Fuck it- statues

LooseGoose wrote:

DWags wrote:Statue was put up in 1948 to intimidate black veterans and those seeking equal rights.

[The statue] was designed to intimidate African Americans and to reassure white Americans in a moment of rising black power.

Americas shame:  why put a statue up to confederate soldiers in 1948 when we just caught hitler and three fourths of the soldiers in Maryland were union.

That's today's excuse?   OK..... Yesterday it was "crimes against the Constitution" and serving in the Confederate Army thus a traitor..... Strangely though you're answering a question regarding the Taney statue his name never appears in the HuffPost piece you link as justification.

Today the justification expands....as it will tomorrow again when more come down.    It's marvelous seeing people that would be apoplectic at a book burning seemingly being OK with this erasure/whitewashing of history.

Now its Fake History too?

LooseGoose wrote:

NigelUno wrote:

So, you weren't talking about the Washington Monument and the Jefferson Memorial being closed and/or demolished?

Just want to make sure.

And off you go swerving. Of course I talked about them. I didn't offer a wager on them as you said I did. Again, you think yourself clever when actually you're simply proving that you're dumb as a box of rocks.

I'm not swerving. I'm quoting what you said. You're trying to spin it now.

Do you think you're on some high moral ground by using the removal of the Taney statue? You know what he did, right? You know what he said, right?

And your argument is he wasn't a CSA Veteran? This is your line in the sand?

Are you kidding me with this?

This is pathetic.

LooseGoose wrote:

DWags wrote:

So, your position is that by taking them down we're eliminating that history?   No books computers documentaries archives.  That's really a foolish position.

Tell me about Taney.   What was his crime?

You love to talk about Washington and Jefferson's flaws.

Any comment on Taney?

Turtleneck wrote:

LooseGoose wrote:

So do you support removing the statues of the rapist Jefferson? The slave owner Washington? How about the battlefields do we strip those clean too? Or aren't those "hate statues"?

Were his victims wearing skirts? I guess not since you consider him rapist.

Join Nigel in stupid assery and be proud of it.

LOL, and still no one wants to tell me Taney's crime.

Shouldn't all statues and monuments to the racist that said this be taken down? Obviously a hater....

“I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been, in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races,”

he began, going on to say that he opposed blacks having the right to vote, to serve on juries, to hold office and to intermarry with whites. What he did believe was that, like all men, blacks had the right to improve their condition in society and to enjoy the fruits of their labor. In this way they were equal to white men, and for this reason slavery was inherently unjust.

Turtleneck wrote:

LooseGoose wrote:

So do you support removing the statues of the rapist Jefferson? The slave owner Washington? How about the battlefields do we strip those clean too? Or aren't those "hate statues"?

Were his victims wearing skirts? I guess not since you consider him rapist.

For $1,000 point out where I said that. Of course you can't without more distortion.......but no that you're losing on the facts you go to the personal smears. Typical. And that's when I take a day or so out of this cesspit of shit.

LooseGoose wrote:

Turtleneck wrote:

Were his victims wearing skirts? I guess not since you consider him rapist.

Join Nigel in stupid assery and be proud of it.

\

I am sorry for making a snarky remark based on your previous statements.

LooseGoose wrote:

Turtleneck wrote:

Were his victims wearing skirts? I guess not since you consider him rapist.

For $1,000 point out where I said that. Of course you can't without more distortion.......but no that you're losing on the facts you go to the personal smears. Typical. And that's when I take a day or so out of this cesspit of shit.

You have done that. In this thread.

Hypocrite.

Weird that Loose considers invoking his own words and logic as a "personal smear."

NigelUno wrote:

LooseGoose wrote:

For $1,000 point out where I said that. Of course you can't without more distortion.......but no that you're losing on the facts you go to the personal smears. Typical. And that's when I take a day or so out of this cesspit of shit.

You have done that. In this thread.

Hypocrite.

No. Calling you stupid for lying about what I posted is fair game. And you blatantly lied about what I offered the wager on.

Turtleneck wrote:Weird that Loose considers invoking his own words and logic as a "personal smear."

Post "my words" the actual quote.

Then we'll see who's smearing. Willing?

I guess no one wants to join the Lincoln slope.....

LooseGoose wrote:

NigelUno wrote:

You have done that. In this thread.

Hypocrite.

No. Calling you stupid for lying about what I posted is fair game. And you blatantly lied about what I offered the wager on.

Where did I lie about what you posted?

I'll wait.

LooseGoose wrote:

Turtleneck wrote:Weird that Loose considers invoking his own words and logic as a "personal smear."

Post "my words" the actual quote.

