The 2020 Presidential campaign.

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Conversely... Snowflakes in Lansing.
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AvgMSUJoe wrote:Conversely... Snowflakes in Lansing.
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People should be showing MAGA’s “Fuck your feelings” flags right now.

So. The Antrim county thing seems credible guys.

Unless someone can point me to an admission that this was a data entry error and not a software issue, this thing will have legs.

Rocinante wrote:So. The Antrim county thing seems credible guys.

I haven’t looked/read into anything on it yet.
But I know most on the left agree, that if there is some voter fraud going on, it needs to be corrected, prosecuted, fixed, etc. And whatever results are what it is , and we accept it.

You just can’t scream it everywhere all the time because you don’t like the results.

Rocinante wrote:Unless someone can point me to an admission that this was a data entry error and not a software issue, this thing will have legs.

Both the software company and the Antrim County clerk say it was human error, not software. Not that it is stopping, or will stop, Trump from claiming that every Biden vote in the country is fraudulent.

It turns out the mistake was an isolated incident linked to human error.

Kentwood-based ElectionSource, which created the election management software used in Antrim County, said in a Friday afternoon statement that said its program “performed exactly and accurately.” It also provided a statement from the Antrim County Clerk confirming the problem was a change made to the ballot by the clerk’s office.

“The Clerk’s Office has traced the cause of the original errors on the posted unofficial election results. Late in the election preparation process, a minor correction was made to a ballot that caused additional compounding changes to how the software totals and presented the data. The skewed unofficial results were a result of procedural misunderstanding that the Clerk’s Office had never before experienced. At no point did these skewed, unofficial results have any bearing on the Official numbers currently being reviewed by the Board of Canvassers. Both the Antrim County Clerk and ElectionSource have taken steps to adjust policies and procedures to ensure that a similar situation does not happen in the future.

“We continue to work hard to ensure the integrity of the election results, and we will learn and grow from this experience.”

ANTRIM COUNTY CLERK SHERYL GUY VIA

https://www.woodtv.com/news/elections/antrim-co-vote-count-problem-was-ballot-change-not-software/

I don’t think this is a “fraud” issue. And it was corrected, but without full disclosure about what happened and that it’s not happening in other places, it’s a ripe story for disinformation.

Edit: thank you Miami. I think there is still an opportunity to nip this. Democrats should.

I think you're being paranoid Roc. No one with an ounce of sanity is giving any credence to Trump's claims.

Obviously his cult is outside of that Venn diagram. His cult is a relatively small percentage of that 70m.

Rocinante wrote:I don’t think this is a “fraud” issue. And it was corrected, but without full disclosure about what happened and that it’s not happening in other places, it’s a ripe story for disinformation.

Edit: thank you Miami. I think there is still an opportunity to nip this. Democrats should.

Yeah, and I'm sure it is being fully investigated, as it should be, even beyond what the clerk and software company say. Recount the state, that's fine. If it is a massive issue that flips 150k+ votes, so be it. Trump would still need all three of GA, NV, and AZ to flip, which isn't likely. But it would embolden him to spout more nonsense.

Have you guys read about this Four Seasons stuff? Been trying to distract myself from the game. Anyway...

First Trump tweeted that there would be a major press conference with his lawyers at the Four Seasons in Philadelphia.

Then he tweeted "Four Seasons Landscaping"

Then he finally got it right, that there was a press conference with his lawyers at Four Seasons Total Landscaping. Yes, at an actual landscaping business in Philadelphia.

This tweet has a picture of the press conference set up. This is bizarre.

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Stacie Abrams better have some great cabinet position or leader of the Democratic Party. She knows what she’s doing.

Remember when Trump would say there's no enthusiasm for Biden, that he can't draw crowds, etc.? Yeah, Donny, turn on the TV and see the enthusiasm. Veteran reporters are all saying they've never seen anything like this for a political race.

Yeah, the enthusiasm is as much anti-Trump as anything. So I guess he is really good at pissing the libs off. And after all, that's the real job of a President, right pantry?

MiamiSpartan wrote:Trump is, of course, begging for money to support his legal challenges. But if you plan on donating (because I know you guys will be), be aware that according to the fine print only 50% goes toward the recount fund. The other 50% goes toward his campaign's debt retirement.

But he could have raised more money than Biden if he wanted to.

Regarding the above, it occurred to me that with the frivolous nature of so many of these lawsuits, and several being thrown out (in some cases virtually laughed out) of court already, I can't help but wonder how much of the lawsuits they think they have an actual case with, and how many are just fundraising efforts to pay down the campaign's debt with the other half of their haul? If Trump accepts defeat, no one is going to donate just to help a lost campaign. This is the only way he can raise money to pay the debt.

I just thought of something. Hillary Clinton wasn’t a good presidential candidate but she was a pretty damn good SOS.

Just spitballing.

That confirmation would be a fucking nightmare.

Cameron wrote:That confirmation would be a fucking nightmare.

Meh... She passed once. Plus, win Georgia and fuck the Rs.

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Home run.

AvgMSUJoe wrote:

Cameron wrote:That confirmation would be a fucking nightmare.

