Re: Multiple victims in a "mass shooting" at Orlando club.

by **xsanguine** 2016-06-13, 19:28

FBI Called Off Investigation Of Orlando Shooter Because They Thought His Coworkers Were Racist

If true, it'd be interesting. PC culture being the cause for not stopping a terrorist attack. Many Europeans have been bitching about this with regards to rapes and crimes in their countries.

by **Turtleneck** 2016-06-13, 19:35

How Did the FBI Miss Omar Mateen? Law enforcement did all it could, but post-9/11 restrictions on “probable cause” limit the FBI’s ability to investigate would-be terrorists.

http://foreignpolicy.com/2016/06/13/orlando-pulse-massacre-omar-mateen-is-it-time-for-a-change-in-how-the-fbi-conducts-terror-investigations/?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=New%20Campaign&utm_term=%2AEditors%20Picks

by **Travis of the Cosmos** 2016-06-13, 19:38

That's, uh, not at all what that quote says. Unless I'm missing something then I'm assuming you took a daily caller headline at its face instead of reading the quotes therein.

by **Travis of the Cosmos** 2016-06-13, 19:40

We're talking about this part, right? That says that he thought that's. Not that they agreed. But that's his justification for saying some real bad stuff. They believed that he was just being a blowhard so they called it off- not that they thought his coworkers were just being racist.

Again unless I'm missing something.

“At the end of 10 months the investigation was closed with no further action. They took Mateen’s statements he was trying to taunt his coworkers because he thought he was being marginalized because of his Muslim faith.”

by **xsanguine** 2016-06-13, 19:44

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:We're talking about this part, right? That says that he thought that's. Not that they agreed. But that's his justification for saying some real bad stuff. They believed that he was just being a blowhard so they called it off- not that they thought his coworkers were just being racist.

Again unless I'm missing something.

“At the end of 10 months the investigation was closed with no further action. They took Mateen’s statements he was trying to taunt his coworkers because he thought he was being marginalized because of his Muslim faith.”

Yes, they called off the investigation because they took his statements as not serious and in response to his bigoted coworkers. Ergo... he's not serious, his co-workers are just racists, that's why he says those things.

by **Turtleneck** 2016-06-13, 19:46

LooseGoose wrote:Gun control nuts will try to exploit terrorism as usual, we need border control and profiling. I know profiling offends the lilies but there does seem to be one type of person that does this terror shit over and over. As a country we've decided being politically correct is more important than stopping terrorism.

LooseGoose wrote:
Vlad wrote:You can thank the gun lobby for that. They just don't like restrictions on their gun rights. I mean, what does "suspicion" mean, right? Could be just the big bad government sticking its nose where it doesn't belong. So yeah, this guy was allowed to get a gun.

Just to be clear - what other rights do you support removing on the basis of a list? A list which requires no accusation, no arrest, no conviction to appear on. A list that has been acknowledged to be riddled with errors.

It always amazes me that those people that are staunch defenders of rights and due process are ready to abrogate a right for someone else so easily.

Like you suggested doing on the first page of this thread.

You want to give the police the legal authority to treat all Muslims as suspects without probable cause, but then lecture us on rights? You tell us profiling is alright, but this list is an encroachment on our rights?

by **Travis of the Cosmos** 2016-06-13, 19:48

That's a stretch. Like, an award winning stretch. Come on dude.

Just because they stop investigating it doesn't mean that THEY thought the coworkers were being racist. It means that they thought HE thought the coworkers were being racist. They aren't agreeing with his opinion, just that he said bad things because he thought that. Again, not because they agree with the opinion that they were being racist.

by **xsanguine** 2016-06-13, 19:50

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:That's a stretch. Like, an award winning stretch. Come on dude.

Just because they stop investigating it doesn't mean that THEY thought the coworkers were being racist. It means that they thought HE thought the coworkers were being racist. They aren't agreeing with his opinion, just that he said bad things because he thought that. Again, not because they agree with the opinion that they were being racist.

If they're calling off a terror investigation due to that analysis then someone with say on that task force agrees with Mateen's reasoning for saying very serious things.

by **xsanguine** 2016-06-13, 19:51

Oops, I mean... that's not MY opinion, of course. I'm neutral and don't have an opinion on this issue.

by **Travis of the Cosmos** 2016-06-13, 19:55

No. That's not how that works. They don't have to agree with him. At all. I'm sorry, but that's idiotic.

