Classified Biden documents found - now up to 3 locations.

TravelinMan wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

If he is going to gaslight he is, yes.

It seems to be the go-to move by some posters on some boards, and really people should stop telling other people what the other people believe and just read what they say.

If you want to express what you believe that others believe as an opinion, such as "I thought that liberals believe ..." that would allow you to express your ideas without directly gaslighting, however it is still a slightly less offensive form of gaslighting.

I was trying to leave the political labeling out of it. I find that very tiresome. What the F even is a "liberal" or a "conservative" anymore? It's all tribal camps and my guy versus your guy and your side is evil and stupid and my side is innocent and misunderstood. It's just dumb. Neither political party is exactly hitting it out of the park these days and while I don't believe Americans deserve better, it sure would be nice.

Bothsiders gonna bothsides

TravelinMan wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

Unsure how you come to that conclusion, or why you think people want the CEO's are held accountable for every mistake made in a company.

Typically, people saying what you are saying, which is gaslighting btw, telling others what they believe when they don't believe it, are attempting to win an argument by lying.

Neither investigation, Biden or Trump, is complete, so what is appropriate is yet to be determined.

You seem to be falling into the media trap of judgement before we know all the facts.

From what we have heard in the MSM the differences in what happened with Trump verses what happened with Biden are huge.

You make a valid point in that neither investigation is complete, and therefore we can't come to a final judgement.  I mean... that's never stopped anyone here before, but I do agree with the sentiment.

The intent and paths the two Presidents appear to have taken may be different, but the end result is the same.

Serenity has it right.  Neither one of them will get so much as a slap on the wrist.  Hopefully the American public wakes up and moves on from both of these two octogenarian bozos.

The one difference is that the access to the documents Biden had seems to have been less, a private office & a private home, than the access to the ones Trump had in a resort basement and an office in that resort.

I suppose the cleaning crew who cleans Biden's home would be the best place to install a spy, while at Trump's resort there are multiple opportunities.

As noted, that apparently no one knew they were there might have provide some protection from the information leaking in Biden's case.  Way too many people knew that Trump had these documents and where they were.

We can assume that the FBI went through the documents with a fine-tooth comb to try to determine how many people they can identify who had access.

Trapper Gus wrote:

TravelinMan wrote:

You make a valid point in that neither investigation is complete, and therefore we can't come to a final judgement.  I mean... that's never stopped anyone here before, but I do agree with the sentiment.

The intent and paths the two Presidents appear to have taken may be different, but the end result is the same.

Serenity has it right.  Neither one of them will get so much as a slap on the wrist.  Hopefully the American public wakes up and moves on from both of these two octogenarian bozos.

The one difference is that the access to the documents Biden had seems to have been less, a private office & a private home, than the access to the ones Trump had in a resort basement and an office in that resort.

I suppose the cleaning crew who cleans Biden's home would be the best place to install a spy, while at Trump's resort there are multiple opportunities.

As noted, that apparently no one knew they were there might have provide some protection from the information leaking in Biden's case.  Way too many people knew that Trump had these documents and where they were.

We can assume that the FBI went through the documents with a fine-tooth comb to try to determine how many people they can identify who had access.

Documents found at the location Biden calls his residence? Check.

Documents found at the location Trump calls his residence? Check.

Plenty of people in both locations could have accessed those docs. There was no sign in sheet at Uncle Joe's cottage, so we have no way of knowing who came in and out of the place.

TravelinMan wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

The one difference is that the access to the documents Biden had seems to have been less, a private office & a private home, than the access to the ones Trump had in a resort basement and an office in that resort.

I suppose the cleaning crew who cleans Biden's home would be the best place to install a spy, while at Trump's resort there are multiple opportunities.

As noted, that apparently no one knew they were there might have provide some protection from the information leaking in Biden's case.  Way too many people knew that Trump had these documents and where they were.

We can assume that the FBI went through the documents with a fine-tooth comb to try to determine how many people they can identify who had access.

Documents found at the location Biden calls his residence? Check.

Documents found at the location Trump calls his residence? Check.

Plenty of people in both locations could have accessed those docs. There was no sign in sheet at Uncle Joe's cottage, so we have no way of knowing who came in and out of the place.

