Re: Caution: High School Football Commentary... How Was Okemos HS This Bad?

by **Robert J Sakimano** 9/22/2022, 8:12 am

Trapper Gus wrote:https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2022/9/17/2123552/-Is-tackle-football-unsafe

Pretty sure I wouldn't let my kids play football.

glad our daughter focused on orchestra and theater (not that she was O-line material or anything)..

100% certain I had a pretty severe concussion in the fall of 1986. Onside kick, we had the "hands team" out there.. (I was pretty good with my hands.. especially in the Pizza Hut parking lot after the game).. anyway, my teammate recovered the onside kick, whistle is blown. This fucking hillbilly redneck was running at 100% and drilled me. My chinstrap came off, an ear pad came out of my helmet.

Blacked out for a couple of seconds. When I opened my eyes, I saw yellow flags all around and my boys were whippin' his ass (shout out to my teammates).

I make it to the sidelines and I remember throwing up. Gotta remember, this is 36 years ago. We didn't have concussion protocols, etc. Nobody knew much of nothing about anything.

anyway, after the game, I jump in the shower at the field house, climb into my buddy's 1984 Toyota Celica. As I'm waiting on him (before we head to the Pizza Hut), I completely black out again in his car. He gets in and I'm basically asleep in the passenger seat. Shocked

I kinda came out of it and we went on about our night. But, my lord, looking back at it now, I think I was pretty screwed up for a while. Frightening in retrospect.

by **Trapper Gus** 9/22/2022, 8:40 am

Robert J Sakimano wrote:
Trapper Gus wrote:https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2022/9/17/2123552/-Is-tackle-football-unsafe

Pretty sure I wouldn't let my kids play football.
glad our daughter focused on orchestra and theater (not that she was O-line material or anything)..

100% certain I had a pretty severe concussion in the fall of 1986. Onside kick, we had the "hands team" out there.. (I was pretty good with my hands.. especially in the Pizza Hut parking lot after the game).. anyway, my teammate recovered the onside kick, whistle is blown. This fucking hillbilly redneck was running at 100% and drilled me. My chinstrap came off, an ear pad came out of my helmet.

Blacked out for a couple of seconds. When I opened my eyes, I saw yellow flags all around and my boys were whippin' his ass (shout out to my teammates).

I make it to the sidelines and I remember throwing up. Gotta remember, this is 36 years ago. We didn't have concussion protocols, etc. Nobody knew much of nothing about anything.

anyway, after the game, I jump in the shower at the field house, climb into my buddy's 1984 Toyota Celica. As I'm waiting on him (before we head to the Pizza Hut), I completely black out again in his car. He gets in and I'm basically asleep in the passenger seat.

I kinda came out of it and we went on about our night. But, my lord, looking back at it now, I think I was pretty screwed up for a while. Frightening in retrospect.

Bob, I'm not a doctor, and I don't play one on Tee Vee, however that sounds pretty severe.

My first mindless thought, given that you blacked out again later, is that you are lucky to be still with us. The second blackout is sometimes an indication of bleeding in the brain, which sometimes leads shortly to death.

When I was in grade school one of the high school football players died on the field during a game, don't know the cause.

The evidence is growing that playing high school football can shorten how long people live.

I know it is entertaining, and I am as hypocritical about this as anybody, but along with boxing this is a sport which involves watching people literally slowly killing themselves for other people's entertainment.

Perhaps the solution is to eliminate helmets and outlaw head contact.

We allowed our track star son to go out for football his junior year, his coaches thought the weight training would help his track performance, he was slotted to be a receiver, but on the first day of hitting he racked up his knee, ending his football, and track careers, thank goodness on the football, really sad about the track as he was competitive at the state level before that.

Happy to see that you recovered.

by **Robert J Sakimano** 9/22/2022, 9:16 am

Trapper Gus wrote:
Robert J Sakimano wrote:
glad our daughter focused on orchestra and theater (not that she was O-line material or anything)..

