Game of Thrones Season 7 - WAR IS COMING

I've declared this the worst season of the series. Facts.

Ok there is one thing that has really been bothering me and I cant believe it hasnt been covered to death but maybe I missed it.  But I dont giz out reading blogs about tv shows like you dorks.
But wasnt everyone expecting Jamie and Bronn to pop up to the surface where they dove in the water to be immediately captured?  Michael Phelps couldnt make it 100 yards underwater in a speedo yet they apparantly swam under water for a mile in armor and popped up 30 minutes later after the battle was completely over?

Please merge with Thrones thread.

Poor Baelish

Gonna have to rewatch this like 3x. Happy Carcetti bit it.

Oh shit

So littlefinger died and we finally confirm something we knew for weeks now? yawn

Well, if the show was getting slow they sure fixed that with this episode. Some classic GoT action.

Tim Wakefield wrote:So littlefinger died and we finally confirm something we knew for weeks now? yawn

Littlefinger getting played like that was epic, and nobody was yawning when the fucking wall fell in minutes.

WhiteBoyHatcher wrote:Please merge with Thrones thread.

Do your own fuckin mod work asshole.

Just seemed a little predictable

Tim Wakefield wrote:Just seemed a little predictable

Agreed. There wasn't anything about it that coming in I wasn't already pretty sure was going to happen in one way or the other.

One thing though- so if they didn't bring the dragons north, get one killed, etc... would the army ever have been able to get through the wall? If that's the case then Tyrion was right when he told her to just stay at dragonstone and let them die last week.

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:

Tim Wakefield wrote:Just seemed a little predictable

Agreed. There wasn't anything about it that coming in I wasn't already pretty sure was going to happen in one way or the other.

One thing though- so if they didn't bring the dragons north, get one killed, etc... would the army ever have been able to get through the wall? If that's the case then Tyrion was right when he told her to just stay at dragonstone and let them die last week.

Probably not, and now we know Mexico's strategy for breaching walls...get an ice dragon thing.

Turtleneck wrote:

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:

Agreed. There wasn't anything about it that coming in I wasn't already pretty sure was going to happen in one way or the other.

One thing though- so if they didn't bring the dragons north, get one killed, etc... would the army ever have been able to get through the wall? If that's the case then Tyrion was right when he told her to just stay at dragonstone and let them die last week.

Probably not, and now we know Mexico's strategy for breaching walls...get an ice dragon thing.

At some point someone prolly should have asked that question. "Isn't this why we have a gigantic wall? Does that plan not work anymore?"

I am sure there will be an article posted at InfoWars or Breitbart tomorrow morning about Mexico's underground ice dragon breeding program.

(in before travis bitches about time machines)

Nordic wrote:(in before travis bitches about time machines)

Wbh started a different thread like a dipshit and refuses to merge it. In there you can see me agree with others that everything was fairly predictable. Which is fine. I guess. If you like that sorta thing.

Due process in Winterfell is a fucking joke.

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:

Tim Wakefield wrote:Just seemed a little predictable

Agreed. There wasn't anything about it that coming in I wasn't already pretty sure was going to happen in one way or the other.

One thing though- so if they didn't bring the dragons north, get one killed, etc... would the army ever have been able to get through the wall? If that's the case then Tyrion was right when he told her to just stay at dragonstone and let them die last week.

After thinking about this, the whining is getting annoying without people telling us what kind of ending they want.

All of what happened this season, and especially last night, was unnecessary if you fancy one of these endings: white walkers storm Westeros and everybody dies a horrible death because they were too selfish and divided to deal with the larger threat right in front of their face, or the white walkers are defeated but not before the near total destruction of Westeros and whoever sits on the iron throne at the end presides over a pile of ashes. If that is how the show ends, then all of this season was indeed terrible. However, I have a sense that if the show ends with no justice and all of the characters and storylines that people have obsessed over for almost a decade being rendered useless by the complete or near complete destruction of Westeros, people will be far more upset than they are now.