Then we'll see who's smearing. Willing?

Yes.

First it is...

LooseGoose wrote:

Herbie Green wrote:It seems the solution has to be to try and somehow reduce rapes rather than focused on trying to convict more rapists.

Now fully prepared for the "quit blaming the victim you heartless son of a bitch" posts.

Want to reduce rapes?  

Tell the women to:
       reduce or stop drinking.  
       stay with friends
       dress conservatively (Jeans and a top - not talking anything too radical)
    

If just those things happened I'd bet actual rapes would decrease by 90% or more.   I doubt that a sexual predator is looking for a reasonably sober woman in a group of people that's fully dressed.

Then, when women do not abide by your dress code, they become the equivalent of...

LooseGoose wrote:I can be called scary another 50 times and it won't diminish my amazement that people think no one is responsible for making bad choices/decisions.

Make a stupid decision, have a bad outcome - go to tSwill the guys there will assure you        that your stupid decision had nothing to do with the outcome.

Dance in black clothing at Midnight in the middle of I96 - tSwill will support that decision and blame the driver that hit you.

Wear a deerskin and antlers, run around the woods on the morning of November 15th - No worries about being called stupid, tSwill will blame the hunter that shot you.

Turtleneck wrote:

LooseGoose wrote:

Post "my words" the actual quote.

Then we'll see who's smearing. Willing?

Yes.

First it is...

LooseGoose wrote:
Now fully prepared for the "quit blaming the victim you heartless son of a bitch" posts.

Want to reduce rapes?  

Tell the women to:
       reduce or stop drinking.  
       stay with friends
       dress conservatively (Jeans and a top - not talking anything too radical)
    

If just those things happened I'd bet actual rapes would decrease by 90% or more.   I doubt that a sexual predator is looking for a reasonably sober woman in a group of people that's fully dressed.

Then, when women do not abide by your dress code, they become the equivalent of...

LooseGoose wrote:I can be called scary another 50 times and it won't diminish my amazement that people think no one is responsible for making bad choices/decisions.

Make a stupid decision, have a bad outcome - go to tSwill the guys there will assure you        that your stupid decision had nothing to do with the outcome.

Dance in black clothing at Midnight in the middle of I96 - tSwill will support that decision and blame the driver that hit you.

Wear a deerskin and antlers, run around the woods on the morning of November 15th - No worries about being called stupid, tSwill will blame the hunter that shot you.

That's a $1000 post.

Charlie Daniels is comparing those who destroy statues honoring Confederate soldiers to ISIS.

We are seeing Trump lead Americans further down the rabbit hole.

GRR Spartan wrote:Charlie Daniels is comparing those who destroy statues honoring Confederate soldiers to ISIS.

We are seeing Trump lead Americans further down the rabbit hole.

We should probably build a statue of Isis. You know. To preserve the history. So people don't forget. We'll put it in the center of town.

We could put a statue of Crazy Mo Atta in Lower Manhattan.

2015

For the record, comparing Robert E. Lee (and his statue) with George Washington is a false equivalency. It's something Trump has been doing on a number of levels lately, and anyone spinning it like he has been...

ERMAHGOD! Next they'll be wanting to marry their dogs!!

I dont recall if this has been posted or not, but it seems relevant.

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/updates/robert-e-lee-opposed-confederate-monuments/

Tear down and rename all things Columbus ....anyone that thinks this ends with CSA statues is naive as hell.

Native Americans protest Christopher Columbus replica ships

TRAVERSE CITY, Mich. (WPBN/WGTU) -- Some controversy erupted as replicas of two Christopher Columbus ships docked at Clinch Park Marina in Traverse City on Wednesday.
The Grand Traverse Band of Ottawa and Chippewa Indians protested as the Nina and Pinta ships pulled in.
Members of the band said the ships are a painful reminder of the past.
"To us this is the replication of a serious crime that happened to us," said Grand Traverse Band of Ottawa and Chippewa Indians Tribal Councilor Tom Shomin.
He said the ships represent historic lies.
"Things that were taught in schools were just fictitious," said Shomin. Christopher Columbus enslaved people and never made it to the mainland. People in the Caribbean were enslaved and tortured. He used to torture people for his own amusement. That's not someone I want to celebrate."
The ships are being brought to Traverse City with the help of the Maritime Heritage Alliance. It's part of an educational tour that visits 30 ports throughout the U.S.

I do not think this is the first time Columbus has been protested by the Native American community.

Turtleneck wrote:I do not think this is the first time Columbus has been protested by the Native American community.

You down for a road trip to traverse city with my turtleneck????

LooseGoose wrote:Tear down and rename all things Columbus ....anyone that thinks this ends with CSA statues is naive as hell.

