought provoking speaker.

I'm less familiar with the rest of them.

never heard of any of these people or the "intellectual dark web"..

usually anything with the word "intellectual" in it makes me suspect it's the exact opposite of intellectual.

plus, I'm pretty dumb, anyway.. so.. yeah.

Cameron wrote:Get your shit together, steve. I googled nytimes intellectual dark web and found the piece. It was meh.

I enjoy Joe Rogan's podcast. He's a bit of a meathead sometimes, but I find it entertaining. Sam Harris is one of the smartest people alive and there is very little that I disagree with him about. I do disagree with some of what Jordan Peterson says, but I find him to be an interesting and thought provoking speaker.

I'm less familiar with the rest of them.

I fixed the link.

Yeah, of the whole lot Joe is my favorite. I saw Graham Couch lament that the Charlie Rose show was gone because he missed the interviews, and imo some Rogan's interviews blow away anything that Rose ever did. I don't care for his MMA ones, but his ones with musicians and comedians have been great.

Sam Harris is too boring for me. Talks way too slow. I also remember when Dawkin's and Hitchens were on the rise Harris at the time was the runt of the litter.

I do agree with his arguments about reform for Islam.

I think a lot of these guys attract bigots though, and though I agree to an extent some of the issues with campus free speech I think these guys are making SJWs out to be a big time bogeyman. Most of the ideas they are championing for free speech (guns, transphobia, alt right ideas, islamaphobia) are already really well represented in government and MSM.

Interesting I haven't seen any of them champion the free speech of the anthem protesters in NFL. Maybe they are doing it but I haven't found it yet. Those guys are having their careers destroyed and are a marginalized group that are not having their POVs represented in MSM. Maybe pointing SJW hysteria gets more views and clicks though.

steveschneider wrote:

Cameron wrote:Get your shit together, steve. I googled nytimes intellectual dark web and found the piece. It was meh.

I enjoy Joe Rogan's podcast. He's a bit of a meathead sometimes, but I find it entertaining. Sam Harris is one of the smartest people alive and there is very little that I disagree with him about. I do disagree with some of what Jordan Peterson says, but I find him to be an interesting and thought provoking speaker.

I'm less familiar with the rest of them.

I fixed the link.

Yeah, of the whole lot Joe is my favorite. I saw Graham Couch lament that the Charlie Rose show was gone because he missed the interviews, and imo some Rogan's interviews blow away anything that Rose ever did. I don't care for his MMA ones, but his ones with musicians and comedians have been great.

Sam Harris is too boring for me. Talks way too slow. I also remember when Dawkin's and Hitchens were on the rise Harris at the time was the runt of the litter.

I do agree with his arguments about reform for Islam.

I think a lot of these guys attract bigots though, and though I agree to an extent some of the issues with campus free speech I think these guys are making SJWs out to be a big time bogeyman. Most of the ideas they are championing for free speech (guns, transphobia, alt right ideas, islamaphobia) are already really well represented in government and MSM.

Interesting I haven't seen any of them champion the free speech of the anthem protesters in NFL. Maybe they are doing it but I haven't found it yet. Those guys are having their careers destroyed and are a marginalized group that are not having their POVs represented in MSM. Maybe pointing SJW hysteria gets more views and clicks though.

sounds like pretty much what I thought it was.

steveschneider wrote:https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/08/opinion/intellectual-dark-web.html

Becoming a pretty influential group no question about it. Any reactions or thoughts you guys have about them?

I don't mind Peterson but he throws around some religious BS from time to time. Which people take it and run with.

I think he's actually pretty moderate on most issues but he knows where he's bread is buttered. From a mental health perspective he does have a few blind spots but who doesn't. He always cops out and says i'm only pointing out a problem but I don't have the solution.

Like Sam Harris but his Muslim community items can be bit much. Wake me up when Dearborn or Hamtrack become the hotbeds of terrorism in the United States. Funny how you give people some freedom and not bomb the shit out of them they don't want to bomb you back. Amazing how that works Sam.

msugolfguy wrote:

steveschneider wrote:https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/08/opinion/intellectual-dark-web.html

Becoming a pretty influential group no question about it. Any reactions or thoughts you guys have about them?

I don't mind Peterson but he throws around some religious BS from time to time. Which people take it and run with.

I think he's actually pretty moderate on most issues but he knows where he's bread is buttered. From a mental health perspective he does have a few blind spots but who doesn't. He always cops out and says i'm only pointing out a problem but I don't have the solution.

