Re: Student Loans

by **Trapper Gus** Thu 27 Jul 2023 - 9:10

kingstonlake wrote:
Trapper Gus wrote:

Are you really blaming Biden for the Supreme Court going off the rails and ruling that what the laws say in black & white isn't legal with a brand new made up principle of "if it helps Democratics or the common people it can't be allowed"?

Lack of awareness like that is part of how we ended up in this mess.

I’m blaming Biden for not knowing the political and judiciary climate when pandering for votes. But hey, he got the votes he wanted.

Be an unapologetic excuse maker for your preferred politician is why this country is in the mess it’s in right now.

So the Republicans stole another seat on the court long after Biden's "promise" to do everything he could to provide Student Loan relief & how exactly was he supposed to know the make up of Congress before it was elected?

Also, do you not know legally how far off the rails this court has strayed? They have completely created a new rule for justifying their rulings out of thin air.

by **kingstonlake** Thu 27 Jul 2023 - 9:27

Trapper Gus wrote:
kingstonlake wrote:

I’m blaming Biden for not knowing the political and judiciary climate when pandering for votes. But hey, he got the votes he wanted.

Be an unapologetic excuse maker for your preferred politician is why this country is in the mess it’s in right now.

So the Republicans stole another seat on the court long after Biden's "promise" to do everything he could to provide Student Loan relief & how exactly was he supposed to know the make up of Congress before it was elected?

Also, do you not know legally how far off the rails this court has strayed? They have completely created a new rule for justifying their rulings out of thin air.

You’re smart enough to know losing 6-3 and losing 5-4 is still a loss.

by **Travis of the Cosmos** Thu 27 Jul 2023 - 9:37

I know that you’re physically incapable of criticizing biden, but there certainly are other things he could do.

For starters, instead of announcing a plan then making people apply, then giving time and room for legal challenges, he could have just fucking done it. Skip the stupid waste of money means testing. It always costs more than it saves anyway. Just eliminate the 10,000 for everyone tomorrow and be done with it. Would there be legal challenges? Sure. But adding back debt that had been removed, reopening accounts that had been closed (would that even be legal? Shit I dunno that’s murky) is a different thing from stopping a plan that hadn’t been implemented yet.

So yeah, there are other things he could have done that he chose not to do. There are other acts that he could implement this under right now outside of the one that the illegally struck down (don’t use “what biden could legally do” when the courts actions themselves are unconstitutional).

by **Cameron** Thu 27 Jul 2023 - 10:15

We all know that Biden doesn't actually care that much about student loan forgiveness, and I believe he is on the record as saying he would veto medicare for all if a bill miraculously hit his desk. He just has to pay lipservice to good ideas from time to time so that the progressive wing doesn't completely turn on him.

But don't get me wrong, Bare Minimum Biden is better than the Republican alternative. We just don't need to give him more credit than he deserves.

by **Trapper Gus** Thu 27 Jul 2023 - 10:50

kingstonlake wrote:
Trapper Gus wrote:

So the Republicans stole another seat on the court long after Biden's "promise" to do everything he could to provide Student Loan relief & how exactly was he supposed to know the make up of Congress before it was elected?

Also, do you not know legally how far off the rails this court has strayed? They have completely created a new rule for justifying their rulings out of thin air.

You’re smart enough to know losing 6-3 and losing 5-4 is still a loss.

I'm also smart enough to know that Roberts in particular needs to be on the winning side and is more concerned about his court's legacy than the other 5. Thus to assume the same outcomes is more than we know.

by **kingstonlake** Thu 27 Jul 2023 - 10:53

Sigh.

by **Trapper Gus** Thu 27 Jul 2023 - 10:55

Cameron wrote:We all know that Biden doesn't actually care that much about student loan forgiveness, and I believe he is on the record as saying he would veto medicare for all if a bill miraculously hit his desk. He just has to pay lipservice to good ideas from time to time so that the progressive wing doesn't completely turn on him.

