Fusion Baby!! No more oil wars!!!

Motown Spartan wrote:Republicans are going to hate this.

AP wrote:Riccardo Betti, a professor at the University of Rochester and expert in laser fusion, said an announcement that net energy had been gained in a fusion reaction would be significant. But he said there’s a long road ahead before the result generates sustainable electricity.

The net energy gain achievement applied to the fusion reaction itself, not the total amount of power it took to operate the lasers and run the project. For fusion to be viable, it will need to produce significantly more power and for longer.

Motown Spartan wrote:NO MORE OIL TRAPPER!!!!

And yes, it's not going to happen tomorrow, but now that they have accomplished it, they can solve for all of those other variables.

NigelUno wrote:Is this like the Tony Stark thing in Iron Man, or the Bruce Wayne thing in the Dark Knight Rises?

NigelUno wrote:Is this like the Tony Stark thing in Iron Man, or the Bruce Wayne thing in the Dark Knight Rises?

Trapper Gus wrote:

NigelUno wrote:Is this like the Tony Stark thing in Iron Man, or the Bruce Wayne thing in the Dark Knight Rises?

More like Bruce Wayne, only with lower power gain, well negative if the power for the lasers is taken into account.

Motown Spartan wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

More like Bruce Wayne, only with lower power gain, well negative if the power for the lasers is taken into account.

You're making wet blankets seem cozy.

Trapper Gus wrote:

Motown Spartan wrote:

You're making wet blankets seem cozy.

I was as enthusiastic about Cold Fusion, until I did the engineering and realized it has a long development process, just like this Hot Fusion experiment, until it can be a useful technology.

Similarly, I wasn't a big cheerleader for Renewable Generation, until I saw the price per kW becoming lower that the price per kW for existing power plants.  There are still political roadblocks, but the economics of cheaper generation via renewables means that the generating companies are embracing it, which is a really big deal.

The "electric", lower greenhouse emission future is almost here!

Trapper Gus wrote:

Motown Spartan wrote:NO MORE OIL TRAPPER!!!!

And yes, it's not going to happen tomorrow, but now that they have accomplished it, they can solve for all of those other variables.

I applaud your enthusiasm.

However ... and you knew this was coming ...

Cold Fusion creates positive energy also, and yes, in the shadows that research has been ongoing. The problem is that the energy gain is not far enough above unity to create sustainable methods of self-supporting power generation.

Energy generation above unity, isn't enough. This is a nice step, but at these energy levels it doesn't look like a technology that can be used to make enough energy even to sustain itself, let along sustain power generation.

Renewables, right now, are a more practical way to reduce the use of fossil fuels.

Right now, all the homeowners on the board should be installing heat pump systems, with, or without a geo-thermal component, as the best way to move away from oil.

Motown Spartan wrote:

Trapper Gus wrote:

I was as enthusiastic about Cold Fusion, until I did the engineering and realized it has a long development process, just like this Hot Fusion experiment, until it can be a useful technology.

Similarly, I wasn't a big cheerleader for Renewable Generation, until I saw the price per kW becoming lower that the price per kW for existing power plants.  There are still political roadblocks, but the economics of cheaper generation via renewables means that the generating companies are embracing it, which is a really big deal.

The "electric", lower greenhouse emission future is almost here!

This is the proverbial "light bulb" moment for this though. This proves that the holy grail idea is possible. Now they need to repeat it and scale it up.

But on Dec. 5, during one run, something changed.

"Last week, for the first time, they designed this experiment so that the fusion fuel stayed hot enough, dense enough and round enough for long enough that it ignited," Marv Adams, deputy administrator at the NNSA, said during the conference. "And it produced more energy than the lasers had deposited."

More specifically, scientists at NIF kickstarted a fusion reaction using about 2 megajoules of energy to power the lasers and were able to get about 3 megajoules out. Based on the definition of ignition used by NIF, the benchmark has been passed during this one short pulse.

You might also see that energy gain in a fusion reaction is denoted by a variable, Q.

Like ignition, the Q value can refer to different things for different experiments. But here, it's referring to the energy input from the lasers versus the energy output from the capsule. If Q = 1, scientists say they have achieved "breakeven," where energy in equals energy out.

The Q value for this run, for context, was around 1.5.

In the grand scheme of things, the energy created with this Q value is only about enough to boil water in a kettle.

"The calculation of energy gain only considers the energy that hit the target, and not the [very large] energy consumption that goes into supporting the infrastructure," said Patrick Burr, a nuclear engineer at the University of New South Wales.

...

the ITER experiment, under construction in France, uses a tokamak and is expected to begin testing in the next decade. It has lofty goals, aiming to achieve a Q greater than 10 and to develop commercial fusion by 2050.

Any idea what's going on with the tax credit or rebates for the heat pump systems? I'm wanting to put in a heat pump and water heater heat pump but I'm holding off until the rebates or tax credits are announced.

Trapper Gus wrote:

Motown Spartan wrote:NO MORE OIL TRAPPER!!!!

And yes, it's not going to happen tomorrow, but now that they have accomplished it, they can solve for all of those other variables.

I applaud your enthusiasm.

However ... and you knew this was coming ...

Cold Fusion creates positive energy also, and yes, in the shadows that research has been ongoing. The problem is that the energy gain is not far enough above unity to create sustainable methods of self-supporting power generation.

Energy generation above unity, isn't enough. This is a nice step, but at these energy levels it doesn't look like a technology that can be used to make enough energy even to sustain itself, let along sustain power generation.

Renewables, right now, are a more practical way to reduce the use of fossil fuels.

Right now, all the homeowners on the board should be installing heat pump systems, with, or without a geo-thermal component, as the best way to move away from oil.

steveschneider wrote:Welcome to the swill all newly minted fusion experts.