Like Sam Harris but his Muslim community items can be bit much. Wake me up when Dearborn or Hamtrack become the hotbeds of terrorism in the United States. Funny how you give people some freedom and not bomb the shit out of them they don't want to bomb you back. Amazing how that works Sam.

I was exposed to Peterson for the first time on Bill Maher's show the other week. I had no idea he was such a big deal when he was on the show. There was a pretty pleasant panel discussion and I thought there was some pretty good push back on some of his ideas actually. Funny the next day I'm on youtube and I see his segment off in the sidebar with titles like 'Jordan Peterson Owns Bill Maher's Panel' or 'Jordan Peterson Destroys....'. Also, I go on twitter and it looks like the SJW's are having melt down over Bill having him on.

I find it hard to believe that real people even gave a shit. Seems like Russian troll farms are amplifying the shit these guys do or say over the internet because I can't imagine people outside of a comment section really giving a shit.

steveschneider wrote:

msugolfguy wrote:

I don't mind Peterson but he throws around some religious BS from time to time. Which people take it and run with.

I think he's actually pretty moderate on most issues but he knows where he's bread is buttered. From a mental health perspective he does have a few blind spots but who doesn't. He always cops out and says i'm only pointing out a problem but I don't have the solution.

Like Sam Harris but his Muslim community items can be bit much. Wake me up when Dearborn or Hamtrack become the hotbeds of terrorism in the United States. Funny how you give people some freedom and not bomb the shit out of them they don't want to bomb you back. Amazing how that works Sam.

I was exposed to Peterson for the first time on Bill Maher's show the other week. I had no idea he was such a big deal when he was on the show. There was a pretty pleasant panel discussion and I thought there was some pretty good push back on some of his ideas actually. Funny the next day I'm on youtube and I see his segment off in the sidebar with titles like 'Jordan Peterson Owns Bill Maher's Panel' or 'Jordan Peterson Destroys....'. Also, I go on twitter and it looks like the SJW's are having melt down over Bill having him on.

I find it hard to believe that real people even gave a shit. Seems like Russian troll farms are amplifying the shit these guys do or say over the internet because I can't imagine people outside of a comment section really giving a shit.

some people are fragile.

Islam reform is a stupid canard.

Transphobia is played

Campus free speech warriors are lying sacks of shit.

steveschneider wrote:

msugolfguy wrote:

I don't mind Peterson but he throws around some religious BS from time to time. Which people take it and run with.

I think he's actually pretty moderate on most issues but he knows where he's bread is buttered. From a mental health perspective he does have a few blind spots but who doesn't. He always cops out and says i'm only pointing out a problem but I don't have the solution.

Like Sam Harris but his Muslim community items can be bit much. Wake me up when Dearborn or Hamtrack become the hotbeds of terrorism in the United States. Funny how you give people some freedom and not bomb the shit out of them they don't want to bomb you back. Amazing how that works Sam.

I was exposed to Peterson for the first time on Bill Maher's show the other week. I had no idea he was such a big deal when he was on the show. There was a pretty pleasant panel discussion and I thought there was some pretty good push back on some of his ideas actually. Funny the next day I'm on youtube and I see his segment off in the sidebar with titles like 'Jordan Peterson Owns Bill Maher's Panel' or 'Jordan Peterson Destroys....'. Also, I go on twitter and it looks like the SJW's are having melt down over Bill having him on.

I find it hard to believe that real people even gave a shit. Seems like Russian troll farms are amplifying the shit these guys do or say over the internet because I can't imagine people outside of a comment section really giving a shit.

In the mental health community he really isn't a big deal. Dont get me wrong, he is smart and well educated. However in terms of academic importance he's a meh. I do think he has some interesting ideas but sorry when you have a pateron site you lose some luster.


He stood up to some stupid law in Canada and then got picked up by Dave Rubin. He blew up after that because Ben Shapiro had a wet dream about how he could help Ben advance he social agenda. Sadly it didn't work out that well for Ben because Peterson is a moderate.

steveschneider wrote:
Interesting I haven't seen any of them champion the free speech of the anthem protesters in NFL. Maybe they are doing it but I haven't found it yet. Those guys are having their careers destroyed and are a marginalized group that are not having their POVs represented in MSM. Maybe pointing SJW hysteria gets more views and clicks though.

I assume you're referring to Kaepernick here. I can't imagine how his free speech is being compromised.
No one is limiting what he can say, however NFL owners have the right to not allow him to do it during their events.
He has limited his employment opportunities with his refusal to understand that (along with playing like shit at SF).
Employers have that option.