Now, what might have made this season necessary is this ending: the story ends by telling you there is justice in the world and the world can be made a better place by better people; it ends with the good people prevailing over evil. If that is where the story is going, then the show had to break from being unpredictable at some point and become a bit more ordinary. That does not mean it will not return to being unpredictable when good versus evil are in the final moments of their war with each other.

Mods, please merge.

Death Roe wrote:Mods, please merge.

Thanks, Nigel.

Other Teams Pursuing That wrote:I've declared this the worst season of the series. Facts.

I agree, but that is also saying quite a bit about how good it is. This season's flaws (and there are a shit ton of them) didn't take away from how good it has been overall. Still the GOAT IMO.

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:

Tim Wakefield wrote:Just seemed a little predictable

Agreed. There wasn't anything about it that coming in I wasn't already pretty sure was going to happen in one way or the other.

One thing though- so if they didn't bring the dragons north, get one killed, etc... would the army ever have been able to get through the wall? If that's the case then Tyrion was right when he told her to just stay at dragonstone and let them die last week.

You were pretty sure that it was all going to happen in one way or another? That's pretty broad. I mean for anyone watching the show, there's only a couple of ways that any of it could have gone. I think you could say that about 99% of all TV shows, movies, etc.

I hate that I just did your dirty work wbh. Fuck you.

As far as broad, not really. Three main plot lines going in-
Cersei and the walkers thing- she's probably going to stab the group in the back. Maybe she pretends to buy it, maybe she doesn't, but at the end of the day we all knew she wasn't just going to go along with it.

Littlefinger- kinda knew he was fucked. The other option is that some starks get at each other's throats maybe killing each other. That didn't seem likely. How exactly it was going to happen was a question, but his fucked status wasn't really to me.

The zombies and the wall- well they're gonna have to get through that thing somehow. They just got a big thing that breaths fire. Hmmmmm. It was really more of a question of last night or the first episode of next season.

So really it's not all that broad. Compare it to past seasons if you want- Cersei needs to stop the sparrows. Okay, yeah, you know something is going to happen there. But was it delivered on a platter going in that she was going to blow up the sept and tommen would off himself it was only a question of if he'd do it by jumping out a window or stabbing himself? No. Yeah, you might have sort of known what direction it was going but now I think it's a little more handed to you ahead of time. Which, like I've been saying but no one seems to be listening, is fine since I understand that there is going to be a drop off in quality when they no longer are working with 1000 page novels of information to guide them.

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:I hate that I just did your dirty work wbh. Fuck you.

As far as broad, not really. Three main plot lines going in-
Cersei and the walkers thing- she's probably going to stab the group in the back. Maybe she pretends to buy it, maybe she doesn't, but at the end of the day we all knew she wasn't just going to go along with it.

Littlefinger- kinda knew he was fucked. The other option is that some starks get at each other's throats maybe killing each other. That didn't seem likely. How exactly it was going to happen was a question, but his fucked status wasn't really to me.

The zombies and the wall- well they're gonna have to get through that thing somehow. They just got a big thing that breaths fire. Hmmmmm. It was really more of a question of last night or the first episode of next season.

So really it's not all that broad. Compare it to past seasons if you want- Cersei needs to stop the sparrows. Okay, yeah, you know something is going to happen there. But was it delivered on a platter going in that she was going to blow up the sept and tommen would off himself it was only a question of if he'd do it by jumping out a window or stabbing himself? No. Yeah, you might have sort of known what direction it was going but now I think it's a little more handed to you ahead of time. Which, like I've been saying but no one seems to be listening, is fine since I understand that there is going to be a drop off in quality when they no longer are working with 1000 page novels of information to guide them.

But isn't Martin telling them the main plotlines/events?  Do you think that when he gets around to this part of the book that he's going to have it going in a different direction?  Is he going to have Sansa put Arya in jail and Littlefinger lives on?  Are the white walkers not going to breach the wall?

