Racist conspiracy theory.... true?

The government pressured social media companies to ban people for discussing this two years ago. Now it's a "most likely" probability? Amazing.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/covid-origin-china-lab-leak

1 - Very odd thread title - come on man, you are not Herr RQA

2 - Paywall - but you know that /s

3 - DOE states very low confidence that it was lab origination in the report.

4 - Link from "rational" news site with lots of refuting of DOE's position.  -  DailyKos Response

5 - One of several Twitter explanations pointing to holes that you could float an aircraft carrier through in the DOE report.

[tw]1629938451628843010[/tw]

Robert J Sakimano wrote:I'm not quite ready to trust the mainstream media and the government..

Quite the conundrum you're in Bob.

MSM says it is not of lab origin.
Government now says it is of lab origin.

Trapper Gus wrote:1 - Very odd thread title - come on man, you are not Herr RQA

2 - Paywall - but you know that /s

3 - DOE states very low confidence that it was lab origination in the report.

4 - Link from "rational" news site with lots of refuting of DOE's position.  -  DailyKos Response

5 - One of several Twitter explanations pointing to holes that you could float an aircraft carrier through in the DOE report.

[tw]1629938451628843010[/tw]

Oh well, if the DailyKos (???) and Twitter say it's false, then I guess the government is lying to us? Which, TBF, is a distinct possibility. But if so, why now? Why decry anti-China sentiments two years ago but now ramp up public sentiment against them? Odd...

https://www.reuters.com/world/chinas-top-diplomat-expects-new-agreements-with-russia-during-moscow-visit-2023-02-22/

TravelinMan wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:1 - Very odd thread title - come on man, you are not Herr RQA

2 - Paywall - but you know that /s

3 - DOE states very low confidence that it was lab origination in the report.

4 - Link from "rational" news site with lots of refuting of DOE's position.  -  DailyKos Response

5 - One of several Twitter explanations pointing to holes that you could float an aircraft carrier through in the DOE report.

[tw]1629938451628843010[/tw]

Oh well, if the DailyKos (???) and Twitter say it's false, then I guess the government is lying to us? Which, TBF, is a distinct possibility. But if so, why now? Why decry anti-China sentiments two years ago but now ramp up public sentiment against them? Odd...

https://www.reuters.com/world/chinas-top-diplomat-expects-new-agreements-with-russia-during-moscow-visit-2023-02-22/

Just putting the facts on the board. tWSJ, a Murdock run right wing rag, trots out a DOE report which basically says they haven't taken the "lab theory" completely off the table though they don't believe it is likely at all, and all the media lemmings, and I am talking about tNYT, pony up.

People who care point out, on Twitter, what the DOE report really says, and then repeat the data which debunks the "lab theory".

Now this is tied to China & Russia taking another step back to their 1960's relationship?

The cold war never left us, it just was slumbering for a few decades.

Trapper Gus wrote:

TravelinMan wrote:

Oh well, if the DailyKos (???) and Twitter say it's false, then I guess the government is lying to us? Which, TBF, is a distinct possibility. But if so, why now? Why decry anti-China sentiments two years ago but now ramp up public sentiment against them? Odd...

https://www.reuters.com/world/chinas-top-diplomat-expects-new-agreements-with-russia-during-moscow-visit-2023-02-22/

Just putting the facts on the board. tWSJ, a Murdock run right wing rag, trots out a DOE report which basically says they haven't taken the "lab theory" completely off the table though they don't believe it is likely at all, and all the media lemmings, and I am talking about tNYT, pony up.

People who care point out, on Twitter, what the DOE report really says, and then repeat the data which debunks the "lab theory".

Now this is tied to China & Russia taking another step back to their 1960's relationship?

The cold war never left us, it just was slumbering for a few decades.

Was the government lying to us then or are they lying to us now? That's really what it boils down to.

TravelinMan wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

Just putting the facts on the board.  tWSJ, a Murdock run right wing rag, trots out a DOE report which basically says they haven't taken the "lab theory" completely off the table though they don't believe it is likely at all, and all the media lemmings, and I am talking about tNYT, pony up.