But don't get me wrong, Bare Minimum Biden is better than the Republican alternative. We just don't need to give him more credit than he deserves.

He didn't give a flat "no way". He said he would veto it if it wasn't paid for.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/10/biden-says-he-wouldd-veto-medicare-for-all-as-coronavirus-focuses-attention-on-health.html

by **Trapper Gus** Thu 27 Jul 2023 - 11:01

kingstonlake wrote:Sigh.

It is immaterial now, for sure.

However your comment was about what Biden knew when he made the promise, so it seems fair to ask what he knew at the time, not today.

Seriously, until the last year people still had hope for a Conservative but honest court. Once they overruled Roe it became clear how dishonest the Republican appointees had been.

by **Cameron** Thu 27 Jul 2023 - 12:56

Trapper Gus wrote:
Cameron wrote:We all know that Biden doesn't actually care that much about student loan forgiveness, and I believe he is on the record as saying he would veto medicare for all if a bill miraculously hit his desk. He just has to pay lipservice to good ideas from time to time so that the progressive wing doesn't completely turn on him.

But don't get me wrong, Bare Minimum Biden is better than the Republican alternative. We just don't need to give him more credit than he deserves.

He didn't give a flat "no way". He said he would veto it if it wasn't paid for.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/10/biden-says-he-wouldd-veto-medicare-for-all-as-coronavirus-focuses-attention-on-health.html

That makes me feel so much better about him taking such a stupid position. /s

by **Robert J Sakimano** Thu 27 Jul 2023 - 19:24

rich white people suck.

by **Trapper Gus** Thu 27 Jul 2023 - 19:43

Cameron wrote:
Trapper Gus wrote:

He didn't give a flat "no way". He said he would veto it if it wasn't paid for.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/10/biden-says-he-wouldd-veto-medicare-for-all-as-coronavirus-focuses-attention-on-health.html

That makes me feel so much better about him taking such a stupid position. /s

He is a good politician, stupid is his middle name.

by **Trapper Gus** Sun 30 Jul 2023 - 16:04

Federal student loan borrowers can access the beta website at https://studentaid.gov/idr/. The enrollment process is estimated to take 10 minutes, and many sections can be automatically populated with information the government has on hand, including tax returns from the IRS, administration officials said.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/07/30/politics/biden-student-loan-repayment-plan/index.html

Law suit challage is dismissed.

https://thehill.com/homenews/education/4152644-federal-judge-tosses-suit-against-biden-student-loan-forgiveness-plan-for-long-term-borrowers/

by **Trapper Gus** Tue 22 Aug 2023 - 7:22

https://www.bridgemi.com/talent-education/future-student-loan-forgiveness-what-know-michigan

by **kingstonlake** Tue 22 Aug 2023 - 8:10

If you’re one of the people who were told you’re getting $20,000 in forgiveness but actually are not, and feel like giving yourself a headache, navigate through the 4 income driven repayment plans.

(Trapper you can reply but are not required too)

by **Trapper Gus** Tue 22 Aug 2023 - 8:24

kingstonlake wrote:If you’re one of the people who were told you’re getting $20,000 in forgiveness but actually are not, and feel like giving yourself a headache, navigate through the 4 income driven repayment plans.

(Trapper you can reply but are not required too)

Oh but you know I will...

You can thank the Supreme Court with its head scratching decisions when the law is very clear that the executive branch was directly given the authority to forgive these loans and to anyone who has ever voted for or contributed to Republicans for the current situation.

All the Debbie Downers who keep blaming Joe Biden for trying to make their lives better just don't "get" this fact.

by Spartytruth Tue 22 Aug 2023 - 9:01

Bidens current plan is a lifesaver for thousands of people.

by **Travis of the Cosmos** Tue 22 Aug 2023 - 13:59

Trapper Gus wrote:
kingstonlake wrote:If you’re one of the people who were told you’re getting $20,000 in forgiveness but actually are not, and feel like giving yourself a headache, navigate through the 4 income driven repayment plans.