Meh... She passed once. Plus, win Georgia and fuck the Rs.

No way. They need to distance themselves from Clinton if they want Harris elected in 2024. Biden is a one term president.

Dendrobates wrote:Stacie Abrams better have some great cabinet position or leader of the Democratic Party. She knows what she’s doing.

She is very well thought of - but may be the most underrated person in the Democratic party.  When she lost the Georgia's Governors race to the actual ballot fuckery that Trump likes to falsely complain about - she did not go away.  She has spent the last two years building a tremendous minority voting base not only in Georgia but in most of the battleground states.  She IS the reason Biden won Georgia.  Now she is turning her attention to the two senator races there and because of that I like the Dems chances.

I have no doubt that she will have a major role in the Biden administration.

MSU addict wrote:

Dendrobates wrote:Stacie Abrams better have some great cabinet position or leader of the Democratic Party. She knows what she’s doing.

She is very well thought of - but may be the most underrated person in the Democratic party.  When she lost the Georgia's Governors race to the actual ballot fuckery that Trump likes to falsely complain about - she did not go away.  She has spent the last two years building a tremendous minority voting base not only in Georgia but in most of the battleground states.  She IS the reason Biden won Georgia.  Now she is turning her attention to the two senator races there and because of that I like the Dems chances.

I have no doubt that she will have a major role in the Biden administration.

I'd say Abrams should be DNC chair rather than any cabinet position. She's clearly shown she can recruit/get out the vote.

Heat Miser wrote:

MSU addict wrote:
She is very well thought of - but may be the most underrated person in the Democratic party.  When she lost the Georgia's Governors race to the actual ballot fuckery that Trump likes to falsely complain about - she did not go away.  She has spent the last two years building a tremendous minority voting base not only in Georgia but in most of the battleground states.  She IS the reason Biden won Georgia.  Now she is turning her attention to the two senator races there and because of that I like the Dems chances.

I have no doubt that she will have a major role in the Biden administration.

I'd say Abrams should be DNC chair rather than any cabinet position. She's clearly shown she can recruit/get out the vote.

She is multi-talented, incredibly smart and she is simply a doer.  

She actively sought to be the vice president.  I think big things are in her future.  I could see as a major part of the administration then running for Governor in Georgia again.  I do think she will run for President in the future.

MSU addict wrote:

Heat Miser wrote:

MSU addict wrote:
She is very well thought of - but may be the most underrated person in the Democratic party.  When she lost the Georgia's Governors race to the actual ballot fuckery that Trump likes to falsely complain about - she did not go away.  She has spent the last two years building a tremendous minority voting base not only in Georgia but in most of the battleground states.  She IS the reason Biden won Georgia.  Now she is turning her attention to the two senator races there and because of that I like the Dems chances.

I have no doubt that she will have a major role in the Biden administration.

I'd say Abrams should be DNC chair rather than any cabinet position. She's clearly shown she can recruit/get out the vote.

She is multi-talented, incredibly smart and she is simply a doer.  

She actively sought to be the vice president.  I think big things are in her future.  I could see as a major part of the administration then running for Governor in Georgia again.  I do think she will run for President in the future.

Agreed on your first sentence. Her actual government experience is 10 years in the Georgia state house. I hesitate to have Biden suck away all the talent from the House/Senate/bench for the admin & leave those vacated positions vulnerable in the future.

Peeps in the admin have to focus on admin. Somebody has to remain focused on the party. Republicans have proven to be very good at that historically. Dems have not.

I'd love to see Abrams as DNC chair or run for governor of Georgia again. For the next 2 months though, we need her laser focused on those 2 senate seats.

MiamiSpartan wrote:Have you guys read about this Four Seasons stuff? Been trying to distract myself from the game. Anyway...

First Trump tweeted that there would be a major press conference with his lawyers at the Four Seasons in Philadelphia.

Then he tweeted "Four Seasons Landscaping"

Then he finally got it right, that there was a press conference with his lawyers at Four Seasons Total Landscaping. Yes, at an actual landscaping business in Philadelphia.

This tweet has a picture of the press conference set up. This is bizarre.

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Just read up on it. Fuckin hilarious.

You're gonna see Trump protest rallies just like you saw campaign rallies. I'd bet even money he, at some point, suggests they take to the streets.

kingstonlake wrote:You're gonna see Trump protest rallies just like you saw campaign rallies. I'd bet even money he, at some point, suggests they take to the streets.

he will charge an entry fee... And it won't last too long.

AvgMSUJoe wrote:

kingstonlake wrote:You're gonna see Trump protest rallies just like you saw campaign rallies. I'd bet even money he, at some point, suggests they take to the streets.

he will charge an entry fee... And it won't last too long.

Needs to pay down his campaign debt, in addition to personal debt somehow.

Apparently, per ABC, the donations he's asking for to help with his election cases, now state in the fine print that 60% of the donation (up from 50% a couple of days ago) will go toward paying down the campaign's debt. Makes it feel like his legal challenges, which even his legal team has privately called pointless and meritless, is nothing but a fundraising campaign.

AvgMSUJoe wrote:he will charge an entry fee... And it won't last too long.