People who care point out, on Twitter, what the DOE report really says, and then repeat the data which debunks the "lab theory".

Now this is tied to China & Russia taking another step back to their 1960's relationship?

The cold war never left us, it just was slumbering for a few decades.

Was the government lying to us then or are they lying to us now?  That's really what it boils down to.

Neither.  A Mu question.

There is a long TG type explanation which people on this board cringe when I do this so consider there are 4 paragraphs detailing why the government isn't lying.

The short answer is tWSJ is lying.

edit - btw - IMO you should change the title of your thread so something that makes sense.

Trapper Gus wrote:

TravelinMan wrote:

Was the government lying to us then or are they lying to us now?  That's really what it boils down to.

Neither.  A Mu question.

There is a long TG type explanation which people on this board cringe when I do this so consider there are 4 paragraphs detailing why the government isn't lying.

The short answer is tWSJ is lying.

edit - btw - IMO you should change the title of your thread so something that makes sense.

Is NPR lying then, as well?

https://www.npr.org/2023/02/27/1159630271/energy-department-assessment-china-lab-leak-was-most-likely-the-origin-of-covid-

TravelinMan wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

Neither.  A Mu question.

There is a long TG type explanation which people on this board cringe when I do this so consider there are 4 paragraphs detailing why the government isn't lying.

The short answer is tWSJ is lying.

edit - btw - IMO you should change the title of your thread so something that makes sense.

Is NPR lying then, as well?

https://www.npr.org/2023/02/27/1159630271/energy-department-assessment-china-lab-leak-was-most-likely-the-origin-of-covid-

Okay - a brief TG'ism - One media outlet, tWSJ, reports something. All the Media lemmings then report that the one media outlet is reporting this.  An amplifier but not independent reporting.

NPR wrote:NPR's Leila Fadel talks to Michael Gordon of The Wall Street Journal about a classified report indicating the Energy Department believes the COVID pandemic was likely caused by a lab leak in China.

I have "low confidence" that people will read the report and understand what it's saying prior to making outrageous statements.

Trapper Gus wrote:

TravelinMan wrote:

Is NPR lying then, as well?

https://www.npr.org/2023/02/27/1159630271/energy-department-assessment-china-lab-leak-was-most-likely-the-origin-of-covid-

Okay - a brief TG'ism - One media outlet, tWSJ, reports something. All the Media lemmings then report that the one media outlet is reporting this.  An amplifier but not independent reporting.

NPR wrote:NPR's Leila Fadel talks to Michael Gordon of The Wall Street Journal about a classified report indicating the Energy Department believes the COVID pandemic was likely caused by a lab leak in China.

I actually thought the NPR clip was really good. Explained the whole thing quite clearly.

I still think something's fishy here.

AvgMSUJoe wrote:I have "low confidence" that people will read the report and understand what it's saying prior to making outrageous statements.

It's almost like tWSJ has a political agenda. /s

Trapper Gus wrote:

AvgMSUJoe wrote:I have "low confidence" that people will read the report and understand what it's saying prior to making outrageous statements.

It's almost like tWSJ has a political agenda. /s

For reporting what the DOE released?

Regardless, can you imagine if the DOE released such a report two years ago?!? It would be chaos.

TravelinMan wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

Okay - a brief TG'ism - One media outlet, tWSJ, reports something. All the Media lemmings then report that the one media outlet is reporting this.  An amplifier but not independent reporting.

I actually thought the NPR clip was really good.  Explained the whole thing quite clearly.

I still think something's fishy here.

Let me just comment that all those intelligence agencies having "scientists" is a pretty weak argument.  I in fact, as an engineer, am a professional "scientist" but I would hesitate to take my opinion on covid-19's origan as a serious analysis, though, IMO, I am capable of applying logical "root cause" analysis to whatever data there is.