(Trapper you can reply but are not required too)

Oh but you know I will...

You can thank the Supreme Court with its head scratching decisions when the law is very clear that the executive branch was directly given the authority to forgive these loans and to anyone who has ever voted for or contributed to Republicans for the current situation.

All the Debbie Downers who keep blaming Joe Biden for trying to make their lives better just don't "get" this fact.

They “get” it. But they also actually have to deal with real world implications of his failure rather than just be a message board lapdog that doesn’t actually have any skin in the game.

by **Trapper Gus** Tue 22 Aug 2023 - 14:55

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:
Trapper Gus wrote:

Oh but you know I will...

You can thank the Supreme Court with its head scratching decisions when the law is very clear that the executive branch was directly given the authority to forgive these loans and to anyone who has ever voted for or contributed to Republicans for the current situation.

All the Debbie Downers who keep blaming Joe Biden for trying to make their lives better just don't "get" this fact.
They “get” it. But they also actually have to deal with real world implications of his failure rather than just be a message board lapdog that doesn’t actually have any skin in the game.

"His" failure? Biden has been working his ass off while the voters have been srewing the pup.

Spoken like someone whose children haven't graduated from MSU yet...

However, this just showed up in my news feed.

https://www.cnbc.com/2023/08/22/student-loan-borrowers-may-see-their-bill-drop-to-0-under-save-plan-.html

by **Travis of the Cosmos** Tue 22 Aug 2023 - 15:12

I’m not going to go over this with you again trappy. If you can’t remember and need a reminder for what I’m talking about here’s a link

https://spartanswill.forumotion.com/t22613p520-student-loans#862198

by **Trapper Gus** Tue 22 Aug 2023 - 15:18

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:I’m not going to go over this with you again trappy. If you can’t remember and need a reminder for what I’m talking about here’s a link

https://spartanswill.forumotion.com/t22613p520-student-loans#862198

Oh come on, do you want me to bitch at you because people like you don't give a shit that the federal government allowed private pensions to be eliminated and my retirement income was cut by 75%.

Grow up kid, we, collectively, allowed this to happen, Biden has done everything thing he can and you still want to (metaphorically) line him up against a wall and shoot him.

by **Travis of the Cosmos** Tue 22 Aug 2023 - 15:33

I don’t really care trapper. Bitch if you want. maybe you should. In fact, you’re right. You should. Hold people accountable. Problem is you’re too busy being a cuck bitch for your side of the aisle to not hold them accountable when they fail.

by **Trapper Gus** Tue 22 Aug 2023 - 17:40

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:I don’t really care trapper. Bitch if you want. maybe you should. In fact, you’re right. You should. Hold people accountable. Problem is you’re too busy being a cuck bitch for your side of the aisle to not hold them accountable when they fail.

Maybe you don't care that they did their best but the other side outplayed them because shit heads voted them. The thing is politics is a long term game. Expecting short term solutions is like trying to win a football game on only one play, with the team not on the field for all the other plays.

by **kingstonlake** Tue 22 Aug 2023 - 18:14

Trapper Gus wrote:
Travis of the Cosmos wrote:I don’t really care trapper. Bitch if you want. maybe you should. In fact, you’re right. You should. Hold people accountable. Problem is you’re too busy being a cuck bitch for your side of the aisle to not hold them accountable when they fail.

Maybe you don't care that they did their best but the other side outplayed them because shit heads voted them. The thing is politics is a long term game. Expecting short term solutions is like trying to win a football game on only one play, with the team not on the field for all the other plays.

I think it’s more like saying you’re going to win 11 games in a season, end up winning 4, and blaming the refs.

by **Trapper Gus** Tue 22 Aug 2023 - 18:28

kingstonlake wrote:
Trapper Gus wrote:

Maybe you don't care that they did their best but the other side outplayed them because shit heads voted them. The thing is politics is a long term game. Expecting short term solutions is like trying to win a football game on only one play, with the team not on the field for all the other plays.

