POS Doctor Nassar will rot in jail forever

T Parker? You mean Trey Burke ?

CaptainSlow33 wrote:

Frank Drebin wrote:This is going to get really really ugly for MSU. Why the gymnastics coach isn't on administrative leave right now is beyond me. Hollis needs to get his shit together because he might not survive this.

I honestly don't think MSU is taking this seriously. Between LAKS's half-hearted response and Hollis not placing any of the employees involved on leave, a storm is brewing. This hasn't hit the front page yet, but when the story gets the right twist it will - MSU's refusal to lead from the front on this will be what guarantees that they look horrible once people start paying attention.

It's been on the front pages already, the News, Freep, MLive, ESPN......but....they haven't had any real red meat yet. Once solid information leaks out or is brought out in court the shit storm will hit.

LooseGoose wrote:

CaptainSlow33 wrote:

I honestly don't think MSU is taking this seriously. Between LAKS's half-hearted response and Hollis not placing any of the employees involved on leave, a storm is brewing. This hasn't hit the front page yet, but when the story gets the right twist it will - MSU's refusal to lead from the front on this will be what guarantees that they look horrible once people start paying attention.

It's been on the front pages already, the News, Freep, MLive, ESPN......but....they haven't had any real red meat yet. Once solid information leaks out or is brought out in court the shit storm will hit.

You guys don't think the Olympic gymnastic committee, or whatever they're called isn't the bigger target?

InTenSity wrote:

LooseGoose wrote:

It's been on the front pages already, the News, Freep, MLive, ESPN......but....they haven't had any real red meat yet. Once solid information leaks out or is brought out in court the shit storm will hit.

You guys don't think the Olympic gymnastic committee, or whatever they're called isn't the bigger target?

Depends on what they can get from his time with the Olympic team. He may have been on his best behavior with them, we'll have to wait and see. He was an employee of MSU for a long time, and it looks like he has a track record of complaints against him by students to MSU staff. MSU will get hardest, but the Olympic committee and the gymnastics club in DeWitt will get it. I see the in-state media focusing in more on the MSU angle, just because of how relevant it is to a good chunk of the state.

CaptainSlow33 wrote:

Frank Drebin wrote:This is going to get really really ugly for MSU. Why the gymnastics coach isn't on administrative leave right now is beyond me. Hollis needs to get his shit together because he might not survive this.

I honestly don't think MSU is taking this seriously. Between LAKS's half-hearted response and Hollis not placing any of the employees involved on leave, a storm is brewing. This hasn't hit the front page yet, but when the story gets the right twist it will - MSU's refusal to lead from the front on this will be what guarantees that they look horrible once people start paying attention.

I don't know about front page, but USA Today ran the story just two days about how Nassar deleted zilly files from his computer. The ordeal certainly isn't being ignored by the media.

Frank Drebin wrote:This is going to get really really ugly for MSU. Why the gymnastics coach isn't on administrative leave right now is beyond me. Hollis needs to get his shit together because he might not survive this.

this. w3 didn't place nassar on leave when this shit started 20 years ago, and we sure as shit arent doing anything different now. folks the sun is setting before our eyes. never hire a wolvie. never

Floyd Robertson wrote:

CaptainSlow33 wrote:

I honestly don't think MSU is taking this seriously. Between LAKS's half-hearted response and Hollis not placing any of the employees involved on leave, a storm is brewing. This hasn't hit the front page yet, but when the story gets the right twist it will - MSU's refusal to lead from the front on this will be what guarantees that they look horrible once people start paying attention.

I don't know about front page, but USA Today ran the story just two days about how Nassar deleted zilly files from his computer. The ordeal certainly isn't being ignored by the media.

yes it is. they too concerned with their trump vendetta. he's providing all the cover right now. msu should be thanking him constantly and giving him eour students immigration status and not fight dick

This is the one MAJOR difference between this case and PennState - it's reflected in questions 2&3. He was a Dr. and people could possibly believe the "treatments" he was giving were legit. Obviously nothing about Sandusky's "treatments" was legit. Hiding behind the "medical treatments" kept him off the hook for 20 years.