Ignoring that Trump's "residence" is a resort where hundreds of people stay each year & which has probably hundreds of staff with access is stretching the typical meaning of "residence". Biden certainly has hundreds of people who visit him at his house, I assume, and also as noted above most likely has cleaning staff and others.

Sooner or later, we will be told what information was found at the Biden places. We already know that Trump had some tippy top secret "eyes only" stuff that typically comes with a courier that stays with it.

Trapper Gus wrote:

TravelinMan wrote:

Documents found at the location Biden calls his residence? Check.

Documents found at the location Trump calls his residence? Check.

Plenty of people in both locations could have accessed those docs. There was no sign in sheet at Uncle Joe's cottage, so we have no way of knowing who came in and out of the place.

Ignoring that Trump's "residence" is a resort where hundreds of people stay each year & which has probably hundreds of staff with access is stretching the typical meaning of "residence". Biden certainly has hundreds of people who visit him at his house, I assume, and also as noted above most likely has cleaning staff and others.

Sooner or later, we will be told what information was found at the Biden places. We already know that Trump had some tippy top secret "eyes only" stuff that typically comes with a courier that stays with it.

You think Trump's private quarters are just open to any member of Mara Lago who wanders in out of the bar? Come on, man.

Top Secret vs. Tippy Top Secret is just years added to the sentence if I were in charge. But as we've all agreed, it will never come to that in either case.

TravelinMan wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

Ignoring that Trump's "residence" is a resort where hundreds of people stay each year & which has probably hundreds of staff with access is stretching the typical meaning of "residence".  Biden certainly has hundreds of people who visit him at his house, I assume, and also as noted above most likely has cleaning staff and others.

Sooner or later, we will be told what information was found at the Biden places.  We already know that Trump had some tippy top secret "eyes only" stuff that typically comes with a courier that stays with it.

You think Trump's private quarters  are just open to any member of Mara Lago who wanders in out of the bar?   Come on, man.

Top Secret vs. Tippy Top Secret is just years added to the sentence if I were in charge.  But as we've all agreed, it will never come to that in either case.

I think they are open to the staff of the place; it isn't clear that the room in which most of the documents he took was stored was part of his private quarters. Until the National Archives started bugging him the room didn't even have a lock.

As to what the information is, for Trump anyway it is said to have included the identities of a number of human assets who spy for the United States all over the world.  This may cause huge amounts of damage to the US's ability to gather information, if true.

Trapper Gus wrote:

TravelinMan wrote:

You think Trump's private quarters  are just open to any member of Mara Lago who wanders in out of the bar?   Come on, man.

Top Secret vs. Tippy Top Secret is just years added to the sentence if I were in charge.  But as we've all agreed, it will never come to that in either case.

I think they are open to the staff of the place; it isn't clear that the room in which most of the documents he took was stored was part of his private quarters. Until the National Archives started bugging him the room didn't even have a lock.

As to what the information is, for Trump anyway it is said to have included the identities of a number of human assets who spy for the United States all over the world.  This may cause huge amounts of damage to the US's ability to gather information, if true.

Yeah. Trump's docs were out in the lobby sitting next to reception.

Come on, man. I want to throw Trump in jail the same as you do, but you gotta have some objectivity in this if you want to be taken seriously.

TravelinMan wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

I think they are open to the staff of the place; it isn't clear that the room in which most of the documents he took was stored was part of his private quarters.  Until the National Archives started bugging him the room didn't even have a lock.

As to what the information is, for Trump anyway it is said to have included the identities of a number of human assets who spy for the United States all over the world.  This may cause huge amounts of damage to the US's ability to gather information, if true.

Yeah.  Trump's docs were out in the lobby sitting next to reception.

Come on, man.  I want to throw Trump in jail the same as you do, but you gotta have some objectivity in this if you want to be taken seriously.

I have stayed objective, and much of what I have been saying about the security at Trump's resort is stuff that has been reported in reputable media.  That is media which has editors and fact checking.  At one point they reported that any guest (& staff) would have had access to the room that all the boxes were stored in.

edit this board does have a thread about Trump's documents - https://spartanswill.forumotion.com/t24424-apparently-mar-a-lago-has-been-raided-by-the-fbi

edit2 - So, I had to look this up and post it.