Therefore, when I want expert opinion on this I go to the guy I am quoting, who is a professions scientist in this field:

DEREK LOWE wrote:It's a quiet late summer weekend - why don't we stir things up a bit, eh? I last wrote about the controversy over the origins of the SARS-CoV-2 pandemic here, after a preprint came out with a lot of hard evidence for the "Wuhan market" hypothesis (and conversely, no real evidence for the "lab leak" hypothesis). That paper was recently published here at Science as two papers, and no matter which side of that question a person takes, you'll have to deal with the data and the conclusions it reaches. My own opinion is that it makes a strong case for the market origin, and that alternative explanations are going to have to show why those lines of evidence don't say what they're appearing to say.

https://www.science.org/content/blog-post/origins-pandemic---under-rug

I recommend anyone with questions about the origin of covid read his blog article which lays out the pros on cons of the evidence and provide links to other articles detailing some of the known and unknown data.

TravelinMan wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

It's almost like tWSJ has a political agenda. /s

For reporting what the DOE released?

Regardless, can you imagine if the DOE released such a report two years ago?!? It would be chaos.

The NPR report said that all the other agencies asked to evaluate this reported out before this, why is this, one agency out of several, such a big deal, except that the Media echo chamber, feeding off tWSJ bullshit, is amplifying it?

President Biden did issue a statement on this 18 months ago: President Biden's Statement on investigation of covid origin

Are we really doing this again or are you just looking for validation for being and anti-China racist POS?

Motown Spartan wrote:Are we really doing this again or are you just looking for validation for being and anti-China racist POS?

Going down that rabbit hole, can anyone explain how introducing covid to the world is in China's interest?

Arguably it helped elect Biden and a Democratic Congress which was not in China's interest.

Motown Spartan wrote:Are we really doing this again or are you just looking for validation for being and anti-China racist POS?

There it is!

What’s the frequency of White Man whines?

TravelinMan wrote:

Motown Spartan wrote:Are we really doing this again or are you just looking for validation for being and anti-China racist POS?

There it is!

Come on man - you were fishing for this response with your post title, which is total BS.

Trapper Gus wrote:

Motown Spartan wrote:Are we really doing this again or are you just looking for validation for being and anti-China racist POS?

Going down that rabbit hole, can anyone explain how introducing covid to the world is in China's interest?

Arguably it helped elect Biden and a Democratic Congress which was not in China's interest.

Who's to say it was on purpose?  Could have been an accident. You know both China and the US work on some nasty stuff for nefarious reasons.

How would it help China?  I say this wholly theoretically, and am not espousing any of these views.  But remember, they're playing a long game that American's typically don't.  So wrecking the economy, sowing seeds of discontent, creating division, and generally causing fear and chaos.... all in China's interests at some point.

Trapper Gus wrote:

TravelinMan wrote:

There it is!

Come on man - you were fishing for this response with your post title, which is total BS.

That's the two year old response. Now with the DOE report.... that response becomes a bit more juvenile and partisan.

TravelinMan wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

Come on man - you were fishing for this response with your post title, which is total BS.

That's the two year old response.  Now with the DOE report.... that response becomes a bit more juvenile and partisan.

It was the correct response two years ago, too.

Either you have been blinded by all your years of Wells posting or you are being disingenuous, your choice.

edit - That you are calling an expert in the field "partisan" is odd.

I wonder how TM felt about Muslims after 9/11.

And even if China (the government) did it on purpose, would you treat Chinese people any different?

TravelinMan wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

Come on man - you were fishing for this response with your post title, which is total BS.

That's the two year old response. Now with the DOE report.... that response becomes a bit more juvenile and partisan.

Being racist is disgusting. I’ll take juvenile and partisan over racist any day, especially when there are Republicans.

TravelinMan wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

Going down that rabbit hole, can anyone explain how introducing covid to the world is in China's interest?

Arguably it helped elect Biden and a Democratic Congress which was not in China's interest.

Who's to say it was on purpose?  Could have been an accident. You know both China and the US work on some nasty stuff for nefarious reasons.