12 unanswered questions about the MSU doctor sex-abuse case

LooseGoose wrote:This is the one MAJOR difference between this case and PennState - it's reflected in questions 2&3. He was a Dr. and people could possibly believe the "treatments" he was giving were legit. Obviously nothing about Sandusky's "treatments" was legit. Hiding behind the "medical treatments" kept him off the hook for 20 years.


12 unanswered questions about the MSU doctor sex-abuse case

The big question will be how high up did the complaints about him go? If it went as high as an MSU coach and a couple trainers, MSU will come away from this with some minor embarrassment and a detailed plan for future cases which no one will probably read. If it can be shown that these complaints went higher, MSU will get its shit pushed in (though probably not as much as PSU, since it doesn't involve a high-profile sport...not saying that it makes it right, but that's just how the media is). No one seems to be digging too deep right now, so we'll see how it goes.

Guess it might come down to when these trainers and coaches tell their side of the story. And they will have incentive to make it look like they told someone else
and passed the buck up higher.

Herbie Green wrote:Guess it might come down to when these trainers and coaches tell their side of the story. And they will have incentive to make it look like they told someone else
and passed the buck up higher.

If the claims that we have read about so far are true (and no reason to believe they aren't) it sounds like the coaches and trainers didn't take the complaints seriously. It may not go much higher than that - still a black eye for the institution, but not as bad as it could be. Still, it is horrible that it happened in the first place.

If THIS story is true, though, it could make things much, much worse for the university...

http://www.lansingstatejournal.com/story/news/local/2017/01/27/court-filing-msu-official-told-athletes-not-discuss-nassar-police/97161034/

CaptainSlow33 wrote:

LooseGoose wrote:This is the one MAJOR difference between this case and PennState - it's reflected in questions 2&3.  He was a Dr. and people could possibly believe the "treatments" he was giving were legit.   Obviously nothing about Sandusky's "treatments" was legit.  Hiding behind the "medical treatments" kept him off the hook for 20 years.


12 unanswered questions about the MSU doctor sex-abuse case

The big question will be how high up did the complaints about him go?  If it went as high as an MSU coach and a couple trainers, MSU will come away from this with some minor embarrassment and a detailed plan for future cases which no one will probably read.  If it can be shown that these complaints went higher, MSU will get its shit pushed in (though probably not as much as PSU, since it doesn't involve a high-profile sport...not saying that it makes it right, but that's just how the media is).  No one seems to be digging too deep right now, so we'll see how it goes.

Oh I guarantee you that plenty of media are digging hard on this like you wouldn't believe.  Everyone wants to break the story if Hollis or LAKS had any knowledge at all.  This is the kind of thing that can make someone's career.

Herbie Green wrote:Guess it might come down to when these trainers and coaches tell their side of the story.  And they will have incentive to make it look like they told someone else
and passed the buck up higher.

Absolutely this.  And that's a little scary.  The trainers and coaches not only will have their careers on their line, but their freedom on the line.  They will undoubtedly claim that they did everything that they could, reporting this up the chain of command.  When that happens (and I'm sure it will, because once the trainers' names start to go public, they'll be scrambling to try to save some semblance of their reputation), let's be cautious to take their claims as fact.  I do not mean to say that these people will be lying if they claim they passed it along, but they have more incentive than anyone to pass the blame on, so we should require more than just what the accused say before stringing people up.

MSU leadership is taking this very seriously. The only thing that has surprised me is how long it took for LAKS to issue her boilerplate letter to all MSU employees and alumni. (Goose posted it in this thread).

Unless you believe no MSU coaches and assistant coaches passed on concerns about Nassar's "treatments" to their superiors and there was no communication USA Gymnastics, Twistars Gymnastics and MSU when all three groups had althletes complain and express concerns about Dr. Nassar, how could this be a surprise?

