tOfficial 2015 Detroit Tigers thread

[Guest]

Just making this up. Would you trade McCann, Moya, Farmer and Machado for 2 months of Cueto and one year plus of Chapman? The Reds catcher is Bryan Pena. They could use an upgrade and Moya, Farmer and Machado seen to be Detroit's top prospects.

I wouldn't.   Especially McCann, we need to ditch Avila after this year and McCann is the replacement.

[The Pantry]

I wouldn't either.

Side note: WOW internet is out again today and they are giving no timeline it will be fixed. Oddly, tSwill is the only site I can get to through my router.

[WhiteBoyHatcher]

That sure would solve a ton of issues, though. Side Soria down and now the 8th is his. You could move Simon to the bullpen.

Nice four man rotation (if JV can be decent) and the fifth spot can be manned by Ryan/Lobstein until Greene works his issues out (wouldn't appear that he had just yet).

Ausmus is going to primarily play Avila over McCann anyway this year (and for who knows how long). We don't need a young SS. Some doubt whether Moya will ever be an everyday MLBer.

That would seemingly give them a very strong contender this year.

Btw the Royals are up 1-0 in the first already. :I

[WhiteBoyHatcher]

Yep, fuck WoW. I'm on my phone.

[steveschneider]

Just making this up. Would you trade McCann, Moya, Farmer and Machado for 2 months of Cueto and one year plus of Chapman? The Reds catcher is Bryan Pena. They could use an upgrade and Moya, Farmer and Machado seen to be Detroit's top prospects.

I wouldn't.   Especially McCann, we need to ditch Avila after this year and McCann is the replacement.

We desperately need pitching. It's either trade for it, hope we can find a diamond in the rough some where, sign free agents or spend the time to develop prospects. 2 months of Cueto doesn't sound worth it. If rather just try to sign him.

[WhiteBoyHatcher]

Just curious... Those saying no... How familiar are you with Cueto and Chapman?

[steveschneider]

Just curious... Those saying no... How familiar are you with Cueto and Chapman?

Chapman is unbelievable, love his nickname 'the cuban missile'. Cueto, I've only watched on game. Both are unreal.

I mean if they fell like they can sign Cueto next year, then the answer is yes. At this rate we are very like to lose the games in two spots of our rotation. You just can't have that happening all season and expect to make the postseason.

IMO if you trade McCann, don't make it to the post season and fail to resign Cueto then you still have a major problem in 2016 with a big hole in your rotation.

[Floyd Robertson]

Good K for Greene there.

[Guest]

Just curious... Those saying no... How familiar are you with Cueto and Chapman?

I follow baseball pretty closely so know both of them.  I really like McCann though and hate to give him up.

[The Pantry]

Yeah, McCann's a keeper. Avila gotta go.

[steveschneider]

Yeah, McCann's a keeper. Avila gotta go.

Not going to get much for trading Avila. If the Tigers want to immediately add a quality pitcher then some one valuable on the starting roster will have to go.

[HT]

Yeah, McCann's a keeper.  Avila gotta go.

Avila's main benefit is that he's better at pitch framing and has more experience. I think he'd be a good backup, particularly to have when Verlander starts given how good their rapport is, but I would way rather have McCann be the primary catcher for the team.

[Floyd Robertson]

If Victor hadn't signed that four year deal, I could have seen Avila full-time at 1st, backing up McCann and Miggy to DH.

Well, Greene has fizzled.

[Triple Sparty]

Reds starting catcher (Mesaraco) is injured this year and not sure Reds need another. But Chapman would be an upgrade and moving Soria to 8 would double effectiveness of bullpen (until Joba gets back).

[The Pantry]

Not suggesting we'd get anything for Avila. More wondering when his contract is up. I'd look it up but this is the only site I can get to on my laptop right now. WOW sucks.

I'd rather have Holaday as back-up.

[steveschneider]

If Victor hadn't signed that four year deal, I could have seen Avila full-time at 1st, backing up McCann and Miggy to DH.

Well, Greene has fizzled.

The +'s of Avilla

Left handed hitter
Has some pop in his bat
Great rapport with pitchers
Pretty good at blocking wild pitches
Last year he had a cannon for an arm and threw out a lot of runners.

+'s of McCann

very bright future
Cannon for an arm
Better bat than avilla.

[steveschneider]

Reds starting catcher (Mesaraco) is injured this year and not sure Reds need another. But Chapman would be an upgrade and moving Soria to 8 would double effectiveness of bullpen (until Joba gets back).