100% certain I had a pretty severe concussion in the fall of 1986. Onside kick, we had the "hands team" out there.. (I was pretty good with my hands.. especially in the Pizza Hut parking lot after the game).. anyway, my teammate recovered the onside kick, whistle is blown. This fucking hillbilly redneck was running at 100% and drilled me. My chinstrap came off, an ear pad came out of my helmet.

Blacked out for a couple of seconds. When I opened my eyes, I saw yellow flags all around and my boys were whippin' his ass (shout out to my teammates).

I make it to the sidelines and I remember throwing up. Gotta remember, this is 36 years ago. We didn't have concussion protocols, etc. Nobody knew much of nothing about anything.

anyway, after the game, I jump in the shower at the field house, climb into my buddy's 1984 Toyota Celica. As I'm waiting on him (before we head to the Pizza Hut), I completely black out again in his car. He gets in and I'm basically asleep in the passenger seat.

I kinda came out of it and we went on about our night. But, my lord, looking back at it now, I think I was pretty screwed up for a while. Frightening in retrospect.

Bob, I'm not a doctor, and I don't play one on Tee Vee, however that sounds pretty severe.

My first mindless thought, given that you blacked out again later, is that you are lucky to be still with us. The second blackout is sometimes an indication of bleeding in the brain, which sometimes leads shortly to death.

When I was in grade school one of the high school football players died on the field during a game, don't know the cause.

The evidence is growing that playing high school football can shorten how long people live.

I know it is entertaining, and I am as hypocritical about this as anybody, but along with boxing this is a sport which involves watching people literally slowly killing themselves for other people's entertainment.

Perhaps the solution is to eliminate helmets and outlaw head contact.

We allowed our track star son to go out for football his junior year, his coaches thought the weight training would help his track performance, he was slotted to be a receiver, but on the first day of hitting he racked up his knee, ending his football, and track careers, thank goodness on the football, really sad about the track as he was competitive at the state level before that.

Happy to see that you recovered.

thanks, man. Luckily, I don't think it impacted my poet laureate status on the other board.

sorry to hear about your son. Yeah, hate the idea of it impacting his track career. I love sports as much as anyone, and I'll be glued to football starting tonight through Sunday, but I do feel conflicted about the entertainment value we find in others who put their health (and lives) at great risk.

by **duffy munn** 9/26/2022, 11:28 pm

Fred Heuman reporting that Okemos may cancel the rest of this football season. They have scored 6 points in the last 13 games.

by **Trapper Gus** 9/26/2022, 11:31 pm

duffy munn wrote:Fred Heuman reporting that Okemos may cancel the rest of this football season. They have scored 6 points in the last 13 games.

Is the beginning of the end, or just a one off?

In Saline, pretty much the Okemos of A2, football is still a very big thing.

by **duffy munn** 9/26/2022, 11:44 pm

Trapper Gus wrote:
duffy munn wrote:Fred Heuman reporting that Okemos may cancel the rest of this football season. They have scored 6 points in the last 13 games.

Is the beginning of the end, or just a one off?

In Saline, pretty much the Okemos of A2, football is still a very big thing.

Uncle Fred said the future of the program will be discussed. sure doesn't sound good but I get it. As has been mentioned in this thread, having less than 20 kids is dangerous.

by **Trapper Gus** 9/27/2022, 12:00 am

duffy munn wrote:
Trapper Gus wrote:

Is the beginning of the end, or just a one off?

In Saline, pretty much the Okemos of A2, football is still a very big thing.

Uncle Fred said the future of the program will be discussed. sure doesn't sound good but I get it. As has been mentioned in this thread, having less than 20 kids is dangerous.

Back in the early 2000's Saline had 45, which I thought was way too low. These kids are going to be hurt.

by **tGreenWay** 9/27/2022, 12:13 am

Anyone know if EL won last Friday?

by **tGreenWay** 9/27/2022, 12:14 am

on a related note, I can’t believe I just inquired about a high school football game.

by **duffy munn** 9/27/2022, 12:19 am

tGreenWay wrote:on a related note, I can’t believe I just inquired about a high school football game.