I think it’s more like saying you’re going to win 11 games in a season, end up winning 4, and blaming the refs.

Given that the refs were installed by the other team, and understanding that this poster has been at winery's all afternoon with his SO and her friend, yes.

by **kingstonlake** Tue 22 Aug 2023 - 18:51

Trapper Gus wrote:
kingstonlake wrote:

I think it’s more like saying you’re going to win 11 games in a season, end up winning 4, and blaming the refs.

Given that the refs were installed by the other team, and understanding that this poster has been at winery's all afternoon with his SO and her friend, yes.

Why would promise 11 wins under those circumstances?

by sεяεηιτλ Tue 22 Aug 2023 - 19:45

Geez guys, when I came here I thought ya'll were friends. Instead I see a basket full of cuck bitches, binders full of cuck bitches. :(

by **Trapper Gus** Tue 22 Aug 2023 - 22:55

kingstonlake wrote:
Trapper Gus wrote:

Given that the refs were installed by the other team, and understanding that this poster has been at winery's all afternoon with his SO and her friend, yes.

Why would promise 11 wins under those circumstances?

You spend 6 hours drinking wine. 16 wins seems reasonable.

by **Turtleneck** Tue 22 Aug 2023 - 23:29

kingstonlake wrote:
Trapper Gus wrote:

Maybe you don't care that they did their best but the other side outplayed them because shit heads voted them. The thing is politics is a long term game. Expecting short term solutions is like trying to win a football game on only one play, with the team not on the field for all the other plays.

I think it’s more like saying you’re going to win 11 games in a season, end up winning 4, and blaming the refs.

So this is a UM thread now?

by **kingstonlake** Wed 23 Aug 2023 - 4:13

Turtleneck wrote:
kingstonlake wrote:

I think it’s more like saying you’re going to win 11 games in a season, end up winning 4, and blaming the refs.

So this is a UM thread now?

Tee’d it up for ya, didn’t I?

by **Trapper Gus** Wed 23 Aug 2023 - 8:05

Drunk posting will do that to a thread.

https://www.businessinsider.com/student-loan-forgiveness-scam-debt-relief-refunds-doj-ftc-borrowers-2023-8

https://www.axios.com/2023/08/22/income-driven-student-loan-repayment-plan-biden

by Spartytruth Wed 23 Aug 2023 - 10:25

Apparently the new plan for student loans is expected to cost more than the forgiveness plan the SCOTUS banned. The idiocy of conservatives continues.

by **Trapper Gus** Sun 27 Aug 2023 - 11:42

https://www.businessinsider.com/how-to-get-student-loan-forgiveness-debt-relief-couple-idr-2023-8

by **Travis of the Cosmos** Sun 27 Aug 2023 - 13:40

Spartytruth wrote:Apparently the new plan for student loans is expected to cost more than the forgiveness plan the SCOTUS banned. The idiocy of conservatives continues.

This is why if you just do it, say fuck off to means testing and applications and 6-12 months of waiting after you announce it, and just do it tomorrow, the whole thing washes out in a news cycle or two and no one really remembers except for those immensely helped. Means testing is always the stupidest idea these lame brained dipshits try to do.

by **Trapper Gus** Sun 27 Aug 2023 - 17:19

If only that was the case, but the conservatives, including some who are members of the Democratic Party use the resentments of voters who disagree to excite voters to gain votes, and turn education into another bipolar issue, and thus sweep student loans up in the never ending, and mindless, political battle about spending money & taxes.

by **Motown Spartan** Sun 27 Aug 2023 - 17:23

The student loan issue is not about money for Republicans. It’s about discouraging people from going to college because the majority of college educated voters do not vote for Republicans.

by **Trapper Gus** Fri 1 Dec 2023 - 8:28

President Joe Biden sent emails to about 813,000 borrowers this week to say: “Congratulations, your student loan has been forgiven.”

