The 2020 Presidential campaign.

Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:

NigelUno wrote:

I didn't get the impression that Bernie or his supporters were that interested in party unification last time.

Didn’t he endorse her?

Bring your GPS and set your home location. You’re about to enter the twilight zone....

kingstonlake wrote:

Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:

Didn’t he endorse her?

Bring your GPS and set your home location. You’re about to enter the twilight zone....

Aw fuck..

Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:

NigelUno wrote:

I didn't get the impression that Bernie or his supporters were that interested in party unification last time.

Didn’t he endorse her?

Is this revisionist history? Did Bernie supporters wholeheartedly back Hillary last time?

I can check with steve.

NigelUno wrote:

Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:

Didn’t he endorse her?

Is this revisionist history? Did Bernie supporters wholeheartedly back Hillary last time?

I can check with steve.

Bernie endorsed her but roughly 25% of his supporters either didn't vote for her or voted for Trump. These people aren't Democrats they are political suicide bombers.

BERNIE SANDERS VOTERS HELPED TRUMP WIN AND HERE'S PROOF

I voted for Ralph Nader.

steveschneider wrote:

Cameron wrote:

It's not even worth correcting anymore.

Fucking Steve was right again!

More like fucking steve is repeatedly wrong on the same issue in the exact same way despite being corrected multiple times on the point, so further corrections are a demonstrably futile effort.

For the sake of argument, though, let's assume that it is actually true that half of Sanders supporters won't support anyone but him. Why do you feel that they owe the Democrats their votes? Pete said, in almost as many words, that he dropped out to help Biden stop Bernie. The Democratic establishment has been screaming from the rooftops that we've gotta stop Bernie and his dangerous ideas from taking over the party. Sanders supporters hear that, and in their minds, the ideas Sanders represents are free healthcare, free education, and a living wage. Why would a Sanders supporter pledge fealty to a candidate and a party who constantly repudiate those ideas as extreme and unrealistic?

It seems like we're jamming (at least) three parties' worth of electorate into two parties. We really should have a right wing pro-life jingo party, a centrist corporatist status quo party, and a left wing progressive pinko party. The center would still get its way, but at least the wings might feel a little better about it.

Rocinante wrote:I voted for Ralph Nader.

I'm a Ross Perot man.

Revisionist history at its finest. Or is this just history?

https://www.cnn.com/2016/07/11/politics/hillary-clinton-bernie-sanders/index.html

I feel the need to remind myself that it's not over. Things will probably be about tied by the time they finish counting all the ballots in California. More debates are on the horizon, and Bernie can turn his focus back to Biden. I agree with analysis I've seen that Bernie took his eye off the ball and counted Biden out. If Warren stays in, which would be delusional, it will be two progressives hammering Biden at the next debate. I don't think he's got the wherewithal to acquit himself too well in that situation. Not sure how much that matters to voters, but there's still a glimmer of hope for progressives, I think.

Cameron wrote:I feel the need to remind myself that it's not over. Things will probably be about tied by the time they finish counting all the ballots in California. More debates are on the horizon, and Bernie can turn his focus back to Biden. I agree with analysis I've seen that Bernie took his eye off the ball and counted Biden out. If Warren stays in, which would be delusional, it will be two progressives hammering Biden at the next debate. I don't think he's got the wherewithal to acquit himself too well in that situation. Not sure how much that matters to voters, but there's still a glimmer of hope for progressives, I think.

I think he miscalculated the amount of votes young people account for.

Politico: Four reasons why Biden shocked Sanders

But it’s been clear that late-breaking positive news can have profound effects in a primary in which voters have been sloshing between several candidates all year. Biden hit a jackpot of timing. By one estimate, the amount of positive coverage he received after the polls closed in South Carolina was worth over $100 million. The results seem to answer rather definitely that so-called earned media — free coverage — is superior to paid advertising.

But Bob will still incessantly assert that the mainstream media is trying to help Bernie.