Joba is gone. He got his unconditional release the other day.

[Guest]

Not suggesting we'd get anything for Avila.  More wondering when his contract is up.  I'd look it up but this is the only site I can get to on my laptop right now.  WOW sucks.

I'd rather have Holaday as back-up.

This season.   McCann is in line to be the main man next year, saves us about $6M a year too.

[Triple Sparty]

Joba is gone. He got his unconditional release the other day.

Ha. That was tongue-in-cheek but I guess the joke was on me.

[Guest]

I'm not Dave Dombrowski but given the right trades for prospects I'd move some big names  -


Available in trade:
Price - only for a BIG package otherwise try to sign him.
Simon for a bag of balls.
Krol - won't bring much
Al, Al - probably at the peak of his value.
Soria
Rondon - I don't think he'll ever get it together.  Too many rumors of laziness.
Avila - FA to be after the season.
Kinsler - I'm tired of him.
Cespedes - Like Price it has to be a BIG package.
Rajai - if we can get anything of value.
Victor - probably won't bring crap so hold on.
 
 
 
Build around:
 
Have Fields/Moya in minors at least. - LF
Gose CF
JD RF
 
Castellanos 3B
Iglesias SS
Have Machado in 3A for 2B.
Cabrera 1B
McCann C
 
Have Marte/Moya for DH - DH's are easy to find.
 
SP
Verlander - untradeable contract and I still think he re-emerges as a #2-#3 starter.
Sanchez
Greene but he's going to need another MiLBB stint.
Lobstein whenever he can come back.
Anyone else they can dredge up to give a shot.
 
RP
Hardy
Wilson
Ryan
Feliz - no trade value for now

[WhiteBoyHatcher]

That's not bad, but you're looking at a 70 win team next year and perhaps for the next few seasons if you go that route. 

Price isn't signing here. That ship has sailed imo. They're not currently negotiating and it makes no sense for him to give up the leverage that the free market will bring at the end of the year. And barring a second half collapse, he's going to be looking at a Scherzer-esque $200m+ deal. The Tigers are not going to commit that kind of money to a SP entering his 30s with the JV and Miggy contracts on their books. 

I think the same is basically true of Yoenis. He's going to be looking for $100m or so. 

I also don't think they're going to command much in return in a trade. 

Also you are forgetting Farmer. By most accounts he's their top minor league prospect. 

Tyler Collins seems like a kid with decent upside, too.

[Guest]

That's not bad, but you're looking at a 70 win team next year and perhaps for the next few seasons if you go that route. 

Price isn't signing here. That ship has sailed imo. They're not currently negotiating and it makes no sense for him to give up the leverage that the free market will bring at the end of the year. And barring a second half collapse, he's going to be looking at a Scherzer-esque $200m+ deal. The Tigers are not going to commit that kind of money to a SP entering his 30s with the JV and Miggy contracts on their books. 

I think the same is basically true of Yoenis. He's going to be looking for $100m or so. 

I also don't think they're going to command much in return in a trade. 

Also you are forgetting Farmer. By most accounts he's their top minor league prospect. 

Tyler Collins seems like a kid with decent upside, too.

I agree with most of this but honestly am ready to root for some kids again rather than overpaid mercenaries.  We may take some lumps but it won't be as frustrating.

Price/Cespedes probably won't bring much but you never know what some team might throw out there - and any offer has to be balanced against the 1st round Comp pick we'll probably get if we simply keep them.

Farmer would be among the SP's getting a further trial, better to work with him than waste any more time on Simon.

I completely forget about Collins since he's been on the DL down at Toledo but he's at least a serviceable OFer with some pop in his bat.

[HT]

I'm not Dave Dombrowski but given the right trades for prospects I'd move some big names  -


Available in trade:
Price - only for a BIG package otherwise try to sign him.
Simon for a bag of balls.
Krol - won't bring much
Al, Al - probably at the peak of his value.
Soria
Rondon - I don't think he'll ever get it together.  Too many rumors of laziness.
Avila - FA to be after the season.
Kinsler - I'm tired of him.
Cespedes - Like Price it has to be a BIG package.
Rajai - if we can get anything of value.
Victor - probably won't bring crap so hold on.
 
 
 
Build around:
 
Have Fields/Moya in minors at least. - LF
Gose CF
JD RF
 
Castellanos 3B
Iglesias SS
Have Machado in 3A for 2B.
Cabrera 1B
McCann C
 
Have Marte/Moya for DH - DH's are easy to find.
 