Think of it this way. What if SRC were investigating me because I threatened to poop on the message board. He asks me why I said that. I say "because turtleneck is a jerk." He says "are you really going to poop on the message board?" I say "no, I just said that to make turtleneck mad. I was talking shit like an idiot." SRC then calls off the investigation.

He is not agreeing that turtleneck is a jerk and he has not disagreeing that turtleneck is a jerk. He has determined that there was no threat of pooping in the board, and the squabbles between two posters isn't what he is concerned about.

They were obviously incorrect to think that there was no threat, but it's not because they thought his coworkers were racists.

by **Travis of the Cosmos** 2016-06-13, 19:56

xsanguine wrote:Oops, I mean... that's not MY opinion, of course. I'm neutral and don't have an opinion on this issue.

You're going to have to get it through your skull at some point that I never said I was neutral on that issue. That's acknowledging that there is an issue. Which I did not do.

by **xsanguine** 2016-06-13, 20:00

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:No. That's not how that works. They don't have to agree with him. At all. I'm sorry, but that's idiotic.

Think of it this way. What if SRC were investigating me because I threatened to poop on the message board. He asks me why I said that. I say "because turtleneck is a jerk." He says "are you really going to poop on the message board?" I say "no, I just said that to make turtleneck mad. I was talking shit like an idiot." SRC then calls off the investigation.

He is not agreeing that turtleneck is a jerk and he has not disagreeing that turtleneck is a jerk. He has determined that there was no threat of pooping in the board, and the squabbles between two posters isn't what he is concerned about.

They were obviously incorrect to think that there was no threat, but it's not because they thought his coworkers were racists.

The implication... not one I am making, of course... but one that would be made is that if that's the excuse he is giving the FBI and they are buying that excuse then there must be some reason to believe that is true. They aren't going to just take Mateen's answer at face value. These guys are rumored to be pretty fucking good at determining if someone is lying to them and don't often get it wrong. The political climate playing a role in calling off a terror investigation based simply on what the target says is what I would imagine people who have this opinion would say.

by **xsanguine** 2016-06-13, 20:01

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:
xsanguine wrote:Oops, I mean... that's not MY opinion, of course. I'm neutral and don't have an opinion on this issue.

You're going to have to get it through your skull at some point that I never said I was neutral on that issue. That's acknowledging that there is an issue. Which I did not do.

Absolutely. And there's no issue here... simply just an article we're both reading. Not one that I'm providing as my opinion, though. I don't have a side here.

by **xsanguine** 2016-06-13, 20:09

Ex-colleague says shooter spewed racist, misogynist hate but wasn't fired because he was Muslim

Fox News wrote:On one occasion, Gilroy said, Mateen told him, "I would just like to kill all those [n-words]" after a conversation between Mateen and a black man. "A few times he mentioned homosexuals and Jewish people," Gilroy said, "but we didn't deal with them quite as often, so it was mostly women and blacks, because those were the people in front of us."

Gilroy told Florida Today that he complained to his superiors several times about Mateen, but they refused to take action because, Gilroy claimed, Mateen was Muslim. Gilroy said he quit G4S in 2015 after Mateen began sending him dozens of harassing text and phone messages per day.

Just gotta be high enough on the Official Victim Hierarchy©

by **Travis of the Cosmos** 2016-06-13, 20:11

xsanguine wrote:
Travis of the Cosmos wrote:No. That's not how that works. They don't have to agree with him. At all. I'm sorry, but that's idiotic.

Think of it this way. What if SRC were investigating me because I threatened to poop on the message board. He asks me why I said that. I say "because turtleneck is a jerk." He says "are you really going to poop on the message board?" I say "no, I just said that to make turtleneck mad. I was talking shit like an idiot." SRC then calls off the investigation.

He is not agreeing that turtleneck is a jerk and he has not disagreeing that turtleneck is a jerk. He has determined that there was no threat of pooping in the board, and the squabbles between two posters isn't what he is concerned about.

They were obviously incorrect to think that there was no threat, but it's not because they thought his coworkers were racists.

The implication... not one I am making, of course... but one that would be made is that if that's the excuse he is giving the FBI and they are buying that excuse then there must be some reason to believe that is true. They aren't going to just take Mateen's answer at face value. These guys are rumored to be pretty fucking good at determining if someone is lying to them and don't often get it wrong. The political climate playing a role in calling off a terror investigation based simply on what the target says is what I would imagine people who have this opinion would say.