Native Americans protest Christopher Columbus replica ships

TRAVERSE CITY, Mich. (WPBN/WGTU) -- Some controversy erupted as replicas of two Christopher Columbus ships docked at Clinch Park Marina in Traverse City on Wednesday.
The Grand Traverse Band of Ottawa and Chippewa Indians protested as the Nina and Pinta ships pulled in.
Members of the band said the ships are a painful reminder of the past.
"To us this is the replication of a serious crime that happened to us," said Grand Traverse Band of Ottawa and Chippewa Indians Tribal Councilor Tom Shomin.
He said the ships represent historic lies.
"Things that were taught in schools were just fictitious," said Shomin. Christopher Columbus enslaved people and never made it to the mainland. People in the Caribbean were enslaved and tortured. He used to torture people for his own amusement. That's not someone I want to celebrate."
The ships are being brought to Traverse City with the help of the Maritime Heritage Alliance. It's part of an educational tour that visits 30 ports throughout the U.S.

if we do, won't we forget about Columbus? That would be horrible. I've already forgot who the north fought against in the civil war.

Some folks are very comfortable wanting to memorialize a sucessionist movement and war that killed over 600,000 Americans from states that didn't want to break away.

What makes George Washington and Thomas Jefferson different? Neither supported breaking up the United States. In fact both supported the idea of a country rather than a colony of England.

Today the white separatists and neo nazi's want to wrap themselves in Confederate history and attempt to claim high ground on history. The Confederacy lost the war.

Civil War monument building really kicked in between 1900 and 1920 about the same time Jim Crow laws were being passed.and a smaller spike in the 1950's and 1960's when Civil Rights started seeing traction.

Monuments memorializing the losing side of the only Civil War is never on "the right side of history".

DWags wrote:

LooseGoose wrote:Tear down and rename all things Columbus ....anyone that thinks this ends with CSA statues is naive as hell.

Native Americans protest Christopher Columbus replica ships

if we do, won't we forget about Columbus? That would be horrible. I've already forgot who the north fought against in the civil war.

What civil war? Was that the war in Southeast Asia where everybody's girlfriends and wives came from?

LooseGoose wrote:Tear down and rename all things Columbus ....anyone that thinks this ends with CSA statues is naive as hell.

Native Americans protest Christopher Columbus replica ships

TRAVERSE CITY, Mich. (WPBN/WGTU) -- Some controversy erupted as replicas of two Christopher Columbus ships docked at Clinch Park Marina in Traverse City on Wednesday.
The Grand Traverse Band of Ottawa and Chippewa Indians protested as the Nina and Pinta ships pulled in.
Members of the band said the ships are a painful reminder of the past.
"To us this is the replication of a serious crime that happened to us," said Grand Traverse Band of Ottawa and Chippewa Indians Tribal Councilor Tom Shomin.
He said the ships represent historic lies.
"Things that were taught in schools were just fictitious," said Shomin. Christopher Columbus enslaved people and never made it to the mainland. People in the Caribbean were enslaved and tortured. He used to torture people for his own amusement. That's not someone I want to celebrate."
The ships are being brought to Traverse City with the help of the Maritime Heritage Alliance. It's part of an educational tour that visits 30 ports throughout the U.S.

I think they protested when he showed up.  

And a few times since then.

I thought you were taking a day off?

More deflection from the Mio's sage.

Well what about Columbus, what about Jefferson and Washington............
what about when Lewis left Martin?

Any port in a storm.

DWags wrote:

LooseGoose wrote:Tear down and rename all things Columbus ....anyone that thinks this ends with CSA statues is naive as hell.

Native Americans protest Christopher Columbus replica ships

if we do, won't we forget about Columbus? That would be horrible. I've already forgot who the north fought against in the civil war.

The Sparty statue is probably next!

We'll probably need a new mascot and nickname.

Mio is spinning off its axis!!!!!

GRR Spartan wrote:

Mio is spinning off its axis!!!!!

Protesters have been organizing at the Jay Smith statue by the high school. Because he was once the head coach of the CMU Chippewas, they are demanding his statue be torn down.

Turtleneck wrote:Were his victims wearing skirts? I guess not since you consider him rapist.

Turtleneck wrote:

LooseGoose wrote:
Join Nigel in stupid assery and be proud of it.

I am sorry for making a snarky remark based on your previous statements.

LooseGoose wrote:

Turtleneck wrote:Weird that Loose considers invoking his own words and logic as a "personal smear."

Post "my words"  the actual quote.
Then we'll see who's smearing.   Willing?