Yahoo wrote:The New York Times reported that of the more than 100 classified documents found at Mar-a-Lago, most were located in a non-secure storage area. Documents labeled "Top Secret" were kept among beach chairs, umbrellas, and cleaning supplies in an area that may have been accessible to resort guests, The Times found.

During its August 2022 raid, FBI agents found classified documents in Trump's "45 Office" — located above Mar-a-Lago's main ballroom. The Times reported that it was unclear if there was security in place to separate partygoers from Trump's office.

Guests at Mar-a-Lago were only 60 feet away from the documents at times, according to The Times.

https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/trump-boasts-mar-lago-secure-131405770.html

Rocinante wrote:

TravelinMan wrote:

I was trying to leave the political labeling out of it. I find that very tiresome. What the F even is a "liberal" or a "conservative" anymore? It's all tribal camps and my guy versus your guy and your side is evil and stupid and my side is innocent and misunderstood. It's just dumb. Neither political party is exactly hitting it out of the park these days and while I don't believe Americans deserve better, it sure would be nice.

Bothsiders gonna bothsides

I maintain that, as ever, both sides are bad, but not equally bad. The imbalance is important to bear in mind, if a bit tiresome to point out all the time.

Cameron wrote:

Rocinante wrote:

Bothsiders gonna bothsides

I maintain that, as ever, both sides are bad, but not equally bad. The imbalance is important to bear in mind, if a bit tiresome to point out all the time.

I actually agree that the right is worse than the left, but neither side is rated as “acceptable” at the moment, IMO.

I disagree in that what the left wants to do makes sense while what the right wants to do doesn't.

edit - came across this which left me wondering what people on this board believe.

In Britain, far fewer people believe in conspiracy theories. According to YouGov polling, a third of Americans believe that a small group of people secretly runs the world, while just 18 percent believe the same in the United Kingdom. Similarly, 9 percent of Americans think COVID-19 is a fake disease. In Britain, that figure is just 3 percent. Seventeen percent of Americans agree with the statement that “a secret group of Satan-worshipping pedophiles has taken control of parts of the U.S. Government and mainstream U.S. media,” compared with 8 percent of Britons.

Trapper Gus wrote:I disagree in that what the left wants to do makes sense while what the right wants to do doesn't.

edit - came across this which left me wondering what people on this board believe.

In Britain, far fewer people believe in conspiracy theories. According to YouGov polling, a third of Americans believe that a small group of people secretly runs the world, while just 18 percent believe the same in the United Kingdom. Similarly, 9 percent of Americans think COVID-19 is a fake disease. In Britain, that figure is just 3 percent. Seventeen percent of Americans agree with the statement that “a secret group of Satan-worshipping pedophiles has taken control of parts of the U.S. Government and mainstream U.S. media,” compared with 8 percent of Britons.

It “makes sense” in the sense that they are real actual policy proposals that other countries already do. Someone may not agree with them, but that doesnt make them not legitimate ideas in the world of discourse.

The other side doesn’t make sense in that they are largely inventing boogeymen and culture wars in their own minds for the purpose of getting re-elected. These are not real legitimate ideas, they’re exclusively for the purpose of leading a frothing mob.

Not really talking to you trapper just expanding because leaving it at makes sense or doesn’t falls short for me

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:I disagree in that what the left wants to do makes sense while what the right wants to do doesn't.

edit - came across this which left me wondering what people on this board believe.

It “makes sense” in the sense that they are real actual policy proposals that other countries already do. Someone may not agree with them, but that doesnt make them not legitimate ideas in the world of discourse.

The other side doesn’t make sense in that they are largely inventing boogeymen and culture wars in their own minds for the purpose of getting re-elected. These are not real legitimate ideas, they’re exclusively for the purpose of leading a frothing mob.

Not really talking to you trapper just expanding because leaving it at makes sense or doesn’t falls short for me

If you read this from Thom Hartman then maybe what the Republicans are doing makes sense in that their goal is to turn the United States further into an oligarchy.

https://hartmannreport.com/p/is-the-reason-some-wealthy-people

Trapper Gus wrote:

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:

It “makes sense” in the sense that they are real actual policy proposals that other countries already do. Someone may not agree with them, but that doesnt make them not legitimate ideas in the world of discourse.