Too many people at MSU have been too quiet about Nassar for too long for this mess to be minor.

I'm very curious to find out, who knew, and when they knew it and what they ultimately did about it. Who finally went to the police to get this going? Who had enough and said this is wrong.

You guys who say the trainers and the coaches and the "official from the athletic department" all need to be fired, that is the starting point. If what is alleged ends up being true, I believe we're talking jail time for some of these people. Here is a story about a child that died in Detroit and the two social workers who had visited the home were charged with manslaughter. I'm not here saying the MSU officials and coaches approach that neglect, but I think it's going to be along similar lines in the eyes of the law IF THESE ALLEGATIONS are true. Everyone has an assumption of innocence first, but I'm pretty damn sure you are sworn by law to follow procedures as officials at the college levels. I know we were at the high school level.

Two state social workers have been charged with involuntary manslaughter, child abuse and more in connection with the death last spring of Detroit 3-year-old Aaron Minor, the Wayne County Prosecutor's Office announced today.

Elaina L. Brown, 24, and Kelly M. Williams, 47, both of Wayne County, were "grossly negligent and reckless in performing their duties" because they didn't properly follow up after visiting the child's home and finding that there was inadequate food in the house, according to a news release from the prosecutor's office.




I'd like an attorney's opinion on this.
what are the responsibilities of trainers, coaches and officials when any type of accusation comes to them and is it as neglectful as the state treated these social workers?

Not everyone is calling for heads unless its found that people sat on information.

Years ago, in Mid Michigan a young boy was killed by his foster or adopted mother an she led the police to believe she had no idea how the boy had died. Eventually she admitted to have killed him.

That child's death brought attention to the grossly underfunded, under staffed CPS and it took a Federal threat of losing funding for the state at reduce their case load.

The Detroit case mentioned could be the same issue.

After sexual harassment from Spartan band director, student does not return to campus

WTF?

EDIT: Maybe this is old news. I don't remember it and can't tell from the timeline.

Floyd Robertson wrote: After sexual harassment from Spartan band director, student does not return to campus

WTF?

EDIT: Maybe this is old news.  I don't remember it and can't tell from the timeline.

Seems to be fairly fresh.  

I guess I'm old fashioned here but the texts seem to fall short of sexual harassment.   That said, Madden should have known better than to even send them in today's world.

I think the punishment was appropriate - is sending these 5 texts enough to wreck a man's career and life?

It happened first on Nov. 10, 2015 at about 9:28 p.m. when he said, "When the season ends ... We're going ice skating! I'm an old hockey player!" and once more on Dec. 1, 2015 at about 8:07 p.m. when he asked, "Did I see you wearing Converse all-star high tops yesterday?" In a following text at 10:13 p.m., Madden told the student "You look good in them!" regarding the shoes.

Madden responded to the group photo via text message with "Blingy dress!! A+ I'm a fan. Yes ... Will be a good year,"

Maybe it is but I guess I'm not there.

Floyd Robertson wrote: After sexual harassment from Spartan band director, student does not return to campus

WTF?

EDIT: Maybe this is old news.  I don't remember it and can't tell from the timeline.

I read it in City Pulse yesterday - noticed it was from last fall, that he addressed the issue in an apology to the band, etc. I assumed it was common knowledge and buried in a thread somewhere. I guess it wasn't.

Pretty messed up and I feel so bad for the young lady involved. Would suck to have your college experience cut short because of the behavior of someone in an authority position who should know better.

Buckle up, buckaroos...


http://isportsweb.com/2017/02/09/attorney-michigan-state-community-brace-larry-nassar-fallout/

CaptainSlow33 wrote:Buckle up, buckaroos...


http://isportsweb.com/2017/02/09/attorney-michigan-state-community-brace-larry-nassar-fallout/

So many things don't add up to me but whatever, let the judicial system play it all out.