The debt forgiveness comes after fixes to an income-driven repayment plan accurately counted the number qualifying monthly payments that bring borrowers closer to forgiveness. Borrowers impacted by the errors “never saw the forgiveness they were promised – even after making payments for decades,” according to Biden. As a result of the fixes, more than $40 billion of debt is being discharged for hundreds of thousands of borrowers.

https://www.mlive.com/public-interest/2023/11/your-student-loan-has-been-forgiven-emails-go-to-nearly-29000-in-michigan.html

Also some details of the new program to forgive student loans:

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/statements-releases/2022/08/24/fact-sheet-president-biden-announces-student-loan-relief-for-borrowers-who-need-it-most/

by Zurn Fri 1 Dec 2023 - 9:31

Motown Spartan wrote:The student loan issue is not about money for Republicans. It’s about discouraging people from going to college because the majority of college educated voters do not vote for Republicans.

As one against forgiving student loans, I would say it's not about discouraging college attendance. It's about fairness. It has never been adequately explained to me why of all the possible types of loans Democrats could have chosen to forgive they picked student loans. Why not car loans? Mortgages? Small business loans? Credit card debt?

I see it for what it is: vote buying.

The whole student loan, college tuition thing is basically racketeering anyway and is largely responsible for the skyrocketing tuition we have today.

by **Trapper Gus** Fri 1 Dec 2023 - 9:58

Zurn wrote:
Motown Spartan wrote:The student loan issue is not about money for Republicans. It’s about discouraging people from going to college because the majority of college educated voters do not vote for Republicans.

As one against forgiving student loans, I would say it's not about discouraging college attendance. It's about fairness. It has never been adequately explained to me why of all the possible types of loans Democrats could have chosen to forgive they picked student loans. Why not car loans? Mortgages? Small business loans? Credit card debt?

I see it for what it is: vote buying.

The whole student loan, college tuition thing is basically racketeering anyway and is largely responsible for the skyrocketing tuition we have today.

We could argue about if the benefit of an educated population is more a benefit to the educated person or to the population as a whole do to a more robust economy. I would come down on one side, you probably would be on the other.

However, the fact is, with the higher than market interest rates, the federal guarantee to the lenders that they will be made whole by the government on defaults, and the payment of principle by most student many times over, the student loans are just a hugh grift by the banks and wealthy, eating away at the poor kids who are bettering our lives, and theirs.

Forgiving the borrowers like we forgive the lenders in this market will cause a significant increase in the output of our economy, and thus is just good economic policy.

by **Travis of the Cosmos** Fri 1 Dec 2023 - 10:20

Zurn wrote:
Motown Spartan wrote:The student loan issue is not about money for Republicans. It’s about discouraging people from going to college because the majority of college educated voters do not vote for Republicans.

As one against forgiving student loans, I would say it's not about discouraging college attendance. It's about fairness. It has never been adequately explained to me why of all the possible types of loans Democrats could have chosen to forgive they picked student loans. Why not car loans? Mortgages? Small business loans? Credit card debt?

I see it for what it is: vote buying.

The whole student loan, college tuition thing is basically racketeering anyway and is largely responsible for the skyrocketing tuition we have today.

Read the fuckin thread then dipshit. All of your answers are in there.

by **Cameron** Fri 1 Dec 2023 - 10:29

Zurn wrote:
Motown Spartan wrote:The student loan issue is not about money for Republicans. It’s about discouraging people from going to college because the majority of college educated voters do not vote for Republicans.

As one against forgiving student loans, I would say it's not about discouraging college attendance. It's about fairness. It has never been adequately explained to me why of all the possible types of loans Democrats could have chosen to forgive they picked student loans. Why not car loans? Mortgages? Small business loans? Credit card debt?

I see it for what it is: vote buying.

The whole student loan, college tuition thing is basically racketeering anyway and is largely responsible for the skyrocketing tuition we have today.

Let's say they picked student loan debt relief the same way they picked student loan debt to be one of the few types not dischargeable in bankruptcy. Was that a fair choice, or was that driven by special interests?

Don't answer that, I don't care.

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