The other side doesn’t make sense in that they are largely inventing boogeymen and culture wars in their own minds for the purpose of getting re-elected. These are not real legitimate ideas, they’re exclusively for the purpose of leading a frothing mob.

Not really talking to you trapper just expanding because leaving it at makes sense or doesn’t falls short for me

If you read this from Thom Hartman then maybe what the Republicans are doing makes sense in that their goal is to turn the United States further into an oligarchy.

https://hartmannreport.com/p/is-the-reason-some-wealthy-people

We are Russia lite. Until there’s a complete overhaul of both sides will will be fighting for limited seats on the plane. My prediction is within the next 25 years as the population starts seeing it for what it is you’ll see the gop trend towards eroding second amendment rights.

Trapper Gus wrote:

If you read this from Thom Hartman then maybe what the Republicans are doing makes sense in that their goal is to turn the United States further into an oligarchy.

https://hartmannreport.com/p/is-the-reason-some-wealthy-people

If you don't see both parties establishment in the tank for this, you're either not paying attention or willfully ignorant.

I.B. Fine wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

If you read this from Thom Hartman then maybe what the Republicans are doing makes sense in that their goal is to turn the United States further into an oligarchy.

https://hartmannreport.com/p/is-the-reason-some-wealthy-people

If you don't see both parties establishment in the tank for this, you're either not paying attention or willfully ignorant.

I don't see the Democratic Party going "whole hog" on the side of the wealthy.

In the last Congress the House passed the John Lewis Voting Right's Bill and the Senate, controlled by the Democratic Party, tried to pass it and failed because two of the 50 Senators they needed were bought off by the wealthy.  Meanwhile all 50 of the Republican Senators voted against it.  That is a significant difference in commitment.

Suddenly The Swill’s Quisling is nthe rested in the location of classified documents.

When the only US President n history who tried to nullify  the 2020 election to stay in office The Quisling was silent..

Trapper Gus wrote:

I.B. Fine wrote:
If you don't see both parties establishment in the tank for this, you're either not paying attention or willfully ignorant.

I don't see the Democratic Party going "whole hog" on the side of the wealthy.

In the last Congress the House passed the John Lewis Voting Right's Bill and the Senate, controlled by the Democratic Party, tried to pass it and failed because two of the 50 Senators they needed were bought off by the wealthy.  Meanwhile all 50 of the Republican Senators voted against it.  That is a significant difference in commitment.

I think this is key. And handful of Ds are as bad as ALL Rs... not the same as "bothsides"...

Show me the equivalent of Elizabeth Warren or Katie Porter on the right.

AvgMSUJoe wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

I don't see the Democratic Party going "whole hog" on the side of the wealthy.

In the last Congress the House passed the John Lewis Voting Right's Bill and the Senate, controlled by the Democratic Party, tried to pass it and failed because two of the 50 Senators they needed were bought off by the wealthy.  Meanwhile all 50 of the Republican Senators voted against it.  That is a significant difference in commitment.

I think this is key. And handful of Ds are as bad as ALL Rs... not the same as "bothsides"...

Show me the equivalent of Elizabeth Warren or Katie Porter on the right.

Fauxcohontis is your standard?!? God help us all.

TravelinMan wrote:

AvgMSUJoe wrote:
I think this is key. And handful of Ds are as bad as ALL Rs... not the same as "bothsides"...

Show me the equivalent of Elizabeth Warren or Katie Porter on the right.

Fauxcohontis is your standard?!? God help us all.

Care to try again with a non-trolling post.

Senator Warren is a super smart person regarding policies and a better politician than her detractors give her credit for being. The deal she got from Biden for her support before the convention was that she was allowed to propose possible staff candidates for various positions in the administration. The ones she proposed who were accepted have been enacting policy choices which further the progressive agenda in areas such as stronger anti-trust enforcement.

GRR Spartan wrote:Suddenly The Swill’s Quisling is nthe rested in the location of classified documents.

When the only US President n history who tried to nullify  the 2020 election to stay in office The Quisling was silent..

Somebody want to translate this? Seems like the rumblings of a drunk man. GRR must have a helluva headache this morning.

RQA wrote:

GRR Spartan wrote:Suddenly The Swill’s Quisling isn't interested in the location of classified documents.