Also, this is hilarious:

As of late Tuesday, Mike Bloomberg was on track to win four delegates, which would mean he paid over $100 million per delegate.

What a tool...

Cameron wrote:Politico: Four reasons why Biden shocked Sanders

But it’s been clear that late-breaking positive news can have profound effects in a primary in which voters have been sloshing between several candidates all year. Biden hit a jackpot of timing. By one estimate, the amount of positive coverage he received after the polls closed in South Carolina was worth over $100 million. The results seem to answer rather definitely that so-called earned media — free coverage — is superior to paid advertising.

But Bob will still incessantly assert that the mainstream media is trying to help Bernie.

Also, this is hilarious:

As of late Tuesday, Mike Bloomberg was on track to win four delegates, which would mean he paid over $100 million per delegate.

What a tool...

the mainstream media isn't inherently trying to help Bernie.. they're trying to help the racist, bigoted christian sexual predator.

And they, like Russia and the GOP, believe that Bernie as the nominee is the best path toward 4 more years of porn stars, caged children, white supremacist rallies, etc.

Cameron wrote:

Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:

I’d like to see him go with a young female who can speak because he sure as hell cant. Him in a 1vs1 debate with trump is kinda concerning.

I agree, but a VP who can speak won't help Biden on the debate stage with Trump. It's gonna be a bloodbath when he's mano-a-mano with cheeto Hitler.

Cameron wrote:

NigelUno wrote:

Trump is a great debater?  

No, he's a world class bully who's not afraid to be mean and work blue.

Agree. Nigel, we all saw this play at the last election and throughout his term. He says stupid shit, mixes his metaphors, talks in half-truths, etc. But it works. He has a way of making others look defensive and flustered with his nonsense. I was kind of hoping for Bernie, because those two would be must see TV in the debate. Bernie could of drilled down into his bullshit. I don't see Biden being able to do it.

I watched some of Biden's speech last night. He started out hot, and then lost steam. And that was a prepared speech. Put him on the spot and I have no confidence he can salvo with Trump in a debate.

Yes if trump had to go against Warren Klobuchar or Buttigieg it would be a bloodbath. The one thing Biden has is when Trump accuses him of corruption he can reference the reams of hard data on him profiting from being president. So his people need to coach the shit out of him to not engage with trump but just to pivot and accuse. He is such a meanderer and he needs to cut that shit out when debating Trump. Stick to the message, accuse and pivot to how you will do things different. It seems straightforward but he could easily fuck it up royally.

Nordic wrote:

Cameron wrote:

I agree, but a VP who can speak won't help Biden on the debate stage with Trump. It's gonna be a bloodbath when he's mano-a-mano with cheeto Hitler.

Cameron wrote:

No, he's a world class bully who's not afraid to be mean and work blue.

Agree. Nigel, we all saw this play at the last election and throughout his term. He says stupid shit, mixes his metaphors, talks in half-truths, etc. But it works. He has a way of making others look defensive and flustered with his nonsense. I was kind of hoping for Bernie, because those two would be must see TV in the debate. Bernie could of drilled down into his bullshit. I don't see Biden being able to do it.

I watched some of Biden's speech last night. He started out hot, and then lost steam. And that was a prepared speech. Put him on the spot and I have no confidence he can salvo with Trump in a debate.

a "debate" (which isn't even a debate) might make for good TV for the various networks.. but if you're sitting at home watching a "debate" to determine who you should vote for, you're more stupid than I even initially suspected.

(and I don't mean "you" as in you. I'm referring to Mr. and Mrs. Joe Q Couch Potato in general).

Alright centrist Democrats, I'll give you one more chance. I'm all in for Biden, but he better f'n beat Trump.

Three_Putt_Par wrote:Alright centrist Democrats, I'll give you one more chance. I'm all in for Biden, but he better f'n beat Trump.

I wouldn't count on it.