It's entirely plausible that at the time it really was correct to abandon the investigation and that he wasn't going to do anything. But I am of the opinion that this had a hell of a lot more to do with hating gay people than it did with supporting terrorists.

by **xsanguine** 2016-06-13, 20:12

Travis of the Cosmos wrote:
xsanguine wrote:

The implication... not one I am making, of course... but one that would be made is that if that's the excuse he is giving the FBI and they are buying that excuse then there must be some reason to believe that is true. They aren't going to just take Mateen's answer at face value. These guys are rumored to be pretty fucking good at determining if someone is lying to them and don't often get it wrong. The political climate playing a role in calling off a terror investigation based simply on what the target says is what I would imagine people who have this opinion would say.

It's entirely plausible that at the time it really was correct to abandon the investigation and that he wasn't going to do anything. But I am of the opinion that this had a hell of a lot more to do with hating gay people than it did with supporting terrorists.

And what would be the source of his hatred for gay people?

Orlando nightclub shooter's dad condemns homosexuality in new video

Fox News wrote:The pro-Taliban father of the Orlando terrorist who slaughtered 49 people in a gay nightclub released a video Monday hours after the massacre saying, “God will punish those involved in homosexuality.”

IMAM: ‘DEATH’ TO GAYS: Hateful cleric preached in Fla. weeks before attack

Fox News wrote:A firebrand Muslim cleric noted for sermons calling for gay people to be executed reportedly preached at an Orlando-area mosque just weeks before a homegrown terrorist gunned down at least 49 people at a gay nightclub.

by **Travis of the Cosmos** 2016-06-13, 20:18

Didn't see that. Well, that's just straight fucked up. Probably not the best time guy.

by **Turtleneck** 2016-06-13, 20:38

xsanguine wrote:
Travis of the Cosmos wrote:

It's entirely plausible that at the time it really was correct to abandon the investigation and that he wasn't going to do anything. But I am of the opinion that this had a hell of a lot more to do with hating gay people than it did with supporting terrorists.

And what would be the source of his hatred for gay people?

Orlando nightclub shooter's dad condemns homosexuality in new video

Fox News wrote:The pro-Taliban father of the Orlando terrorist who slaughtered 49 people in a gay nightclub released a video Monday hours after the massacre saying, “God will punish those involved in homosexuality.”

IMAM: ‘DEATH’ TO GAYS: Hateful cleric preached in Fla. weeks before attack

Fox News wrote:A firebrand Muslim cleric noted for sermons calling for gay people to be executed reportedly preached at an Orlando-area mosque just weeks before a homegrown terrorist gunned down at least 49 people at a gay nightclub.

Plus, he probably ran into this guy at Walmart...

...or Maybe Ted Cruz's friend...

by **xsanguine** 2016-06-13, 20:40

Turtleneck wrote:
xsanguine wrote:

And what would be the source of his hatred for gay people?

Orlando nightclub shooter's dad condemns homosexuality in new video

IMAM: ‘DEATH’ TO GAYS: Hateful cleric preached in Fla. weeks before attack

Plus, he probably ran into this guy at Walmart...

...or Maybe Ted Cruz's friend...

I guarantee that's what it was.

That terroristic dude is a master of disguises, acting all Islamic-like rather than the Christian mass murderer he was!

by **Turtleneck** 2016-06-13, 20:44

xsanguine wrote:
Turtleneck wrote:

Plus, he probably ran into this guy at Walmart...

...or Maybe Ted Cruz's friend...

I guarantee that's what it was.

That terroristic dude is a master of disguises, acting all Islamic-like rather than the Christian mass murderer he was!

Not my point. Actually, I really wasn't trying to make much of a point other than the world is full of really hateful people.

I'll make you a deal. Don't both addressing me, and I will no longer address you. Sound good?

by **xsanguine** 2016-06-13, 20:48

Turtleneck wrote:
xsanguine wrote:

I guarantee that's what it was.

That terroristic dude is a master of disguises, acting all Islamic-like rather than the Christian mass murderer he was!

I'll make you a deal. Don't both addressing me, and I will no longer address you. Sound good?