Herbie Green wrote:Guess it might come down to when these trainers and coaches tell their side of the story. And they will have incentive to make it look like they told someone else
and passed the buck up higher.

first they need to be identified. second, msu will offer them a huge buyout to shut up and take the fall. that's hollis and laks plan, anyway.

DWags wrote:

CaptainSlow33 wrote:

At this point, it sounds like it could get bad because people at MSU were made aware. Now as people dig deeper, we find out if it was passed along to their superiors or if it ended there. If the coaches and trainers passed it up the chain, this gets messy and the institution starts to get its shit pushed in. If they blew the reports off, fire them (assuming they are still with the university).

Talking jail time, not firing.

fwiw, if the feds come in and jail time is on the table, people will talk. see unc african studies program for that.

GRR Spartan wrote:MSU leadership is taking this very seriously. The only thing that has surprised me is how long it took for LAKS to issue her boilerplate letter to all MSU employees and alumni. (Goose posted it in this thread).

Unless you believe no MSU coaches and assistant coaches passed on concerns about Nassar's "treatments" to their superiors and there was no communication USA Gymnastics, Twistars Gymnastics and MSU when all three groups had althletes complain and express concerns about Dr. Nassar, how could this be a surprise?

Too many people at MSU have been too quiet about Nassar for too long for this mess to be minor.

laks already screwed bc she's admitting that msu didnt take action when the title IX office was notified in 2014. they are using 2016 as the barometer, but that's only because the news came from the outside. msu failed completely internally, and people need to go. period. they simply do not personally valu3 student safety and are child molester apologist.

GRR Spartan wrote:Not everyone is calling for heads unless its found that people sat on information.

Years ago, in Mid Michigan a young boy was killed by his foster or adopted mother an she led the police to believe she had no idea how the boy had died. Eventually she admitted to have killed him.

That child's death brought attention to the grossly underfunded, under staffed CPS and it took a Federal threat of losing funding for the state at reduce their case load.

The Detroit case mentioned could be the same issue.

apples and oranges. msu is clearly well funded. the other is still an issue

LooseGoose wrote:

Floyd Robertson wrote: After sexual harassment from Spartan band director, student does not return to campus

WTF?

EDIT: Maybe this is old news.  I don't remember it and can't tell from the timeline.

Seems to be fairly fresh.  

I guess I'm old fashioned here but the texts seem to fall short of sexual harassment.   That said, Madden should have known better than to even send them in today's world.

I think the punishment was appropriate - is sending these 5 texts enough to wreck a man's career and life?

It happened first on Nov. 10, 2015 at about 9:28 p.m. when he said, "When the season ends ... We're going ice skating! I'm an old hockey player!" and once more on Dec. 1, 2015 at about 8:07 p.m. when he asked, "Did I see you wearing Converse all-star high tops yesterday?" In a following text at 10:13 p.m., Madden told the student "You look good in them!" regarding the shoes.

Madden responded to the group photo via text message with "Blingy dress!! A+ I'm a fan. Yes ... Will be a good year,"

Maybe it is but I guess I'm not there.

this snowflake sounds like bobs daughter. i avoided chicks like this like the plague...

Floyd Robertson wrote:

CaptainSlow33 wrote:

I honestly don't think MSU is taking this seriously.  Between LAKS's half-hearted response and Hollis not placing any of the employees involved on leave, a storm is brewing.  This hasn't hit the front page yet, but when the story gets the right twist it will - MSU's refusal to lead from the front on this will be what guarantees that they look horrible once people start paying attention.

I don't know about front page, but USA Today ran the story just two days about how Nassar deleted  zilly files from his computer.  The ordeal certainly isn't being ignored by the media.

It's way worse than that.

The agent also testified that Nassar's work laptop had been wiped clean before he gave it to MSU after the university fired him in September.