Cameron wrote:I feel the need to remind myself that it's not over. Things will probably be about tied by the time they finish counting all the ballots in California. More debates are on the horizon, and Bernie can turn his focus back to Biden. I agree with analysis I've seen that Bernie took his eye off the ball and counted Biden out. If Warren stays in, which would be delusional, it will be two progressives hammering Biden at the next debate. I don't think he's got the wherewithal to acquit himself too well in that situation. Not sure how much that matters to voters, but there's still a glimmer of hope for progressives, I think.

I think it's over. The wins in MN, MA, and ME for Biden were telling.

Biden better win after all the lectures I've gotten about needing a centrist to beat Trump.

Three_Putt_Par wrote:

Cameron wrote:I feel the need to remind myself that it's not over. Things will probably be about tied by the time they finish counting all the ballots in California. More debates are on the horizon, and Bernie can turn his focus back to Biden. I agree with analysis I've seen that Bernie took his eye off the ball and counted Biden out. If Warren stays in, which would be delusional, it will be two progressives hammering Biden at the next debate. I don't think he's got the wherewithal to acquit himself too well in that situation. Not sure how much that matters to voters, but there's still a glimmer of hope for progressives, I think.

I think it's over. The wins in MN, MA, and ME for Biden were telling.

I'd put Bernie's odds at around 10 to 1, at this point (no idea what Vegas actually has it at). It's probably over, but he's still close enough that if everything breaks right, we could get a miracle.

Three_Putt_Par wrote:Biden better win after all the lectures I've gotten about needing a centrist to beat Trump.

So much this.

Cameron wrote:

Three_Putt_Par wrote:

I think it's over. The wins in MN, MA, and ME for Biden were telling.

Biden better win after all the lectures I've gotten about needing a centrist to beat Trump.

I'd put Bernie's odds at around 10 to 1, at this point (no idea what Vegas actually has it at). It's probably over, but he's still close enough that if everything breaks right, we could get a miracle.

if Biden wins Michigan next week, it's pretty well over for Bernie.

Cameron wrote:

Three_Putt_Par wrote:

I think it's over. The wins in MN, MA, and ME for Biden were telling.

I'd put Bernie's odds at around 10 to 1, at this point (no idea what Vegas actually has it at). It's probably over, but he's still close enough that if everything breaks right, we could get a miracle.

Three_Putt_Par wrote:Biden better win after all the lectures I've gotten about needing a centrist to beat Trump.

So much this.

Dude, If Biden doesn’t beat Trump it doesn’t mean Bernie would have. And vice versa.

kingstonlake wrote:

Cameron wrote:

I'd put Bernie's odds at around 10 to 1, at this point (no idea what Vegas actually has it at). It's probably over, but he's still close enough that if everything breaks right, we could get a miracle.



So much this.

Dude, If Biden doesn’t beat Trump it doesn’t mean Bernie would have. And vice versa.

Yeah, I'm aware. I plan on being exactly as understanding of that fact as moderates would have been if Sanders had won the nomination and lost to Trump. Which is to say, not at all.

We already tried a centrist member of the Obama administration against Trump, it didn't go well. I'm not sure what the polling says currently, but last I saw, Sanders was polling better against Trump than anyone else. But low information voters still think a vote against Sanders is a vote for electability, and that has me embittered.

Edit: According to Real Clear Politics, it's now Biden +3 vs. Trump, Sanders +2 vs. Trump.

Robert J Sakimano wrote:

Cameron wrote:

I'd put Bernie's odds at around 10 to 1, at this point (no idea what Vegas actually has it at). It's probably over, but he's still close enough that if everything breaks right, we could get a miracle.

if Biden wins Michigan next week, it's pretty well over for Bernie.

This has me curious. How is Biden tracking vs. Bernie on the key swing States from the last election (like Michigan)?

Nordic wrote:

Robert J Sakimano wrote:
if Biden wins Michigan next week, it's pretty well over for Bernie.