It's a thread about, wait for it, high school football greenway. Or in this case maybe the beginning of the end for high school football in Okemos

by **Turtleneck** 9/27/2022, 7:23 am

tGreenWay wrote:Anyone know if EL won last Friday?

Have you tried looking on the Internet for the score?

by **Jake from State Farm** 9/27/2022, 7:37 am

Turtleneck wrote:
tGreenWay wrote:Anyone know if EL won last Friday?

Have you tried looking on the Internet for the score?

The internet has that kind of information?

by **Robert J Sakimano** 9/27/2022, 6:13 pm

tGreenWay wrote:Anyone know if EL won last Friday?

lost to Grand Blanc.

by **duffy munn** 9/27/2022, 7:08 pm

Robert J Sakimano wrote:
tGreenWay wrote:Anyone know if EL won last Friday?
lost to Grand Blanc.

do you think Okemos should shut it down Bob? I do for the safety of the players. I feel bad for Efe. Good guy and married to a friend of mine's daughter. She was an EL basketball star and played college ball at Saginaw Valley. Briefly worked for Suzy at MSU.

Cool story alert. When I was coaching 8th grade basketball at St Thomas she had a brother on the team and we would let her practice with us. She was in 5th grade and dominated

by aualum06 9/27/2022, 7:17 pm

duffy munn wrote:
Robert J Sakimano wrote: lost to Grand Blanc.

do you think Okemos should shut it down Bob? I do for the safety of the players. I feel bad for Efe. Good guy and married to a friend of mine's daughter. She was an EL basketball star and played college ball at Saginaw Valley. Briefly worked for Suzy at MSU.

Cool story alert. When I was coaching 8th grade basketball at St Thomas she had a brother on the team and we would let her practice with us. She was in 5th grade and dominated

Just saw they forfeited the rest of the season

by **Travis of the Cosmos** 9/27/2022, 7:23 pm

This article says that they’re going to play jv. Probably makes sense just kinda relegate the whole team to jv

https://www.wlns.com/news/michigan/okemos-public-schools-forfeits-entire-varsity-football-season/amp/

by **DWags** 9/27/2022, 7:45 pm

I get it a d they should, but damn, Okemos. That’s crazy. Happy the kids won’t get hurt or humiliated anymore.

by aualum06 9/27/2022, 7:48 pm

DWags wrote:I get it a d they should, but damn, Okemos. That’s crazy. Happy the kids won’t get hurt or humiliated anymore.

It's mind boggling they have almost 1500 kids and were decent as recently as 2018 but has been awful for 3 years now

by **tGreenWay** 9/27/2022, 8:01 pm

duffy munn wrote:
tGreenWay wrote:on a related note, I can’t believe I just inquired about a high school football game.

It's a thread about, wait for it, high school football greenway. Or in this case maybe the beginning of the end for high school football in Okemos

Don’t get cocky or I’ll kick you out of text club.

by **tGreenWay** 9/27/2022, 8:03 pm

Turtleneck wrote:
tGreenWay wrote:Anyone know if EL won last Friday?

Have you tried looking on the Internet for the score?

Have you heard of trying to jump start interaction on a dead board?

by **tGreenWay** 9/27/2022, 8:11 pm

Jake from State Farm wrote:
Turtleneck wrote:

Have you tried looking on the Internet for the score?

The internet has that kind of information?

Turtleneck’s probably does because he’s a latte swilling, Volvo driving ivory tower elitist academic.

by **Trapper Gus** 9/27/2022, 8:20 pm

tGreenWay wrote:
Jake from State Farm wrote:

The internet has that kind of information?

Turtleneck’s probably does because he’s a latte swilling, Volvo driving ivory tower elitist academic.