Trump puts everything through the lens of how he can benefit financially. Legal challenges and recounts will result in nothing, but he can raise money in the meantime and undermining the Biden administration is 100% on-brand. So what is next for him seems kind of clear - commodify what he's been doing. Sure....pay to attend a rally. And the platform of the White House needs to be replaced. His TV background here means we're likely to see Trump TV. He has been expressing disappointment in Fox and he wants to be a new right-wing player. So he'll broadcast rallies, have an outlet for his voice while creating a platform for Ivanka and Don Jr. to inherit the platform while using this power to control the GOP in 2024.

Give Trump credit - claiming victory, fighting in courts, refusing to accept defeat, undermining the Biden administration, etc - is 100% on brand. I think he has three goals - make money off this, plan a return to power and/or ensure this is all inheritable for Ivanka and Don. Jr.

It's fucking wild how some people - some even somewhat intelligent, some not - believe the voting fraud stuff straight from the mouth of perhaps the biggest single liar in politics ever. I mean I guess I can't prove that explicitly but when everything you say and tweet is so riddled with lies that even your supporters openly acknowledge it and shrug it off as part of your "charm", he's gotta be up there. Now all of a sudden those same supporters believe he is telling the truth, without a single shred of evidence? And all kinds of circumstantial evidence to the contrary such as Republican led legislatures in some of the places in question, Republicans involved in the process stating there were no issues with fraud, and the pause in logic one must undertake to believe that somehow some ovals on the ballots were subjected to fraud while others weren't. It's really just people wanting to believe in the outcome that they wanted to see happen, blindly and emotionally.

Why those people are so entrenched in seeing the reelection of a man who is an acknowledged serial liar, racist, accused sexual predator, who hasn't kept or delivered on any promises over the course of 4 years, and who has us 8 months into the worst Global pandemic since 1918 without a semblance of a national strategy other than lying - is another story.

Yup, there is as much confirmation bias among Trump fans, as there is with antineplastons and his conspiracy theories. And then when presented with hard evidence against your position, just cry, "FAKE". Look no further than pantry's posts for evidence of this. Accept what known Russian agent, Rudy Giuliani says about Hunter's laptop, but when multiple sources from all of the world report on Russian bounties against US troops, "FAKE!"

https://www.freep.com/story/news/politics/elections/2020/11/08/election-misinformation-michigan-vote-antrim-county/6209693002/

Reads as completely biased to me.

kingstonlake wrote:You're gonna see Trump protest rallies just like you saw campaign rallies. I'd bet even money he, at some point, suggests they take to the streets.

This was about an hour ago.

Re: The 2020 Presidential campaign.

That's a talking point until you read that the issues in Antrim County were caused by people in the County Clerk's office, not the software produced by Election Source HQ'ed in Kentwwod, MI.

From the Election Source Nov 6 press release:

“The Clerk’s Office has traced the cause of the original errors on the posted unofficial election results. Late in the election preparation process, a minor correction was made to a ballot that caused additional compounding changes to how the software totals and presented the data. The skewed unofficial results were a result of procedural misunderstanding that the Clerk’s Office had never before experienced. At no point did these skewed, unofficial results have any bearing on the Official numbers currently being reviewed by the Board of Canvassers. Both the Antrim County Clerk and ElectionSource have taken steps to adjust policies and procedures to ensure that a similar situation does not happen in the future. “We continue to work hard to ensure the integrity of the election results, and we will learn and grow from this experience.” said Sheryl Guy, Antrim County Clerk

https://electionsource.com/blogs/news/antrim-press-release

It’s going to be fun watching the 2nd meltdown when they realize that it’s actually real and that Joe Biden actually won.

Motown Spartan wrote:It’s going to be fun watching the 2nd meltdown when they realize that it’s actually real and that Joe Biden actually won.

They will never admit defeat. They need to protect their fragile egos... If you get off on someone else's pain your maturity isn't to a level which allows that introspection.

(Ie, get a D cause the teacher hates me... Loose the game because screwed from the refs, etc etc etc.)

AvgMSUJoe wrote:

Motown Spartan wrote:It’s going to be fun watching the 2nd meltdown when they realize that it’s actually real and that Joe Biden actually won.

They will never admit defeat. They need to protect their fragile egos... If you get off on someone else's pain your maturity isn't to a level which allows that introspection.

(Ie, get a D cause the teacher hates me... Loose the game because screwed from the refs, etc etc etc.)

So they're the Michigan fans of politics.

So when will the racist,  bigoted christian sexual predator start holding white supremacist rallies to soothe is fragile, loser ego?

Robert J Sakimano wrote:So when will the racist,  bigoted christian sexual predator start holding white supremacist rallies to soothe is fragile, loser ego?

Probably not too far off. Clear the GOP is still terrified of his cult and I suspect he will be off to the side controlling the GOP for some years to come. I also think he’s going to hang in there to the end of this trying to incite his base and do every thing he can to steal it. Good times.

Motown Spartan wrote:It’s going to be fun watching the 2nd meltdown when they realize that it’s actually real and that Joe Biden actually won.

He’s going to act like UofM and walk off the field with no hand shake.