This has me curious. How is Biden tracking vs. Bernie on the key swing States from the last election (like Michigan)?

Biden +6 in MI, +4 for the nomination overall

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/latest_polls/democratic_nomination_polls/

Cameron wrote:

Nordic wrote:

This has me curious. How is Biden tracking vs. Bernie on the key swing States from the last election (like Michigan)?

Biden +6 in MI, +4 for the nomination overall

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/latest_polls/democratic_nomination_polls/

yep.

and this is a post-South Carolina poll which, as it turns out, was a huge boost of energy and momentum to Biden.. picked up even a bit more steam last night. Bloomberg out will probably help. I suspect Whitmer will endorse him (who the fuck cares, right) but Bernie did win Michigan in 2016. I just have a feeling that Biden is on a roll.

Robert J Sakimano wrote:Hunter Biden is about to become the next coming of Charles Manson again.

as predicted..

Just hours after Joe Biden surged to the top of the Democratic presidential pack, Senate Republicans announced a new phase of their investigation targeting the former vice president and his son Hunter.

Caution: Mainstream Media Link

There is a solid 40% that will lap up everything Trump, his GOP sycophants and the big money donors backing their campaigns say.

It’s the Democrat’s jobs to make sure everyone eligible is registered to vote and get them to the polls in places like AZ, TX, FL, GA, NC, MI, PA and WI in Nov on Election Day.

We know Trump’s support of John James isn’t to see him as MI’s next US Senator, it’s to hope he picks off enough black voters to win MI by at least 0.25% of the votes cast for Biden or Sanders

AvgMSUJoe wrote:BTW, I'm bummed Warren laid such an egg. She's the smartest of the bunch.

I got a hunch.....

MiamiSpartan wrote:

Cameron wrote:

Yeah, I'm aware. I plan on being exactly as understanding of that fact as moderates would have been if Sanders had won the nomination and lost to Trump. Which is to say, not at all.

We already tried a centrist member of the Obama administration against Trump, it didn't go well. I'm not sure what the polling says currently, but last I saw, Sanders was polling better against Trump than anyone else. But low information voters still think a vote against Sanders is a vote for electability, and that has me embittered.

Edit: According to Real Clear Politics, it's now Biden +3 vs. Trump, Sanders +2 vs. Trump.

Sorry, but Hillary is completely irrelevant to Biden. While Hillary was a member of Obama's cabinet, she's effectively a part of Bill Clinton's administration to most Americans.

Even if she was really considered an Obama continuation candidate, that would still be irrelevant to Biden, because it wasn't a campaign about issues and policies then, and it will be even less about issues and policies now.

That's a fair point, and you're absolutely right.

Can we trade Joe for Hillary? I’d do that.

AvgMSUJoe wrote:BTW, I'm bummed Warren laid such an egg. She's the smartest of the bunch.

yep.

She and Hillary have been the most qualified candidates in a generation. Not only is America stupid, but it's misogynistic.

NigelUno wrote:BERNIE SANDERS VOTERS HELPED TRUMP WIN AND HERE'S PROOF

True, but crossovers weren't unique to 2016. 25% of Clinton primary voters voted for McCain in 2008.

I sincerely hope Biden does his best to reach out to the younger/progressive wing of the party.

Three_Putt_Par wrote:I sincerely hope Biden does his best to reach out to the younger/progressive wing of the party.

Yep. But face it, they didn’t come out to vote for Bernie, they ain’t coming out in November.

Biden isn’t the power in his candidacy. If the centrists, who are actually campaigning much more progressive if not to Bernies level than any previous candidates ever, keep surrogating for him throughout this campaign, I mean until November, he will win. If they fragment; he will lose. He is a figurehead. The representation of the post trump world. They have to stay active and vocal through the general. He may be a nice guy, but he’s kind of a clown. He needs all of them. Away we go.