SP
Verlander - untradeable contract and I still think he re-emerges as a #2-#3 starter.
Sanchez
Greene but he's going to need another MiLBB stint.
Lobstein whenever he can come back.
Anyone else they can dredge up to give a shot.
 
RP
Hardy
Wilson
Ryan
Feliz - no trade value for now

I completely agree with this. There's a decent core to build around, and if the Tigers sell now, it'll make the rebuild go a bit quicker and be a bit easier to bear. They need to rebuild and need to get rid of some assets before they get almost nothing for them (compensatory draft picks take years to bear any kind of results and are even more of a crapshoot than prospects).

That being said. I don't think Ilitch lets that happen.

[Guest]

I completely agree with this. There's a decent core to build around, and if the Tigers sell now, it'll make the rebuild go a bit quicker and be a bit easier to bear. They need to rebuild and need to get rid of some assets before they get almost nothing for them (compensatory draft picks take years to bear any kind of results and are even more of a crapshoot than prospects).

That being said. I don't think Ilitch lets that happen.

Even with their contracts you'd think Price - Cespedes - Kinsler - Al Al - Soria - Avila would bring some return.   Rajai - Victor - Krol - Rondon - Simon maybe not so much but even some prospects would be worth it.

I think we turn over the culture of this team a bit, shake things up.  DD is certainly not going to trade all of those guys but 5-7 of them wouldn't bother me a bit.

[The Pantry]

Tigers are 9 or 10 out now and no way they'll even get to a wild card spot without a miracle. I know they want a World Series win for Ilitch before he kicks but it's not gonna happen this year.

[steveschneider]

Tigers are 9 or 10 out now and no way they'll even get to a wild card spot without a miracle. I know they want a World Series win for Ilitch before he kicks but it's not gonna happen this year.

I know Mr. Illitch and Dave D. aren't the selling types but I think the writing is on the wall for 2015. Time to sell. Regarding Price or Cespedes if you don't think you can afford them then sell them.

After that they should look at every piece, see if there are buyers and weigh out what the can get for them.

[Floyd Robertson]

Been a while since the Tigers were pretty much out of it by the ASB. I'm not really sure how to deal with this.

[HT]

Been a while since the Tigers were pretty much out of it by the ASB.  I'm not really sure how to deal with this.

Weren't they considered out of it in 2011? I remember they seemed to be behind until they went on that tear in August.

I'm just going to keep following the team. If they sell, then cool, I hope they play spoiler and ruin it for some teams. If they buy...well, I won't be happy about that, but I'll be watching as much as I can to see if they'll make the playoffs.

[steveschneider]

Been a while since the Tigers were pretty much out of it by the ASB.  I'm not really sure how to deal with this.

Weren't they considered out of it in 2011? I remember they seemed to be behind until they went on that tear in August.

I'm just going to keep following the team. If they sell, then cool, I hope they play spoiler and ruin it for some teams. If they buy...well, I won't be happy about that, but I'll be watching as much as I can to see if they'll make the playoffs.

There won't be a tear in August for this team sadly. I also think that Brad's days are numbered. Perhaps if this team can come out of the all star break and go on a win streak similar to the one they had back in April they'll buy. But I think the window is about a centimeter away from being shut.

[HT]

Weren't they considered out of it in 2011? I remember they seemed to be behind until they went on that tear in August.

I'm just going to keep following the team. If they sell, then cool, I hope they play spoiler and ruin it for some teams. If they buy...well, I won't be happy about that, but I'll be watching as much as I can to see if they'll make the playoffs.

There won't be a tear in August for this team sadly. I also think that Brad's days are numbered. Perhaps if this team can come out of the all star break and go on a win streak similar to the one they had back in April they'll buy. But I think the window is about a centimeter away from being shut.

I don't think Ausmus is a good manager, and I think they'd be in a better position with someone proven, but you might as well keep him as the team rebuilds and then replace him with a real manager, like they did with Trammel before Leyland.

[Guest]

Weren't they considered out of it in 2011? I remember they seemed to be behind until they went on that tear in August.

I'm just going to keep following the team. If they sell, then cool, I hope they play spoiler and ruin it for some teams. If they buy...well, I won't be happy about that, but I'll be watching as much as I can to see if they'll make the playoffs.

There won't be a tear in August for this team sadly. I also think that Brad's days are numbered. Perhaps if this team can come out of the all star break and go on a win streak similar to the one they had back in April they'll buy. But I think the window is about a centimeter away from being shut.