How would it help China?  I say this wholly theoretically, and am not espousing any of these views.  But remember, they're playing a long game that American's typically don't.  So wrecking the economy, sowing seeds of discontent, creating division, and generally causing fear and chaos.... all in China's interests at some point.

Americans don’t typically lay the long game? What about the elite new world order shadow government run by George Soros?

TravelinMan wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

Going down that rabbit hole, can anyone explain how introducing covid to the world is in China's interest?

Arguably it helped elect Biden and a Democratic Congress which was not in China's interest.

Who's to say it was on purpose?  Could have been an accident. You know both China and the US work on some nasty stuff for nefarious reasons.

How would it help China?  I say this wholly theoretically, and am not espousing any of these views.  But remember, they're playing a long game that American's typically don't.  So wrecking the economy, sowing seeds of discontent, creating division, and generally causing fear and chaos.... all in China's interests at some point.

The study of potential diseases in order to develop cures is hardly nefarious.

Also, with Biden in charge, if it were China's intention to upset the US or global economy, they did a piss poor job of it. GPD up; employment up; manufacturing being on shored; US global political standing way up.

Motown Spartan wrote:I wonder how TM felt about Muslims after 9/11.

And even if China (the government) did it on purpose, would you treat Chinese people any different?

I'm gonna be honest, I don't deal with a lot of Chinese people. There's the guy who owns the Chinese restaurant in town. But he and I are on the outs since I learned that he has a separate menu for white people. All of the good stuff is on the "other" menu. Bastard!

TravelinMan wrote:

Motown Spartan wrote:I wonder how TM felt about Muslims after 9/11.

And even if China (the government) did it on purpose, would you treat Chinese people any different?

I'm gonna be honest, I don't deal with a lot of Chinese people.  There's the guy who owns the Chinese restaurant in town.  But he and I are on the outs since I learned that he has a separate menu for white people.  All of the good stuff is on the "other" menu.  Bastard!

Having eaten at various restaurants in China, I can assure you that you don't have the palate for authentic Chinese dishes.  Eating a lobster while it was still alive is one of the many Chinese delicacies I passed on.

edit - he is giving the mass market what it wants.

Motown Spartan wrote:Are we really doing this again or are you just looking for validation for being and anti-China racist POS?

So being anti-China now means one is racist?

It really is hard to keep up ....

It’s not that hard to keep up actually, assuming you’re not just kinda racist

RQA wrote:

Motown Spartan wrote:Are we really doing this again or are you just looking for validation for being and anti-China racist POS?

So being anti-China now means one is racist?

It really is hard to keep up ....

It's not that hard, just do the opposite of the Republicans and you won't be racist.

This is way too long to read, but I think the author was channeling Bob, so am providing the link anyway.

https://m.dailykos.com/stories/2023/2/27/2154976/-Why-we-simply-can-t-have-a-better-country

RQA wrote:

Motown Spartan wrote:Are we really doing this again or are you just looking for validation for being and anti-China racist POS?

So being anti-China now means one is racist?

It really is hard to keep up ....

Typical Herr RQA, conflating "anti-China" & "racist". Riffing off the totally BS thread title.

I’m just going to put this out there, but yeah I kinda think that saying you’re “anti China” is indeed kinda racist. I mean what does that even mean? Your anti totalitarian government? Fine, say that. You’re anti communist? Fine, say that. But that’s not what he said, he said “anti China” which makes no sense unless you’re just anti the 1 billion people that live there for no reason other than they’re chinese… which yeah is pretty racist.

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:I’m just going to put this out there, but yeah I kinda think that saying you’re “anti China” is indeed kinda racist. I mean what does that even mean? Your anti totalitarian government? Fine, say that. You’re anti communist? Fine, say that. But that’s not what he said, he said “anti China” which makes no sense unless you’re just anti the 1 billion people that live there for no reason other than they’re chinese… which yeah is pretty racist.

Yours is a defendable interpretation.

"anti-China" is shorthand for something. and that something could be anti-chinese people.

Seeing "anti-China" against the actions of China's government is also defendable.