I.B. Fine wrote:

steveschneider wrote:
Interesting I haven't seen any of them champion the free speech of the anthem protesters in NFL. Maybe they are doing it but I haven't found it yet.  Those guys are having their careers destroyed and are a marginalized group that are not having their POVs represented in MSM.  Maybe pointing SJW hysteria gets more views and clicks though.

I assume you're referring to Kaepernick here. I can't imagine how his free speech is being compromised.
No one is limiting what he can say, however NFL owners have the right to not allow him to do it during their events.
He has limited his employment opportunities with his refusal to understand that (along with playing like shit at SF).
Employers have that option.

I think when the President of the United States calls someone peacefully participating in free speech a 'son of a bitch', it can be construed as an attempt to intimidate him and/or others into not participating in the same.

of course, the "president" in question is a racist bigot who thinks white supremacists are 'fine people' - so it only emboldens the knuckle-draggers to screech even louder about 'Merica and their little flag.

I.B. Fine wrote:

steveschneider wrote:
Interesting I haven't seen any of them champion the free speech of the anthem protesters in NFL. Maybe they are doing it but I haven't found it yet. Those guys are having their careers destroyed and are a marginalized group that are not having their POVs represented in MSM. Maybe pointing SJW hysteria gets more views and clicks though.

I assume you're referring to Kaepernick here. I can't imagine how his free speech is being compromised.
No one is limiting what he can say, however NFL owners have the right to not allow him to do it during their events.
He has limited his employment opportunities with his refusal to understand that (along with playing like shit at SF).
Employers have that option.

I don't disagree with you that businesses have the right to do that, but it's still a suppression of free speech. I see the dark interweb make huge deals about suppressing free speech on college campuses I just am curious what their stance is about suppressing it at football games.

Also, when the GOAT QB Tom Brady and Aaron Rodgers says Kaepernic is good enough to play for a team and that he's being black listed I'm going to take their word for it.

steveschneider wrote:

I.B. Fine wrote:
I assume you're referring to Kaepernick here. I can't imagine how his free speech is being compromised.
No one is limiting what he can say, however NFL owners have the right to not allow him to do it during their events.
He has limited his employment opportunities with his refusal to understand that (along with playing like shit at SF).
Employers have that option.

I don't disagree with you that businesses have the right to do that, but it's still a suppression of free speech. I see the dark interweb make huge deals about suppressing free speech on college campuses I just am curious what their stance is about suppressing it at football games.

It's bullshit all the way around. Sorry those owners use and abuse tax dollars. Every economic report shows it's an overall economic drain. You never get those dollars back.

That field is public property in my opinion so knee away.

msugolfguy wrote:

steveschneider wrote:

I don't disagree with you that businesses have the right to do that, but it's still a suppression of free speech. I see the dark interweb make huge deals about suppressing free speech on college campuses I just am curious what their stance is about suppressing it at football games.

It's bullshit all the way around. Sorry those owners use and abuse tax dollars. Every economic report shows it's an overall economic drain. You never get those dollars back.

That field is public property in my opinion so knee away.

Hey, I like this msugolfguy! What about the Vikings building a 1 billion dollar stadium? pfffft. Honestly I could watch a game in a billion dollar stadium and I'd enjoy just as much as the games I used to see in the old Pontiac Silverdome.

steveschneider wrote:

I.B. Fine wrote:
I assume you're referring to Kaepernick here. I can't imagine how his free speech is being compromised.
No one is limiting what he can say, however NFL owners have the right to not allow him to do it during their events.
He has limited his employment opportunities with his refusal to understand that (along with playing like shit at SF).
Employers have that option.

I don't disagree with you that businesses have the right to do that, but it's still a suppression of free speech.

racists are gonna be racist.

until white folks are the minority at is relates to power, it won't change.

steveschneider wrote:

msugolfguy wrote:

It's bullshit all the way around. Sorry those owners use and abuse tax dollars. Every economic report shows it's an overall economic drain. You never get those dollars back.

That field is public property in my opinion so knee away.

Hey, I like this msugolfguy! What about the Vikings building a 1 billion dollar stadium? pfffft. Honestly I could watch a game in a billion dollar stadium and I'd enjoy just as much as the games I used to see in the old Pontiac Silverdome.

The Silverdome was great. I mean the fighting was epic. Barry was Barry, good memories with my grandfather, that's for sure.

msugolfguy wrote:
It's bullshit all the way around. Sorry those owners use and abuse tax dollars. Every economic report shows it's an overall economic drain. You never get those dollars back.

That field is public property in my opinion so knee away.