Do you really see the major plotlines throughout the show as being so unpredictable?  Maybe because you read the books, there was more suspense in reading the books first (during the seasons covered by the books, of course)? I'm not saying that it was unpredictable last night.  I'm saying that of course, it's predictable to one extent or another, because that's unavoidable as you get toward the end of nearly any TV show, movie, or even a "plotline" of real life.  Situations are created, pieces are moved on the board, and everything gets more narrow and comes to a head, with only a couple of ways to go (often with one way being MUCH more likely than others).

I think things will be in torally different positions. It won't be a matter of putting little finger in jail, it'll be a matter of him not being there at all. They said before last season that they had a general outline. What exactly that means, who knows.

I don't know man, whatever. I don't necessarily feel like getting as much into the weeds on this as you do. Alls im saying is that I don't think it's as good anymore, and that's because they don't have endless information to go on. And that's acceptable, understandable really. I still like it. Fine. Moving on.

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:I think things will be in torally different positions. It won't be a matter of putting little finger in jail, it'll be a matter of him not being there at all. They said before last season that they had a general outline. What exactly that means, who knows.

I don't know man, whatever. I don't necessarily feel like getting as much into the weeds on this as you do. Alls im saying is that I don't think it's as good anymore, and that's because they don't have endless information to go on. And that's acceptable, understandable really. I still like it. Fine. Moving on.

That is the beauty of the show right now. You really have to think about how this ends to process what was admittedly a more ordinary season than seasons past.

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:I think things will be in torally different positions. It won't be a matter of putting little finger in jail, it'll be a matter of him not being there at all. They said before last season that they had a general outline. What exactly that means, who knows.

I don't know man, whatever. I don't necessarily feel like getting as much into the weeds on this as you do. Alls im saying is that I don't think it's as good anymore, and that's because they don't have endless information to go on. And that's acceptable, understandable really. I still like it. Fine. Moving on.

Not trying to get into the weeds at all. If you don't like the season, that's fine. I just feel that the predictability complaint is either due to unrealistic expectations and/or trying too hard to find fault, because when you're 90% of the way to the end of anything in fiction or in life, the options become very narrow.

MiamiSpartan wrote:

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:I think things will be in torally different positions. It won't be a matter of putting little finger in jail, it'll be a matter of him not being there at all. They said before last season that they had a general outline. What exactly that means, who knows.

I don't know man, whatever. I don't necessarily feel like getting as much into the weeds on this as you do. Alls im saying is that I don't think it's as good anymore, and that's because they don't have endless information to go on. And that's acceptable, understandable really. I still like it. Fine. Moving on.

Not trying to get into the weeds at all. If you don't like the season, that's fine. I just feel that the predictability complaint is either due to unrealistic expectations and/or trying too hard to find fault, because when you're 90% of the way to the end of anything in fiction or in life, the options become very narrow.

But that's when you're getting into story telling. For instance- did they need to show the dead dragon becoming a zombie dragon last week? That's a two parter- 1) would it have been better to show it this week and 2) did they need to show it at all? I'd argue that not showing that would have left some suspense for the end this week, and it's not like we wouldn't have been able to figure out what happened when we see him riding a dead dragon.

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:

MiamiSpartan wrote:
Not trying to get into the weeds at all.  If you don't like the season, that's fine.  I just feel that the predictability complaint is either due to unrealistic expectations and/or trying too hard to find fault, because when you're 90% of the way to the end of anything in fiction or in life, the options become very narrow.

But that's when you're getting into story telling. For instance- did they need to show the dead dragon becoming a zombie dragon last week? That's a two parter- 1) would it have been better to show it this week and 2) did they need to show it at all? I'd argue that not showing that would have left some suspense for the end this week, and it's not like we wouldn't have been able to figure out what happened when we see him riding a dead dragon.