Why?

by **Cym Jim** 2016-06-14, 01:37

xsanguine wrote:
Travis of the Cosmos wrote:

It's entirely plausible that at the time it really was correct to abandon the investigation and that he wasn't going to do anything. But I am of the opinion that this had a hell of a lot more to do with hating gay people than it did with supporting terrorists.

And what would be the source of his hatred for gay people?

Orlando nightclub shooter's dad condemns homosexuality in new video

Fox News wrote:The pro-Taliban father of the Orlando terrorist who slaughtered 49 people in a gay nightclub released a video Monday hours after the massacre saying, “God will punish those involved in homosexuality.”

IMAM: ‘DEATH’ TO GAYS: Hateful cleric preached in Fla. weeks before attack

Fox News wrote:A firebrand Muslim cleric noted for sermons calling for gay people to be executed reportedly preached at an Orlando-area mosque just weeks before a homegrown terrorist gunned down at least 49 people at a gay nightclub.

But you recently defended their right to this hate speech? Do you seriously believe inciting violence like this should be tolerated?

by **Cym Jim** 2016-06-14, 01:37

So sad:

1,000 mass shootings in 1,260 days

by **Robert J Sakimano** 2016-06-14, 07:56

Cym Jim wrote:So sad:

1,000 mass shootings in 1,260 days

thoughts and prayers seem to be working.

by **Watch Out Pylon!** 2016-06-14, 08:29

This bickering is exhausting. Nothing will happen. The left is calling for more gun regulations and mental health screening. The right is calling for a ban on Muslim immigrants. Our two presidential candidates are already drawing the lines.

Why can't we do all of this? Not banning immigrants. That's silly. But a more stringent vetting process before being allowed in the country? I can get behind that. Hiring more people to disseminate all of the surveillance we are acquiring would help as well.

I'm not expecting any rational discussion here. Just more yelling about how guns aren't the issue, Islam is a sickness and needs to be eradicated. See you guys back here in a few months for the next shooting incident.

by **Robert J Sakimano** 2016-06-14, 08:36

Watch Out Pylon! wrote:This bickering is exhausting. Nothing will happen. The left is calling for more gun regulations and mental health screening. The right is calling for a ban on Muslim immigrants. Our two presidential candidates are already drawing the lines.

Why can't we do all of this? Not banning immigrants. That's silly. But a more stringent vetting process before being allowed in the country? I can get behind that. Hiring more people to disseminate all of the surveillance we are acquiring would help as well.

I'm not expecting any rational discussion here. Just more yelling about how guns aren't the issue, Islam is a sickness and needs to be eradicated. See you guys back here in a few months for the next shooting incident.

a few months?

while I appreciate your optimism, the NRA, Republicans and thoughts and prayers are averaging about one mass shooting per day.

by Guest 2016-06-14, 08:42

Robert J Sakimano wrote:while I appreciate your optimism, the NRA, Republicans and thoughts and prayers are averaging about one mass shooting per day.

Yeah Bob....Gay Muslim Democrat terrorist threatened to kill his classmates.

When he was 10.

But NRA, Republicans or something. You continue to prove how blind you are to the facts of any situation as you parrot your favored bullshit.

Orlando shooter Omar Mateen 'threatened to bring a gun and kill students at his elementary school', former classmates reveal

by **Robert J Sakimano** 2016-06-14, 08:43

LooseGoose wrote:
Robert J Sakimano wrote:while I appreciate your optimism, the NRA, Republicans and thoughts and prayers are averaging about one mass shooting per day.

Yeah Bob....Gay Muslim Democrat terrorist threatened to kill his classmates.

When he was 10.

But NRA, Republicans or something. You continue to prove how blind you are to the facts of any situation as you parrot your favored bullshit.

Orlando shooter Omar Mateen 'threatened to bring a gun and kill students at his elementary school', former classmates reveal

the most important thing we can do is pray.

by Guest 2016-06-14, 08:52

Gay, Democrat, Muslim terrorist, ISIS warrior investigated by the FBI three times.

Hey, I know, let's blame guns, Republicans and Christians!

by **DWags** 2016-06-14, 09:00

The guy had mental problems.

He was either full of hate towards Gay People, or he was self loathing because he was Gay and thought it was against his religion and hated himself.

Oh, and he was able to get an automatic weapon in this country absolutely with no hassle even though he was on the FBI watch list cause ....... Merica!

by **Robert J Sakimano** 2016-06-14, 09:05

DWags wrote:The guy had mental problems.