If there's any chance he used his work laptop on MSU's network to access child porn MSU is completely f-cked. MSU has a duty to monitor computer network access and usage, especially as a government, taxpayer-funded institution. Nobody should be able to freely access child porn from MSU's network without getting flagged. If he did, and wasn't flagged, MSU should just go bankrupt now.

Even if he didn't use the laptop on MSU's network to access child porn, if he used the laptop at all to access child porn MSU may still be on the hook. For example, if he turned in his laptop to MSU for repair or an upgrade, MSU has a responsibility to examine his computer to make sure its being used properly before handing it back to him. (the computer is Government/Taxpayer property, and doing this kind of internet history search is simple enough a 4th grader can do it, plus there's a zilly programs out there that monitor/audit computer).

Bottom line, if he did anything on MSU property, or using MSU property, the technology exists for MSU to catch it. If MSU didn't catch it, oh boy. Watch out.

CampbellHall wrote:

Floyd Robertson wrote:

I don't know about front page, but USA Today ran the story just two days about how Nassar deleted  zilly files from his computer.  The ordeal certainly isn't being ignored by the media.

It's way worse than that.

The agent also testified that Nassar's work laptop had been wiped clean before he gave it to MSU after the university fired him in September.

If there's any chance he used his work laptop on MSU's network to access child porn MSU is completely f-cked. MSU has a duty to monitor computer network access and usage, especially as a government, taxpayer-funded institution. Nobody should be able to freely access child porn from MSU's network without getting flagged. If he did, and wasn't flagged, MSU should just go bankrupt now.

Even if he didn't use the laptop on MSU's network to access child porn, if he used the laptop at all to access child porn MSU may still be on the hook. For example, if he turned in his laptop to MSU for repair or an upgrade, MSU has a responsibility to examine his computer to make sure its being used properly before handing it back to him. (the computer is Government/Taxpayer property, and doing this kind of internet history search is simple enough a 4th grader can do it, plus there's a zilly programs out there that monitor/audit computer).

Bottom line, if he did anything on MSU property, or using MSU property, the technology exists for MSU to catch it. If MSU didn't catch it, oh boy. Watch out.

this. msu enabled a child molester. period. you all need to come to terms with it like i did 2 months ago. you can countinue on the penn state route or stand with me and my zero tolerance stance

CampbellHall wrote:

Floyd Robertson wrote:

I don't know about front page, but USA Today ran the story just two days about how Nassar deleted  zilly files from his computer.  The ordeal certainly isn't being ignored by the media.

It's way worse than that.

The agent also testified that Nassar's work laptop had been wiped clean before he gave it to MSU after the university fired him in September.

If there's any chance he used his work laptop on MSU's network to access child porn MSU is completely f-cked. MSU has a duty to monitor computer network access and usage, especially as a government, taxpayer-funded institution. Nobody should be able to freely access child porn from MSU's network without getting flagged. If he did, and wasn't flagged, MSU should just go bankrupt now.

Even if he didn't use the laptop on MSU's network to access child porn, if he used the laptop at all to access child porn MSU may still be on the hook. For example, if he turned in his laptop to MSU for repair or an upgrade, MSU has a responsibility to examine his computer to make sure its being used properly before handing it back to him. (the computer is Government/Taxpayer property, and doing this kind of internet history search is simple enough a 4th grader can do it, plus there's a zilly programs out there that monitor/audit computer).

Bottom line, if he did anything on MSU property, or using MSU property, the technology exists for MSU to catch it. If MSU didn't catch it, oh boy. Watch out.

This. While MSU was printing off "Spartans Will" banners at a furious pace to wallpaper campus, a child molester was operating right under their nose. If there was any system in place to catch this that failed, MSU should get plastered every bit as bad as PSU. I don't think the full details of what law enforcement knows has come out yet, but when it does I have a feeling dark days are ahead for the university.

CaptainSlow33 wrote:

CampbellHall wrote:

It's way worse than that.