When the only US President n history who tried to nullify  the 2020 election to stay in office The Quisling was silent..

Somebody want to translate this? Seems like the rumblings of a drunk man. GRR must have a helluva headache this morning.

So, a simple typo confuses you.

Trapper Gus wrote:

So, a simple typo confuses you.

Thanks for clarifying the first sentence, any clue as to the second?

TravelinMan wrote:

AvgMSUJoe wrote:
I think this is key. And handful of Ds are as bad as ALL Rs... not the same as "bothsides"...

Show me the equivalent of Elizabeth Warren or Katie Porter on the right.

Fauxcohontis is your standard?!? God help us all.

Exactly. Thanks for proving my point. Rs got nothing except regurgitating trump one liners.

GRR Spartan wrote:Suddenly The Swill’s Quisling isn't interested in the location of classified documents.

When the only US President in history who tried to nullify the 2020 election to stay in office, The Quisling was silent..

The second line, corrected for typos and punctation added, is all about how you have not denounced Trump & the Republicans for attempting to overthrow the Government of the United States.

It is unclear why you are confused by such simple errors, but you are.

The FBI went through every room, every drawer, every closet in Biden's house and found a few more (less than 10, maybe) documents with classified markings, and they didn't have to spend 2 years fighting with Biden to gain access.

Biden is such a piker compared to Trump. 40 years in government and all he has are probably less than 25 classified documents altogether. Trump stole that many in 2 hours.

Trapper Gus wrote:The FBI went through every room, every drawer, every closet in Biden's house and found a few more (less than 10, maybe) documents with classified markings, and they didn't have to spend 2 years fighting with Biden to gain access.

Biden is such a piker compared to Trump. 40 years in government and all he has are probably less than 25 classified documents altogether. Trump stole that many in 2 hours.

I think it's a good bet Trump still has documents somewhere and/or flushed some more down the toilet.

https://www.axios.com/2023/01/22/biden-more-classified-documents

Oh, there were 6 more documents, and the FBI was there because Biden invited them to search, didn't even from them to get a warrant and then raid the home. It's like he has nothing to hid.

Trapper Gus wrote:

GRR Spartan wrote:Suddenly The Swill’s Quisling isn't interested in the location of classified documents.

When the only US President in history who tried to nullify the 2020 election to stay in office, The Quisling was silent..

The second line, corrected for typos and punctation added, is all about how you have not denounced Trump & the Republicans for attempting to overthrow the Government of the United States.

It is unclear why you are confused by such simple errors, but you are.

So GRR is posting lies too. Understandable that you, as a fellow leftist liar, are able to figure them out.

For the record, I HAVE denounced the Jan 6 riot. The Jan 6 riot was not a Trump or Republican effort to overthrow the federal government.

RQA wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

The second line, corrected for typos and punctation added, is all about how you have not denounced Trump & the Republicans for attempting to overthrow the Government of the United States.

It is unclear why you are confused by such simple errors, but you are.

So GRR is posting lies too.   Understandable that you, as a fellow leftist liar, are able to figure them out.

For the record, I HAVE denounced the Jan 6 riot.   The Jan 6 riot was not a Trump or Republican effort to overthrow the federal government.  

Oh, please Herr RQA.

You don't seriously believe that.  

It clearly was exactly an effort by Donald Trump and a majority of the elected Republican's in the US House to subvert the results of the Presidential election, including a violent attack on the Capital by Trump's supporters' intent stopping the pro-forma counting of the electoral college votes.

No serious person would be denying that.

Your claim is why GRR doesn't take you seriously.

And now I have coffee all over my keyboard.

Trapper Gus wrote:

RQA wrote:

So GRR is posting lies too.   Understandable that you, as a fellow leftist liar, are able to figure them out.

For the record, I HAVE denounced the Jan 6 riot.   The Jan 6 riot was not a Trump or Republican effort to overthrow the federal government.  

Oh, please Herr RQA.

You don't seriously believe that.  

It clearly was exactly an effort by Donald Trump and a majority of the elected Republican's in the US House to subvert the results of the Presidential election, including a violent attack on the Capital by Trump's supporters' intent stopping the pro-forma counting of the electoral college votes.