I knew there was something about him to like.

by **Robert J Sakimano** 9/27/2022, 8:54 pm

duffy munn wrote:
Robert J Sakimano wrote: lost to Grand Blanc.

do you think Okemos should shut it down Bob? I do for the safety of the players. I feel bad for Efe. Good guy and married to a friend of mine's daughter. She was an EL basketball star and played college ball at Saginaw Valley. Briefly worked for Suzy at MSU.

Cool story alert. When I was coaching 8th grade basketball at St Thomas she had a brother on the team and we would let her practice with us. She was in 5th grade and dominated

yep. Efe is a good dude and, I hope, if given the chance, he can right the ship there. Even just to get some numbers up and maybe be a little more competitive next year.

The JV and freshman teams are still playing, so that tells me that they aren't getting rid of football as a whole. I guess anything can happen

Efe was a great football player and track athlete. I think he drove Finamore crazy on the basketball court. A great athlete but it didn't always translate to basketball skills.

by **Trapper Gus** 9/27/2022, 9:01 pm

Robert J Sakimano wrote:
duffy munn wrote:

do you think Okemos should shut it down Bob? I do for the safety of the players. I feel bad for Efe. Good guy and married to a friend of mine's daughter. She was an EL basketball star and played college ball at Saginaw Valley. Briefly worked for Suzy at MSU.

Cool story alert. When I was coaching 8th grade basketball at St Thomas she had a brother on the team and we would let her practice with us. She was in 5th grade and dominated
yep. Efe is a good dude and, I hope, if given the chance, he can right the ship there. Even just to get some numbers up and maybe be a little more competitive next year.

The JV and freshman teams are still playing, so that tells me that they aren't getting rid of football as a whole. I guess anything can happen

Efe was a great football player and track athlete. I think he drove Finamore crazy on the basketball court. A great athlete but it didn't always translate to basketball skills.

Saline, which is about the same size high school, as I said, only had about 45 kids out for football in 2002. Now they are a power in the state. These things happen in waves.

by **duffy munn** 9/27/2022, 9:06 pm

Robert J Sakimano wrote:
duffy munn wrote:

do you think Okemos should shut it down Bob? I do for the safety of the players. I feel bad for Efe. Good guy and married to a friend of mine's daughter. She was an EL basketball star and played college ball at Saginaw Valley. Briefly worked for Suzy at MSU.

Cool story alert. When I was coaching 8th grade basketball at St Thomas she had a brother on the team and we would let her practice with us. She was in 5th grade and dominated
yep. Efe is a good dude and, I hope, if given the chance, he can right the ship there. Even just to get some numbers up and maybe be a little more competitive next year.

The JV and freshman teams are still playing, so that tells me that they aren't getting rid of football as a whole. I guess anything can happen

Efe was a great football player and track athlete. I think he drove Finamore crazy on the basketball court. A great athlete but it didn't always translate to basketball skills.

Yeah efe was not a great basketball player but his wife was. She never drove Rob smith crazy

by **Turtleneck** 9/27/2022, 9:53 pm

Trapper Gus wrote:
Robert J Sakimano wrote: yep. Efe is a good dude and, I hope, if given the chance, he can right the ship there. Even just to get some numbers up and maybe be a little more competitive next year.

The JV and freshman teams are still playing, so that tells me that they aren't getting rid of football as a whole. I guess anything can happen

Efe was a great football player and track athlete. I think he drove Finamore crazy on the basketball court. A great athlete but it didn't always translate to basketball skills.

Saline, which is about the same size high school, as I said, only had about 45 kids out for football in 2002. Now they are a power in the state. These things happen in waves.

Sounds like Saline found a solution.

by AvgMSUJoe 9/27/2022, 10:01 pm

Trapper Gus wrote:These things happen in waves.

Not as much with school of choice. Football kids go to football schools now a days.

by **tGreenWay** 9/28/2022, 4:11 am

Turtleneck wrote:
Trapper Gus wrote:

Saline, which is about the same size high school, as I said, only had about 45 kids out for football in 2002. Now they are a power in the state. These things happen in waves.