But this is a style of storytelling that they've been doing since the very beginning.  This is why it feels like you're just looking for things to complain about.  Having a cliffhanger/set up for the next episode is not bad storytelling, and it's something that they do almost every episode.  They try to end episodes with big reveals or OMG moments.  Most TV shows do this, because you have to built interest/hype/curiosity for the next episode.  Part marketing, part storytelling.  Always present in this series. You prefer the suspense/reveal within the episode, but they love doing it as a lead in to the next episode.

MiamiSpartan wrote:

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:

But that's when you're getting into story telling. For instance- did they need to show the dead dragon becoming a zombie dragon last week? That's a two parter- 1) would it have been better to show it this week and 2) did they need to show it at all? I'd argue that not showing that would have left some suspense for the end this week, and it's not like we wouldn't have been able to figure out what happened when we see him riding a dead dragon.

But this is a style of storytelling that they've been doing since the very beginning.  This is why it feels like you're just looking for things to complain about.  Having a cliffhanger/set up for the next episode is not bad storytelling, and it's something that they do almost every episode.  They try to end episodes with big reveals or OMG moments.  Most TV shows do this, because you have to built interest/hype/curiosity for the next episode.  Part marketing, part storytelling.  Always present in this series. You prefer the suspense/reveal within the episode, but they love doing it as a lead in to the next episode.

Wait wait wait.... stop right there. I already used this example, but what you're saying is that they would do things like show Cersei messing with some wildfire in last years second to last episode just to remind you that there is wildfire. That's just not true what you said. It just isn't.

Look dude, you said earlier that you weren't a fan boy... but you're being a fan boy. It's like you just don't want to admit that maybe it just isn't as great without books. Which, for really the last time, is fine and understandable.

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:Look dude, you said earlier that you weren't a fan boy... but you're being a fan boy. It's like you just don't want to admit that maybe it just isn't as great without books. Which, for really the last time, is fine and understandable.

Then stop bitching.

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:

MiamiSpartan wrote:
But this is a style of storytelling that they've been doing since the very beginning.  This is why it feels like you're just looking for things to complain about.  Having a cliffhanger/set up for the next episode is not bad storytelling, and it's something that they do almost every episode.  They try to end episodes with big reveals or OMG moments.  Most TV shows do this, because you have to built interest/hype/curiosity for the next episode.  Part marketing, part storytelling.  Always present in this series. You prefer the suspense/reveal within the episode, but they love doing it as a lead in to the next episode.

Wait wait wait.... stop right there. I already used this example, but what you're saying is that they would do things like show Cersei messing with some wildfire in last years second to last episode just to remind you that there is wildfire. That's just not true what you said. It just isn't.

Jesus, dude, I never said that every dramatic scene had a prelude in the previous episode. I said that nearly every episode ends with a cliffhanger or set up to the next episode. Fine, it would often be for a few episodes down the road, because they would often leave story lines for a couple of episodes before coming back to them. But it's the same concept. Are you really disagreeing that they like to do these reveals at the end of episodes for effect to set up the next episodes?

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:Look dude, you said earlier that you weren't a fan boy... but you're being a fan boy. It's like you just don't want to admit that maybe it just isn't as great without books. Which, for really the last time, is fine and understandable.

Maybe when you're overriding point is that the show isn't as good without the books to rely on, you shouldn't keep using an example from after the books to illustrate your point about the past greatness of the show?

You seem bothered that someone is disagreeing with you about the show. I didn't agree that the predictability was a problem, that's it. So you take that and call me a fanboy and make assumptions about how I feel about the show at different points in the series. I never said that the show was better, worse, or the same with the books than without. Largely because other than last season, I really don't know which the books didn't cover. When did they end, season 3? 4? 5? I really liked last season because Hodor, Battle of the Bastards, and the Sept were three amazing scenes, as good as any in the entire show. Probably my favorite season since the first couple.

MiamiSpartan wrote:

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:


Wait wait wait.... stop right there. I already used this example, but what you're saying is that they would do things like show Cersei messing with some wildfire in last years second to last episode just to remind you that there is wildfire. That's just not true what you said. It just isn't.