The agent also testified that Nassar's work laptop had been wiped clean before he gave it to MSU after the university fired him in September.

If there's any chance he used his work laptop on MSU's network to access child porn MSU is completely f-cked. MSU has a duty to monitor computer network access and usage, especially as a government, taxpayer-funded institution. Nobody should be able to freely access child porn from MSU's network without getting flagged. If he did, and wasn't flagged, MSU should just go bankrupt now.

Even if he didn't use the laptop on MSU's network to access child porn, if he used the laptop at all to access child porn MSU may still be on the hook. For example, if he turned in his laptop to MSU for repair or an upgrade, MSU has a responsibility to examine his computer to make sure its being used properly before handing it back to him. (the computer is Government/Taxpayer property, and doing this kind of internet history search is simple enough a 4th grader can do it, plus there's a zilly programs out there that monitor/audit computer).

Bottom line, if he did anything on MSU property, or using MSU property, the technology exists for MSU to catch it. If MSU didn't catch it, oh boy. Watch out.

This. While MSU was printing off "Spartans Will" banners at a furious pace to wallpaper campus, a child molester was operating right under their nose. If there was any system in place to catch this that failed, MSU should get plastered every bit as bad as PSU. I don't think the full details of what law enforcement knows has come out yet, but when it does I have a feeling dark days are ahead for the university.

hence th3 reason msu wants to use their own police....to cover this up. clearly

this. msu enabled a child molester. period. you all need to come to terms with it like i did 2 months ago. you can countinue on the penn state route or stand with me and my zero tolerance stance

It is a sad day in my message board life when I completely agree with Blanch

Wally Fairway wrote:

this. msu enabled a child molester. period. you all need to come to terms with it like i did 2 months ago. you can countinue on the penn state route or stand with me and my zero tolerance stance

It is a sad day in my message board life when I completely agree with Blanch

Definitely gives your posting career resume a hit. We have to dock points, I am truly sorry. You can make up for it by winning the pick'em this coming season.

Blanch32 wrote:hence th3 reason msu wants to use their own police....to cover this up. clearly

The only person that might think that would work would be an Einstein level thinker like yourself.

We need this to play every time we read a Blanch post:

Wally Fairway wrote:

this. msu enabled a child molester. period. you all need to come to terms with it like i did 2 months ago. you can countinue on the penn state route or stand with me and my zero tolerance stance

It is a sad day in my message board life when I completely agree with Blanch

Seriously, how can any rationale adult not agree with me on this? the real sad reality is that my made up The Dowager Lady Margret, Countess and Prefict of Northumbria is actually a real thing, and not just a fabrication of my own mind. nassar confirms it is the opposite of a delusion

LooseGoose wrote:

Blanch32 wrote:hence th3 reason msu wants to use their own police....to cover this up. clearly

The only person that might think that would work would be an Einstein level thinker like yourself.

msu doesn't have the tools to find kiddie porn on their computers. of course they dont want anyone with better resources and technology to find it

Just keep responding to the post above Blanch's last post Death Roe.

What's worse than being ignored? Knowing its on purpose.

You guys will hate what I just heard. This is what will make it difficult. The procedure he was using is considered an acceptable medical at least inside MSU and the medical field. Basically a family member who knows a separate coach at MSU that isn't involved days the procedure is common.

InTenSity wrote:You guys will hate what I just heard. This is what will make it difficult. The procedure he was using is considered an acceptable medical at least inside MSU and the medical field. Basically a family member who knows a separate coach at MSU that isn't involved days the procedure is common.

Which is what some of the early complainants were told. As I said in a post somewhere in this thread, him being a Dr is what makes this different from Sandusky. He legitimately had a reason to be seeing these girls. I still find it hard to believe that's a legit treatment though.

Em if you have a daughter who has both a gynecologist and chiropractor and that's never been done or if it has and no other nurse or aid is in the room then you send your kid to MSU and a team doctor does that with no aid present it's a problem