Sounds like Saline found a solution.

Oh, sweet Jesus, I hope WBH read this.

by AvgMSUJoe 9/28/2022, 8:44 am

My local school (850 ish) has 23 on varsity. The school hasn't had a winning season in 20 years.
I personally know of 12 kids who went to nearby schools with "winning" programs.
It's as bad as college crootin. Delusional parents think the kid needs to go other places to get looked at for colleges (they rarely do get looked at or end up paying to play somewhere).
I'd bet same with Okemos, handfuls of kids play on Haslett or EL or wherever...

by **Trapper Gus** 9/28/2022, 9:17 am

Turtleneck wrote:
Trapper Gus wrote:

Saline, which is about the same size high school, as I said, only had about 45 kids out for football in 2002. Now they are a power in the state. These things happen in waves.

Sounds like Saline found a solution.

The longtime coach retired, and they brought in fresh blood was the basic turn around.

Don't know what the new coach did to get players back in the program, however he did.

Winning games is of course part of it.

by **Turtleneck** 9/28/2022, 9:29 am

tGreenWay wrote:
Turtleneck wrote:

Sounds like Saline found a solution.

Oh, sweet Jesus, I hope WBH read this.

Schilling read it last week and told him advance, so he will probably skip this thread.

by **Travis of the Cosmos** 9/28/2022, 10:28 am

My impression of Saline is that it’s a growing community. More people, households, families than there were just 20 years ago. And it’s probably also the kind of community that can benefit from having a mix of more suburban kids/Ann Arbor and some of that good ole country beef to fill out the offensive and defensive lines. Lot of people that need to be in that area for work that can’t pay insane Ann Arbor real estate prices are going to end up in Saline.

Okemos doesn’t really have that. Not a ton of room for growth there. More of an older demographic and the families that are there are probably the type that are a lot less inclined to have their kids play football.

by **tGreenWay** 9/28/2022, 10:32 am

It’s important to note that Travis had been living in Okemos and only recently moved away. If the high school football team in his new location begins to tank while Okemos rebounds, we’ll have found the problem.

by **Robert J Sakimano** 9/28/2022, 10:53 am

Okemos is really just a school district.

It doesn't have a 'downtown', no main street of any sort. It's a school district with expensive, sanitized houses that fall somewhere along the color scheme of grey and taupe.. and it has a lot of strip malls, BMW dealerships, cosmetic surgery options, etc.

not a ton of community pride as it relates to the "community".

by **Travis of the Cosmos** 9/28/2022, 11:04 am

tGreenWay wrote:It’s important to note that Travis had been living in Okemos and only recently moved away. If the high school football team in his new location begins to tank while Okemos rebounds, we’ll have found the problem.

I have NEVER lived in a district with a good football team. Growing up I was surrounded by 4 schools within like 5 miles that all have won state championships (I think. At least they’ve all competed for them in the last 20 years) but my team, geographical right in the middle of all of them, has been perennially terrible the whole time. I’m not sure if they’ve even made the playoffs in that time. If they did they were summarily executed when they got there.

So yeah you could be on to something

by **Jake from State Farm** 9/28/2022, 11:13 am

Robert J Sakimano wrote:Okemos is really just a school district.

It doesn't have a 'downtown', no main street of any sort. It's a school district with expensive, sanitized houses that fall somewhere along the color scheme of grey and taupe.. and it has a lot of strip malls, BMW dealerships, cosmetic surgery options, etc.

not a ton of community pride as it relates to the "community".

The commercial part of this project getting cut by another 6,000 square feet. If it ever does get built.

Village of Okemos Project

There used to be somewhat of a downtown. Drug store on one corner, grocery store on another, hardware store, Millers Ice Cream store. All are now gone.

by **Robert J Sakimano** 9/28/2022, 11:29 am

Jake from State Farm wrote:
Robert J Sakimano wrote:Okemos is really just a school district.