Now TN posts his "proof":

Turtleneck wrote:

Yes.

First it is...

LooseGoose wrote:
Now fully prepared for the "quit blaming the victim you heartless son of a bitch" posts.

Want to reduce rapes?  

Tell the women to:
       reduce or stop drinking.  
       stay with friends
       dress conservatively (Jeans and a top - not talking anything too radical)
    

If just those things happened I'd bet actual rapes would decrease by 90% or more.   I doubt that a sexual predator is looking for a reasonably sober woman in a group of people that's fully dressed.

Then, when women do not abide by your dress code, they become the equivalent of...

LooseGoose wrote:I can be called scary another 50 times and it won't diminish my amazement that people think no one is responsible for making bad choices/decisions.

Make a stupid decision, have a bad outcome - go to tSwill the guys there will assure you        that your stupid decision had nothing to do with the outcome.

Dance in black clothing at Midnight in the middle of I96 - tSwill will support that decision and blame the driver that hit you.

Wear a deerskin and antlers, run around the woods on the morning of November 15th - No worries about being called stupid, tSwill will blame the hunter that shot you.

Not once does the word "skirt" appear in either of my "damning" quotes.   I won't wait for an apology for your lie since you're too arrogant to offer one.  

And BTW not once in there do I in any way blame women for rapes.   That's a fiction and you know it.  I don't apologize for any of that advice for people.   IF you want to dress as a deer and dance in the woods, have at it.

And I see everyone jumped right on the Columbus stuff......anyone ready to defend the destruction of the Taney statue yet?   How about closing the memorial to that racist Lincoln?   You know the guy - aka The Great Emancipator.....amazing how people can change their views, except in libby world.

Turtleneck wrote:

LooseGoose wrote:

Join Nigel in stupid assery and be proud of it.

\

I am sorry for making a snarky remark based on your previous statements.

A lie. As usual.

1) You are not going to get an apology. If you meant something else, you sure could have found a better way to say it. Can you explain what this means? Why do you specifically say "jeans" if clothing like skirts are acceptable?  

LooseGoose wrote:dress conservatively (Jeans and a top - not talking anything too radical)

2) We have been over this. The playing in traffic and running around the woods analogies are beyond terrible. They both imply A) the victim is at least partially responsible for being harmed, and B) when somebody is harmed it is the result of an accident. That is a perfectly reasonable interpretation of your own words.

3) I will says it again: it is not my fault you put together one of the most God awful analogies in the history of the Internet message boards. If you were trying to say something other than what I wrote above, maybe you should have typed something up that was not nearly as stupid. Nothing I have said is a lie. Nothing. It is only a lie to you because you do not like how others have interpreted your ridiculous post based on the words you chose and ideas you presented.

3) The Taney and Lincoln comparisons are absurd. You are either being disingenuous, or are just historically illiterate. What? Do you think nobody here has read either the Dred Scot decision or the Lincoln-Douglas debates? Think again. In Dred Scot, Taney said African American could never be citizens, and upheld the practice of slavery by preventing the federal government from banning slavery in the territories. Tell me, in the Lincoln quote you provide from the fourth debate, where did Lincoln discuss the need to uphold the institution of slavery? Where exactly in his debate with Douglas on that night in September of 1858 did he say that slavery was a necessary feature of American society, and that the federal government was in no position to end slavery? Taney and Lincoln did not hold similar positions on the slavery issue no matter how often you suggest otherwise.

If women are contributing to their own rapes, maybe they shouldn't just dress conservatively, but maybe cover their faces, too.

As for the statues matter, they are not a piece of the historical record. If they are moved or removed, their names and societal impact won't be eliminated. They'll still be in history and textbooks, still be in museums, still widely available all across the internets. The absence of a statue doesn't change a single thing except the look of a small piece of real estate.

tGreenWay wrote:As for the statues matter, they are not a piece of the historical record. If they are moved or removed, their names and societal impact won't be eliminated. They'll still be in history and textbooks, still be in museums, still widely available all across the internets. The absence of a statue doesn't change a single thing except the look of a small piece of real estate.

Did you say real estate? Can I put condos where the Taney statue used to be? Asking for my son-in-law.

Signed,

Donald Trump

Turtleneck wrote:

tGreenWay wrote:As for the statues matter, they are not a piece of the historical record. If they are moved or removed, their names and societal impact won't be eliminated. They'll still be in history and textbooks, still be in museums, still widely available all across the internets. The absence of a statue doesn't change a single thing except the look of a small piece of real estate.

Did you say real estate? Can I put condos where the Taney statue used to be? Asking for my son-in-law.

Signed,

Donald Trump

See also; Trump Tower.