He was either full of hate towards Gay People, or he was self loathing because he was Gay and thought it was against his religion and hated himself.

Oh, and he was able to get an automatic weapon in this country absolutely with no hassle even though he was on the FBI watch list cause ....... Merica!

I'm convinced this was about 3% ISIS (it was convenient to yell "Allah Akbar") and about 97% the act of a self-loathing closeted homosexual.

and, of course, an assault rifle. Because just in case thoughts and prayers don't work, make sure you have an assault rifle.

by **I.B. Fine** 2016-06-14, 09:06

by **Robert J Sakimano** 2016-06-14, 09:09

I.B. Fine wrote:
I.B. Fine wrote:Repressed homosexual snaps in fit of jealous rage to murder those living the life he secretly longs for using Islam as his justification.
Muslims rejoice.

Like I said...

+1

by **I.B. Fine** 2016-06-14, 09:10

I.B. Fine wrote:Repressed homosexual snaps in fit of jealous rage to murder those living the life he secretly longs for using Islam as his justification.
Muslims rejoice.

Like I said...
Multiple victims in a "mass shooting" at Orlando club. - Page 10 Ck59K6VWUAAZqh5

http://nypost.com/2016/06/13/shooter-used-to-visit-orlando-gay-club-use-gay-dating-apps/

by **NigelUno** 2016-06-14, 10:40

NigelUno wrote:
The_Dude wrote:

Once people like you realize 'passing laws' wont stop islamic terrorism, maybe we can move on to what really needs to be done.

How would you have prevented the latest incident? Please be specific.

Bump...

by **Turtleneck** 2016-06-14, 10:50

NigelUno wrote:
NigelUno wrote:

How would you have prevented the latest incident? Please be specific.

Bump...

by Guest 2016-06-14, 14:09

Stephen Miller ‏@redsteeze 19m19 minutes ago
Literally, Mickey Mouse is doing a better job keeping us safe than this administration and this federal government.

Karla RayVerified account ‏@KRayWFTV
#BREAKING- law enforcement source says Disney notified FBI the couple may have been casing Disney in April #WFTV

by **Watch Out Pylon!** 2016-06-14, 14:16

LooseGoose wrote:Stephen Miller ‏@redsteeze 19m19 minutes ago
Literally, Mickey Mouse is doing a better job keeping us safe than this administration and this federal government.

Karla RayVerified account ‏@KRayWFTV
#BREAKING- law enforcement source says Disney notified FBI the couple may have been casing Disney in April #WFTV

I'd like to hear Stephen Miller's thoughts on the previous administration's attempts to keep us safe.

by **Turtleneck** 2016-06-14, 14:23

LooseGoose wrote:Stephen Miller ‏@redsteeze 19m19 minutes ago
Literally, Mickey Mouse is doing a better job keeping us safe than this administration and this federal government.

Karla RayVerified account ‏@KRayWFTV
#BREAKING- law enforcement source says Disney notified FBI the couple may have been casing Disney in April #WFTV

What a shortsighted comment. You know what gets in the way, Loose? The Constitution. A lot of people are in a rush to do away with the few protections we have from the state so they can be made to feel safe. A whole lot of other people perceive every measure taken to bring about safety and order as an infringement on their civil liberties. Tell me how you balance that, Loose? The next administration is not going to make us safer.

by Guest 2016-06-14, 14:40

Turtleneck wrote:
LooseGoose wrote:Stephen Miller ‏@redsteeze 19m19 minutes ago
Literally, Mickey Mouse is doing a better job keeping us safe than this administration and this federal government.

Karla RayVerified account ‏@KRayWFTV
#BREAKING- law enforcement source says Disney notified FBI the couple may have been casing Disney in April #WFTV

What a shortsighted comment. You know what gets in the way, Loose? The Constitution. A lot of people are in a rush to do away with the few protections we have from the state so they can be made to feel safe. A whole lot of other people perceive every measure taken to bring about safety and order as an infringement on their civil liberties. Tell me how you balance that, Loose? The next administration is not going to make us safer.

I'm with ya on that. I got a snicker out of the comment. Sorry it offended you.

I've detested the Patriot Act since it was proposed but a lot of people happily signed their rights away to be "safer".

And again I find it interesting that my snarky comment triggers a lecture about giving away rights while other comments in here don't. But of course giving away 2nd amendment rights is the "right" thing to do.

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