We should have pushed Leyland out and hired Tito 3 years ago.

[HT]

There won't be a tear in August for this team sadly. I also think that Brad's days are numbered. Perhaps if this team can come out of the all star break and go on a win streak similar to the one they had back in April they'll buy. But I think the window is about a centimeter away from being shut.

We should have pushed Leyland out and hired Tito 3 years ago.

I don't disagree there, though it's hard to fire Leyland when he wins you you're first division title in 24 years and then wins the AL pennant a year later. Would have been a bad look for the organization.

I do think with Tito, they win it all in either 2012 or 2013. Kind of sucks that he's wasting away in Cleveland now.

[steveschneider]

There won't be a tear in August for this team sadly. I also think that Brad's days are numbered. Perhaps if this team can come out of the all star break and go on a win streak similar to the one they had back in April they'll buy. But I think the window is about a centimeter away from being shut.

We should have pushed Leyland out and hired Tito 3 years ago.

I was a huge Leyland fan and thought he was one of the top managers in baseball.

I hope some day people will look back at what he did and realize how damn good he was. 2 WS, 3 ALCS is nothing to sneeze at.

I also think if Dombrowski gave him a better BP his last season he beats Boston and wins the WS against the Cards.

[Guest]

Henning: Gruesome relief remains Dombrowski's Achilles heel

What's interesting – and perhaps ominous – for Dombrowski and Tigers Nation is that this picture, at least as it appears today in Detroit, could turn more depressing in the coming weeks.

The Tigers have a brutal schedule through mid-August: Baltimore, Boston, Tampa Bay, Baltimore again, Kansas City, Boston, Kansas City again. And they must step into this fusillade minus Miguel Cabrera, who won't be back until sometime late in August because of a damaged calf.

It's something to ponder as a team plots its next moves: Add a starting pitcher, which the Tigers appear ready to do? Decide at the end of this month, in the waning hours before the July 31 trade deadline, that an unexpectedly generous trade offer for free-agent-to-be David Price is worth pondering?

Anything is possible. Including, of course, another bullpen blow-up that probably wouldn't be in the best interests of a GM, or a traumatized fan base.

[WhiteBoyHatcher]

Yeah I just read that a bit ago.

Lynn sure loves drama but I think he has well placed sources in the organization. Wonder if there's any merit to the Ilitches being fed up with DD. Doesn't seem likely to me.

[Giant Moose]

Yeah I just read that a bit ago.

Lynn sure loves drama but I think he has well placed sources in the organization. Wonder if there's any merit to the Ilitches being fed up with DD. Doesn't seem likely to me.

I think they are just because they thought DD would bring them a World Series victory before Ilitch died. It's not going to happen, the Ilitches are starting to realize it, and they are going to blame whoever they can.

[steveschneider]

IMO if you think about the lack of a WS ring and you want to point a finger, the atrocious bullpen is the obvious target.

Dombrowski gets a D- on the bullpen and I still stand by it, that cost the Tigers the WS in 2013.

I also give him a C for the hiring of Ausmus. I feel like there were better options out there, and last year the window was still open. Ausmus got schooled by Showalter last year, and I don't rule out that a better manager could have gotten the Tigers past the Orioles.

They should keep DD, I don't think they're going to find a better GM and honestly it's not really a part of the game I pay that close of attention too. I do know that Dave has a great track record and he's been in the league forever.

[steveschneider]

"Twins beat Detroit after trailing, 6-1, in the ninth on Friday. Teams trailing by five-plus runs in the ninth or later were 0-and-1,059 during the past two seasons."

OUCH!!!! After that game I was trying to remember the last time I saw one of my teams just give away win like that. My last memory was the famous same old Spartans situation of ND vs. MSU in EL when JLS stopped running the ball and ND came back to win.

[steveschneider]

Just read it, I didn't put too much weight into the bottom half of the article.

I agree with him on the bullpen though, pretty much supported my arguments above.

[Guest]

Yeah I just read that a bit ago.

Lynn sure loves drama but I think he has well placed sources in the organization. Wonder if there's any merit to the Ilitches being fed up with DD. Doesn't seem likely to me.

I agree with Lynn about 60% of the time on baseball stuff and about 5% of the time on politics but I respect him because he'll always engage in a solid conversation on any of it.

With Gage, Lowe, Henning, Knobler, Morosi and others we've been blessed over the years with some pretty good baseball writers in Detroit.

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