No serious person would be denying that.

Your claim is why GRR doesn't take you seriously.

And now I have coffee all over my keyboard.

Lol he’s only denouncing the attempted overthrow of the government on the condition that trump or republicans cannot be linked to it. He’s dishonest to the core.

kingstonlake wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:



Oh, please Herr RQA.

You don't seriously believe that.  

It clearly was exactly an effort by Donald Trump and a majority of the elected Republican's in the US House to subvert the results of the Presidential election, including a violent attack on the Capital by Trump's supporters' intent stopping the pro-forma counting of the electoral college votes.

No serious person would be denying that.

Your claim is why GRR doesn't take you seriously.

And now I have coffee all over my keyboard.

Lol he’s only denouncing the attempted overthrow of the government on the condition that trump or republicans cannot be linked to it. He’s dishonest to the core.

How can he say that when, as they say in today's popular vernacular, the investigations have the "receipts" aka the emails and text messages from all the people inside of the attempted coup?

Trapper Gus wrote:

kingstonlake wrote:

Lol he’s only denouncing the attempted overthrow of the government on the condition that trump or republicans cannot be linked to it. He’s dishonest to the core.

How can he say that when, as they say in today's popular vernacular, the investigations have the "receipts" aka the emails and text messages from all the people inside of the attempted coup?

Because he’s dishonest to the core. He’s denouncing the “riot”. Not the trump administration’s or republicans role in it. He approves of that.

kingstonlake wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

How can he say that when, as they say in today's popular vernacular, the investigations have the "receipts" aka the emails and text messages from all the people inside of the attempted coup?

Because he’s dishonest to the core. He’s denouncing the “riot”. Not the trump administration’s or republicans role in it. He approves of that.

The riot was ordered and organized by Trump and his minions, Trump told the riot to capture and hang the Veep.  This is documented in conversations, emails, tweets & text messages.  How does anyone deny that?

Trapper Gus wrote: a majority of the elected Republican's in the US House to subvert the results of the Presidential election

My God ...

You can think what you want about the Jan 6 riot, but you are just literally making shit up.

Swill leftists, care to opine about Trappers comment? You are all quick to label me a liar. I guess TG gets a free pass?

RQA wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote: a majority of the elected Republican's in the US House to subvert the results of the Presidential election

My God ...

You can think what you want about the Jan 6 riot, but you are just literally making shit up.

Swill leftists, care to opine about Trappers comment? You are all quick to label me a liar. I guess TG gets a free pass?

Because you decided, as you so often do, to selectively quote a single phrase of Trapper's post, I would have to go back and reread the original to make an informed decision, and you aren't worth the effort.

RQA wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote: (It clearly was exactly an effort by Donald Trump and) a majority of the elected Republican's in the US House to subvert (the results of the Presidential election)

My God ...

You can think what you want about the Jan 6 riot, but you are just literally making shit up.  

Swill leftists, care to opine about Trappers comment?   You are all quick to label me a liar.   I guess TG gets a free pass?

You are sadly misinformed.

You can of course have your own opinions, but the facts are the facts.

In the House, a majority of Republicans voted to object to the results, but they were still soundly rejected, 303 to 121 for Arizona and 282 to 138 for Pennsylvania, with all Democrats in opposition. Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy was among the House Republicans to vote to reject the two states’ results.

https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/06/politics/2020-election-congress-electoral-college-vote-count/index.html

Just checking in to see if the FBI and DOJ are now good guys?

Trapper Gus wrote:The FBI went through every room, every drawer, every closet in Biden's house and found a few more (less than 10, maybe) documents with classified markings, and they didn't have to spend 2 years fighting with Biden to gain access.

Biden is such a piker compared to Trump. 40 years in government and all he has are probably less than 25 classified documents altogether. Trump stole that many in 2 hours.

The only problem is that the target number is supposed to be zero.

TravelinMan wrote:

AvgMSUJoe wrote:
I think this is key. And handful of Ds are as bad as ALL Rs... not the same as "bothsides"...

Show me the equivalent of Elizabeth Warren or Katie Porter on the right.

Fauxcohontis is your standard?!? God help us all.

Posts like this will always undermine your attempts to stake the nonpartisan, both-sides-are-bad ground.