Jesus, dude, I never said that every dramatic scene had a prelude in the previous episode. I said that nearly every episode ends with a cliffhanger or set up to the next episode. Fine, it would often be for a few episodes down the road, because they would often leave story lines for a couple of episodes before coming back to them. But it's the same concept. Are you really disagreeing that they like to do these reveals at the end of episodes for effect to set up the next episodes?

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:Look dude, you said earlier that you weren't a fan boy... but you're being a fan boy. It's like you just don't want to admit that maybe it just isn't as great without books. Which, for really the last time, is fine and understandable.

Maybe when you're overriding point is that the show isn't as good without the books to rely on, you shouldn't keep using an example from after the books to illustrate your point about the past greatness of the show?

You seem bothered that someone is disagreeing with you about the show. I didn't agree that the predictability was a problem, that's it. So you take that and call me a fanboy and make assumptions about how I feel about the show at different points in the series. I never said that the show was better, worse, or the same with the books than without. Largely because other than last season, I really don't know which the books didn't cover. When did they end, season 3? 4? 5? I really liked last season because Hodor, Battle of the Bastards, and the Sept were three amazing scenes, as good as any in the entire show. Probably my favorite season since the first couple.

I didn't use an example from the books....

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:

MiamiSpartan wrote:
Not trying to get into the weeds at all. If you don't like the season, that's fine. I just feel that the predictability complaint is either due to unrealistic expectations and/or trying too hard to find fault, because when you're 90% of the way to the end of anything in fiction or in life, the options become very narrow.

But that's when you're getting into story telling. For instance- did they need to show the dead dragon becoming a zombie dragon last week? That's a two parter- 1) would it have been better to show it this week and 2) did they need to show it at all? I'd argue that not showing that would have left some suspense for the end this week, and it's not like we wouldn't have been able to figure out what happened when we see him riding a dead dragon.

people were bitching about them having chains to pull the dragon out....and somehow not showing any of that with just him riding a dragon in the next episode would be good??

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:

MiamiSpartan wrote:
Jesus, dude, I never said that every dramatic scene had a prelude in the previous episode. I said that nearly every episode ends with a cliffhanger or set up to the next episode. Fine, it would often be for a few episodes down the road, because they would often leave story lines for a couple of episodes before coming back to them. But it's the same concept. Are you really disagreeing that they like to do these reveals at the end of episodes for effect to set up the next episodes?


Maybe when you're overriding point is that the show isn't as good without the books to rely on, you shouldn't keep using an example from after the books to illustrate your point about the past greatness of the show?

You seem bothered that someone is disagreeing with you about the show. I didn't agree that the predictability was a problem, that's it. So you take that and call me a fanboy and make assumptions about how I feel about the show at different points in the series. I never said that the show was better, worse, or the same with the books than without. Largely because other than last season, I really don't know which the books didn't cover. When did they end, season 3? 4? 5? I really liked last season because Hodor, Battle of the Bastards, and the Sept were three amazing scenes, as good as any in the entire show. Probably my favorite season since the first couple.

I didn't use an example from the books....

I said you used an example from after the books. After. As in not from the period covered by the books, but post-books. The period which you complain about. After the books.

MiamiSpartan wrote:

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:

I didn't use an example from the books....

I said you used an example from after the books. After. As in not from the period covered by the books, but post-books. The period which you complain about. After the books.

I see. That was the first to come to mind. I'm sure you can come up with more if you try hard.

And CB- well it didn't have to crash in water either. Thats a good point, another thing that could have been easily avoided.

https://twitter.com/Pat_Egan/status/902013562712973314

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:

And CB- well it didn't have to crash in water either. Thats a good point, another thing that could have been easily avoided.

Then you've got people bitching that they didn't burn it with another dragon if it crashes onto land. Easy to find flaws if you're looking