It's public property just like your dorm room was at state. They have control by way of their leases.
Kaepernick actually was able to make a statement, he needs to figure out how to use the platform he created for himself beyond the football field if he's serious. I honestly don't think he's too bright or he'd be on a roster.
Try spouting some anarchist shit at work today and see how that goes over.
I totally agree that dumping public money into Taj Mahal stadiums is idiocy-for the public, genius for the owners.

so.. the "intellectual dark web" is an echo chamber where fragile racists hang out and pretend to be really smart?

I.B. Fine wrote:

msugolfguy wrote:
It's bullshit all the way around. Sorry those owners use and abuse tax dollars. Every economic report shows it's an overall economic drain. You never get those dollars back.

That field is public property in my opinion so knee away.

It's public property just like your dorm room was at state. They have control by way of their leases.
Kaepernick actually was able to make a statement, he needs to figure out how to use the platform he created for himself beyond the football field if he's serious. I honestly don't think he's too bright or he'd be on a roster.
Try spouting some anarchist shit at work today and see how that goes over.
I totally agree that dumping public money into Taj Mahal stadiums is idiocy-for the public, genius for the owners.

Agree or disagree with the NFL anthem protesters, their speech is still being suppressed. Can we at least agree on that?

steveschneider wrote:

I.B. Fine wrote:
Try spouting some anarchist shit at work today and see how that goes over.

Agree or disagree with the NFL anthem protesters, their speech is still being suppressed. Can we at least agree on that?

Do you think you could start preaching to customers about your opinions on some controversial topic while in a business setting without repercussions? Is that suppressing your speech?
Many people conflate freedom of speech with freedom from consequences for that speech. No one is telling Kaepernick what he can or can't say, they're just saying they won't pay him to do it.

I.B. Fine wrote:

steveschneider wrote:

Agree or disagree with the NFL anthem protesters, their speech is still being suppressed. Can we at least agree on that?

Do you think you could start preaching to customers about your opinions on some controversial topic while in a business setting without repercussions? Is that suppressing your speech?
Many people conflate freedom of speech with freedom from consequences for that speech. No one is telling Kaepernick what he can or can't say, they're just saying they won't pay him to do it.

I think you are conflating an office job with being a professional athlete. Not really buying your analogy since Nick Mangold is a very vocal Trump supporter . The nfl suppresses much more innocent forms of expression such as end zone celebrations, taking your helmet off when the play is dead, etc.

Robert J Sakimano wrote:so.. the "intellectual dark web" is an echo chamber where fragile racists hang out and pretend to be really smart?

You might be on to something, Robert.

Rocinante wrote:

Robert J Sakimano wrote:so.. the "intellectual dark web" is an echo chamber where fragile racists hang out and pretend to be really smart?

You might be on to something, Robert.

wouldn't be the first time.

steveschneider wrote:

I.B. Fine wrote:

Do you think you could start preaching to customers about your opinions on some controversial topic while in a business setting without repercussions? Is that suppressing your speech?
Many people conflate freedom of speech with freedom from consequences for that speech. No one is telling Kaepernick what he can or can't say, they're just saying they won't pay him to do it.

I think you are conflating an office job with being a professional athlete. Not really buying your analogy since Nick Mangold is a very vocal Trump supporter . The nfl suppresses much more innocent forms of expression such as end zone celebrations, taking your helmet off when the play is dead, etc.

yep.

and rich white people don't typically attain wealth based on their love of humanity. They typically do so on the backs of minorities. And, as this instance suggests, they like to make sure that the voice of the minority remains silent.

Robert J Sakimano wrote:

steveschneider wrote:

I think you are conflating an office job with being a professional athlete. Not really buying your analogy since Nick Mangold is a very vocal Trump supporter . The nfl suppresses much more innocent forms of expression such as end zone celebrations, taking your helmet off when the play is dead, etc.

yep.

and rich white people don't typically attain wealth based on their love of humanity. They typically do so on the backs of minorities. And, as this instance suggests, they like to make sure that the voice of the minority remains silent.

https://twitter.com/paulkrugman/status/993850211675136000

steveschneider wrote:

Robert J Sakimano wrote: yep.

and rich white people don't typically attain wealth based on their love of humanity. They typically do so on the backs of minorities. And, as this instance suggests, they like to make sure that the voice of the minority remains silent.

https://twitter.com/paulkrugman/status/993850211675136000

I don't read mainstream media articles.

steveschneider wrote:

Robert J Sakimano wrote: yep.

and rich white people don't typically attain wealth based on their love of humanity. They typically do so on the backs of minorities. And, as this instance suggests, they like to make sure that the voice of the minority remains silent.

https://twitter.com/paulkrugman/status/993850211675136000

Lol Dave Rubin. Let's have a talk.