It doesn't have a 'downtown', no main street of any sort. It's a school district with expensive, sanitized houses that fall somewhere along the color scheme of grey and taupe.. and it has a lot of strip malls, BMW dealerships, cosmetic surgery options, etc.

not a ton of community pride as it relates to the "community".

The commercial part of this project getting cut by another 6,000 square feet. If it ever does get built.

Village of Okemos Project

There used to be somewhat of a downtown. Drug store on one corner, grocery store on another, hardware store, Millers Ice Cream store. All are now gone.

yeah, even 10-15 years or so ago, when Traveler's Club was on the corner and all of the other shops/stores in that general area were open, it had a little bit more of a community feel to it.

by **GRR Spartan** 9/28/2022, 11:59 am

Algonac HS cancelled their varsity football season in August after they had 6 players show up for the first fall practice. Holland HS announced they were cancelling the rest of their varsity season in early September due to low numbers. Now Okemos follows suit.

I spoke to an acquaintance who works for MHSAA after Holland HS made their announcement who told me he’s hearing from AD’s who are interested in expanding the pool to be eligible to field 8 Man Football because their schools are seeing football participant numbers dropping.

MHSAA is wrestling with further expansion of the 8 Man game because they foresee some schools more interested in state championships than having a .500 11 man team. However they are aware that a small percentage of HS players go on to play any level of college football and players with hopes of playing beyond HS will transfer to schools still playing traditional 11 man football.

PS
MHSAA is very aware of boys soccer’s effect on football from soccer’s rising participation levels and its lower costs. The rub is a lot of school’s main athletic fundraiser’s are football ticket and concession sales.

by **Trapper Gus** 9/28/2022, 5:30 pm

GRR Spartan wrote:Algonac HS cancelled their varsity football season in August after they had 6 players show up for the first fall practice. Holland HS announced they were cancelling the rest of their varsity season in early September due to low numbers. Now Okemos follows suit.

I spoke to an acquaintance who works for MHSAA after Holland HS made their announcement who told me he’s hearing from AD’s who are interested in expanding the pool to be eligible to field 8 Man Football because their schools are seeing football participant numbers dropping.

MHSAA is wrestling with further expansion of the 8 Man game because they foresee some schools more interested in state championships than having a .500 11 man team. However they are aware that a small percentage of HS players go on to play any level of college football and players with hopes of playing beyond HS will transfer to schools still playing traditional 11 man football.

PS
MHSAA is very aware of boys soccer’s effect on football from soccer’s rising participation levels and its lower costs. The rub is a lot of school’s main athletic fundraiser’s are football ticket and concession sales.

With the brain damage caused by football I would thing that 8 on 8 (I thought it was 7 on 7) would be a preferable version of the game.

by aualum06 9/28/2022, 5:40 pm

GRR Spartan wrote:Algonac HS cancelled their varsity football season in August after they had 6 players show up for the first fall practice. Holland HS announced they were cancelling the rest of their varsity season in early September due to low numbers. Now Okemos follows suit.

I spoke to an acquaintance who works for MHSAA after Holland HS made their announcement who told me he’s hearing from AD’s who are interested in expanding the pool to be eligible to field 8 Man Football because their schools are seeing football participant numbers dropping.

MHSAA is wrestling with further expansion of the 8 Man game because they foresee some schools more interested in state championships than having a .500 11 man team. However they are aware that a small percentage of HS players go on to play any level of college football and players with hopes of playing beyond HS will transfer to schools still playing traditional 11 man football.

PS
MHSAA is very aware of boys soccer’s effect on football from soccer’s rising participation levels and its lower costs. The rub is a lot of school’s main athletic fundraiser’s are football ticket and concession sales.

They have already allowed to many schools to go 8 man. It should be for enrollments 175 and below only.

And teams have already joined for winning not numbers

by Sponsored content